RA Journals – 11th Assembly

RA Transcript from Chat 06.28.09
by Soro Dagostino » Mon Jun 29, 2009 9:28 am
Here is yesterday’s transcript from my Chat Log of the RA Meeting. May we please get a recorder that works and is always there for the RA Meetings?

RA Meeting Transcript 06/28/2009

Add at end of Article I, Section 1 (The Representative Assembly): “The RA approves merger agreements with other communities.”

Add at end of Article I, Section 2 (The Representative Assembly Body): “The RA may be supplemented with interim additional representatives, freely chosen by a community joining the CDS.”

Add at end of Article II, Section 2 (c) (Powers of The Chancellor): “and to enter into merger discussions with other communities”
[2009/06/28 9:44] Patroklus Murakami: soro, i’m not aware of any amendment of my amendment! what were you referring to?
[2009/06/28 9:44] Soro Dagostino: Pat –you said it was a chnge in the forum.
[2009/06/28 9:45] Patroklus Murakami: apologies. indeed, this is a new amendment given that the other one failed
[2009/06/28 9:45] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes.
[2009/06/28 9:45] Patroklus Murakami: shall i introduce it now?
[2009/06/28 9:45] Gwyneth Llewelyn would like to have Pat introduce it too, if possible.
[2009/06/28 9:45] Soro Dagostino: It is that time.
[2009/06/28 9:46] Patroklus Murakami: okay, well this constitutional amendment is a very minimal affair
[2009/06/28 9:46] Jamie Palisades: the “other one” being the 7 day one that SOnja and CSDF voted down?> just checking
[2009/06/28 9:46] Jamie Palisades: (sorry)
[2009/06/28 9:46] Patroklus Murakami: it is intended to enable the merger with al andalus to proceed smoothly and ensure the AA reps can join the RA
[2009/06/28 9:47] Soro Dagostino: Please state the motion
[2009/06/28 9:47] Patroklus Murakami: it also provides for a very minimal framework for future expansions based on the recent experience with AA
[2009/06/28 9:47] Soro Dagostino: Then we can discuss.
[2009/06/28 9:47] Patroklus Murakami: i move we discuss the amendment
[2009/06/28 9:47] Pip Torok: seconded
[2009/06/28 9:48] Sonja Strom: aye
[2009/06/28 9:48] Pip Torok: aye
[2009/06/28 9:48] Soro Dagostino: In favor.
[2009/06/28 9:48] Soro Dagostino: Opposed?
[2009/06/28 9:49] Jamie Palisades: I;m confused? the vote is to open debvate?
[2009/06/28 9:49] Jamie Palisades: do you DO that here?
[2009/06/28 9:49] Soro Dagostino: Yes
[2009/06/28 9:49] Pip Torok: yes jamie
[2009/06/28 9:49] Jamie Palisades smiles, shrugs
[2009/06/28 9:49] Weston Lane is Online
[2009/06/28 9:49] Sonja Strom: Soro does
[2009/06/28 9:50] IM: Jamie Palisades:
[2009/06/28 9:50] Patroklus Murakami: shall i carry on?
[2009/06/28 9:50] Pip Torok: (please!)
[2009/06/28 9:50] Soro Dagostino: The proponent has te loor
[2009/06/28 9:50] Patroklus Murakami: well, the motion is a minimal way of getting us to where we want to be
[2009/06/28 9:51] Soro Dagostino: floor*
[2009/06/28 9:51] Patroklus Murakami: the first and third parts reflect what has actually happened. the RA approved a merger proposal developed by the Chancellor
[2009/06/28 9:51] Patroklus Murakami: hopefully, that is uncontroversial
[2009/06/28 9:51] Patroklus Murakami: the middle part is the most essential part though
[2009/06/28 9:52] Patroklus Murakami: our Constitution currently defines the RA as a body of democratically elected factions
[2009/06/28 9:52] Patroklus Murakami: it has some very involved rules about how to conduct elections and choose reps
[2009/06/28 9:52] Patroklus Murakami: none of this will apply to the AA reps joining us so, it seems to me, we need to make amendments to accomodate this
[2009/06/28 9:53] Patroklus Murakami: we have some discussion on previous proposals about the need (or not) for democratic elections to find additional interim reps
[2009/06/28 9:53] Jamie Palisades raises hand for a question, when it;s time
[2009/06/28 9:53] Patroklus Murakami: i hope that using the language from the UDHR will work for AA and for future mergers
[2009/06/28 9:54] Soro Dagostino: Noted
[2009/06/28 9:54] Patroklus Murakami: from the description of the process of choosing AAs reps it seems clear to me that they will be ‘freely chosen’ by the citizens of AA
[2009/06/28 9:54] Patroklus Murakami: so this amendment would cover the upcoming merger
[2009/06/28 9:55] Patroklus Murakami: it also sets the framework for future mergers i.e. the expectation that this will remain a democratic body that reflects the will of the citizens
[2009/06/28 9:55] Patroklus Murakami: that’s all for now, happy to answer questions if anyone has them
[2009/06/28 9:55] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (note the use of “chosen” and “representatives” on the UDHR: Article 21.

(1) Everyone has the right to take part in the government of his country, directly or through freely chosen representatives.
(2) Everyone has the right of equal access to public service in his country.
(3) The will of the people shall be the basis of the authority of government; this will shall be expressed in periodic and genuine elections which shall be by universal and equal suffrage and shall be held by secret vote or by equivalent free voting procedures.)
[2009/06/28 9:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn also signs in to speak
[2009/06/28 9:57] Soro Dagostino: I believe Jaime had the floor next
[2009/06/28 9:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, he does!
[2009/06/28 9:57] Soro Dagostino: Jamie
[2009/06/28 9:57] Jamie Palisades: I will have a comment myself, and for that am content to wait until after the RA members, but I raised by hand to ask Pat a specific question
[2009/06/28 9:57] Jamie Palisades: as he suggested just now that this bill if adopted would affect the AA merger
[2009/06/28 9:57] Soro Dagostino: YOu have the floor.
[2009/06/28 9:58] Jamie Palisades: Sir, is it your believe thatm notwithstanding the laps of appeal time for the enacted AA merger offer bill, that a selection of finterim reps by AA that exactly confirms to the bill will still be constitutionally attackable, without your legislation?
[2009/06/28 9:59] Jamie Palisades: (and DO forgive the bad hotel internet typing, please )
[2009/06/28 10:00] Patroklus Murakami: well, i think that’s a question for the SC rather than for me In my opinion, yes, there would be a constitutional issue without my amendment or something that achieves the same ends
[2009/06/28 10:00] Jamie Palisades: And if your bill is enacted, as a CA, would that still leave the selection still open to challenge?
[2009/06/28 10:01] Sonja Strom raises hand
[2009/06/28 10:01] Soro Dagostino: Noted
[2009/06/28 10:02] Patroklus Murakami: well, anything is open to challenge. i think the real question is whether a challenge woudl succeed or not. i hope that my amendment would reduce the likelihood that AA reps joining the RA could be successfully challenged
[2009/06/28 10:02] Soro Dagostino: Answer is evasive
[2009/06/28 10:02] Soro Dagostino: oops, I am not the judge now.
[2009/06/28 10:03] Jamie Palisades: eh, I accept it, for what it;s worth, Your Honor
[2009/06/28 10:03] Patroklus Murakami: i’m sorry you think so soro
[2009/06/28 10:03] Patroklus Murakami: i think it’s honest
[2009/06/28 10:03] Patroklus Murakami: anything can be challenged
[2009/06/28 10:03] Patroklus Murakami: i can’t stop a challenge from happening
[2009/06/28 10:03] Pip Torok notes that the arbiter is the SC not this body
[2009/06/28 10:03] Gwyneth Llewelyn nods
[2009/06/28 10:03] Patroklus Murakami: the point is – does amendment make it more or less likely to succeed?
[2009/06/28 10:04] Patroklus Murakami: i can’t judge that, i’m not the SC! but i can give my opinion
[2009/06/28 10:05] Patroklus Murakami: in my opinion, this amendment would lessen the likelihood of a successful challenge
[2009/06/28 10:05] Soro Dagostino: Sonja — you have the floor
[2009/06/28 10:05] Patroklus Murakami: that’s why i’m putting it forward
[2009/06/28 10:05] Sonja Strom: I didn’t know what a CA is, but I think I figured it out: a Constitutional Amendment?
[2009/06/28 10:05] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes.
[2009/06/28 10:05] Sonja Strom: Thanks
[2009/06/28 10:06] Soro Dagostino: Anything more?
[2009/06/28 10:06] Gwyneth Llewelyn wonders if I’m still considered to be in the queue… lol
[2009/06/28 10:07] Soro Dagostino: Gwyn .. your turn
[2009/06/28 10:07] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks!
[2009/06/28 10:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok… just to make this clear…
[2009/06/28 10:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: 1) Unlike what has been said on this assembly earlier today,
[2009/06/28 10:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Pat’s proposed amendment is NOT to make the AA merger void,
[2009/06/28 10:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: but rather,
[2009/06/28 10:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: to DEFEND it
[2009/06/28 10:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Why?
[2009/06/28 10:09] Gwyneth Llewelyn: because 2) some people, now or on the future, might claim that the merger bill is unconstitutional,
[2009/06/28 10:09] Gwyneth Llewelyn: since it creates (through a bill) a way for RA members to be appointed outside the normal election process.
[2009/06/28 10:09] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Now… the SC has not commented publicly on that (but on private — which I won’t repeat of course — they had some doubts )
[2009/06/28 10:10] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, to make SURE we can actually get +appointed interim RA members+, now and in the future,
[2009/06/28 10:10] Gwyneth Llewelyn: 3) Pat has introduced this amendment which allows, and I quote,
[2009/06/28 10:10] Gwyneth Llewelyn: “The RA may be supplemented with interim additional representatives, freely chosen by a community joining the CDS”
[2009/06/28 10:10] Gwyneth Llewelyn: It doesn’t say HOW they’re chosen — that’s left for the merger bill(s) to decide
[2009/06/28 10:10] Gwyneth Llewelyn: It just allows it to happen!
[2009/06/28 10:11] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, please,
[2009/06/28 10:11] Gwyneth Llewelyn: when you vote on this,
[2009/06/28 10:11] Pip Torok raises hand re gwyns statement
[2009/06/28 10:11] Gwyneth Llewelyn: don’t see it as a “power struggle” on “who writes the nicest bills”
[2009/06/28 10:11] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Which is actually what this is degenerating into.
[2009/06/28 10:11] Soro Dagostino: Pip — noted
[2009/06/28 10:11] josephine Brouwer is Offline
[2009/06/28 10:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Look at it, please, on what we actually need to make sure that the merger bill is NOT attacked any more, neither today, nor in the future.
[2009/06/28 10:12] Delia Lake wants to put into the record that anything any SC member says unofficially is said only as a private citizen and in no way should be interpreted to be an SC opinion.
[2009/06/28 10:12] Soro Dagostino: It may be a while
[2009/06/28 10:12] Soro Dagostino: Your time is up Gywn.
[2009/06/28 10:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Exactly, Delia, but… on the other hand, SC members, as citizens, can definitely vent their opinions to the legislators to have them consider ‘hints’ as good opportunities to rewrite legislation *better*
[2009/06/28 10:12] Soro Dagostino: Unless a vote of the membbers overules the chaitr.
[2009/06/28 10:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, thank you Soro.
[2009/06/28 10:13] Soro Dagostino: Pip
[2009/06/28 10:13] Jamie Palisades smiles, raises hand again to note place in queue after RA members
[2009/06/28 10:14] Pip Torok: I say this … “freely chosen” means they are FREE to choose according to their whim … We the CDS simply CANNOT say how they do or shd do this … fuinished
[2009/06/28 10:14] Soro Dagostino: Noted Jamie
[2009/06/28 10:14] Soro Dagostino: Jamie
[2009/06/28 10:15] Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Pip and agrees with that interpretation
[2009/06/28 10:15] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (the amendment just refers back to the UDHR, using the same words; it doesn’t ‘enforce’ any specific form of ‘freely choosing’ the representatives)
[2009/06/28 10:15] Soro Dagostino: Jamie has the floor
[2009/06/28 10:16] Jamie Palisades: Thanks – looks around – did I jump ahead of anyone?
[2009/06/28 10:16] Soro Dagostino: No.
[2009/06/28 10:16] Jamie Palisades: OK, first: – only unusually large mergers would create an RA representation issue. When we grow slowly and organically, like say with the 6 or so new citizens we will pick up on the Monastery sim, the newcomers simply become enfranchised at the next regular RA election. A larger incoming body, like AA’s 60 or so, may ask to be represented form the outset. They did.
[2009/06/28 10:17] Jamie Palisades: so we are in an unusual case
[2009/06/28 10:17] Jamie Palisades: god willing
[2009/06/28 10:17] Jamie Palisades: at least while I;m serving …
[2009/06/28 10:17] Jamie Palisades: As for a constitutional amendment, I originally suggested one myself, but one that would more clearly protect legitimate the Al-Andalus (AA) transaction.
[2009/06/28 10:17] Jamie Palisades: During the debates on our original merger offer act, which the CSDF faction opposed, there were quite a few comments — even several meetings of impassionated speeches, and then later complaints of being cut off in mid-speech, etc. — about the exact way in which AA would designate its transitional RA representatives.
[2009/06/28 10:18] Jamie Palisades: So there was some consideration concern about opposition, at the time, and future attacks
[2009/06/28 10:18] Jamie Palisades: I;m not going to repeat the bad feelings that went back and forth, bu read for yourself if you wish
[2009/06/28 10:18] Jamie Palisades: I then offered a constitutional amendment, which explicitly legitimated transactions of the type of AA. It included clauses to make it explicit that a selection process of the kind AA proposes to use for interim RA reps is constitutitonal. Our senators Gwyneth, Patroklaus and Sonja blocked it.
[2009/06/28 10:19] Jamie Palisades: The AA merger bill passed, and the date for constitutitional challenge expired. So acts taken properly pursuant to it and not OTHERWISE in violation of our laws SHOULD BY OUR LAWS be beyond reproach.
[2009/06/28 10:19] Jamie Palisades: Now Patroklus has offered another amendment
[2009/06/28 10:19] Jamie Palisades: several, including Sonja, posted correctly that no constitutional amendment is needed FOR completing the AA merger.
[2009/06/28 10:19] Jamie Palisades: Let’s not be confused about the text of the amendment. Its words seem benign. AA’s plan is in fact to send us “freely chosen” reps! As Pip said — no risk there. If the SC acts in accordance with normal rules of interpretation So it SHOULD not create a basis for attack. To be blunt, I believe Pat is trying to help us, here.
[2009/06/28 10:19] Patroklus Murakami: ty jamie
[2009/06/28 10:20] Jamie Palisades: Sigh … Let’s not be confused about the text of the amendment. Its words seem benign. AA’s plan is in fact to send us “freely chosen” reps! As Pip said — no risk there. If the SC acts in accordance with normal rules of interpretation So it SHOULD not create a basis for attack. To be blunt, I believe Pat is trying to help us, here.
[2009/06/28 10:20] Jamie Palisades: oops, key mistake sorry
[2009/06/28 10:20] Jamie Palisades: Yet I still fear the help. The new legislation could STILL create new avenues of appeal. From a LEGISLATIVE point of view, why rush to fix what is not broken?
[2009/06/28 10:20] Jamie Palisades: With respect, the repeated references by some RA members to other lengthy parts of the UDHP have the sound of a warrior happily and lovingly clicking the safety off on their rifle. After all, as one former dean likes to say “the SC can do anything”.
[2009/06/28 10:20] Jamie Palisades: To sum up in simple words: if I knew with certainty that the original opponents of this merger were NOT going to use this new law to try and unseat the transitional AA reps … I’d have no problem with it.
[2009/06/28 10:21] Jamie Palisades: done, and apologies for the bad comm problems
[2009/06/28 10:21] Patroklus Murakami raises a hand
[2009/06/28 10:21] Soro Dagostino: Pat
[2009/06/28 10:21] Patroklus Murakami: we did not “oppose the merger” and it’s really bad form to assign that to us
[2009/06/28 10:22] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, jamie, that was really uncalled for.
[2009/06/28 10:22] Patroklus Murakami: we opposed elements of the proposed agreement (or rather one rep did)
[2009/06/28 10:22] Patroklus Murakami: and we opposed some of the terms of the constitutional amendment because we were worried they would undermine our democracy
[2009/06/28 10:22] Jamie Palisades apologies sincerely for any misstatement; the record’s all in the public domain
[2009/06/28 10:22] Patroklus Murakami: we can disagree but let’s not misrepresent sincerely-held views
[2009/06/28 10:23] Gwyneth Llewelyn *raises hand* next
[2009/06/28 10:23] Patroklus Murakami: this amendment is not a ‘trojan horse’ as you seem to think
[2009/06/28 10:23] Soro Dagostino: NOted
[2009/06/28 10:23] Patroklus Murakami: it’s not intended to leave a loophole for a future challenge
[2009/06/28 10:23] Patroklus Murakami: it’s intended to close one
[2009/06/28 10:23] Patroklus Murakami: that’s all
[2009/06/28 10:23] Soro Dagostino: Gwyn
[2009/06/28 10:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I would just wish to reinforce two things. One, the AA merger bill is passed. The SC has not found any faults with it. It goes ahead without question. Nothing we decide here and today, at least what’s on the agenda, will not change the AA merger bill.
[2009/06/28 10:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I hope that is crystal clear and without any further doubts
[2009/06/28 10:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: And no more misinterpretations
[2009/06/28 10:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Please
[2009/06/28 10:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: The second point is that obviously the SC can accept unconstitutional laws; it’s up to them, obviously, to accept them or not.
[2009/06/28 10:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That doesn’t mean that we, as RA members, aren’t obliged to make sure that we uphold the Constitution as well
[2009/06/28 10:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So… to make sure that *future* mergers,
[2009/06/28 10:25] Soro Dagostino: Is that a challange to the AA Merger?
[2009/06/28 10:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: do NOT exploit the “precedent” of pushing RA representatives into the RA *without any constitutional amendment*
[2009/06/28 10:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: NO.
[2009/06/28 10:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Please.
[2009/06/28 10:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: The past is the past, Soro
[2009/06/28 10:26] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Approved is approved
[2009/06/28 10:26] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Let’s think about the FUTURE.
[2009/06/28 10:26] Gwyneth Llewelyn: For the FUTURE mergers, we’re proposing to introduce the possibility of RA members getting freely chosen from their communities for a merger.
[2009/06/28 10:26] Gwyneth Llewelyn: And make that part of the Constitution.
[2009/06/28 10:27] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Any other misinterpretations of my words will make me VERY angry
[2009/06/28 10:27] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s all, thank you
[2009/06/28 10:27] Soro Dagostino: Are you ready for the question?
[2009/06/28 10:28] Patroklus Murakami: yes
[2009/06/28 10:28] Jamie Palisades: On that last point i think we agree completely senator
[2009/06/28 10:28] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good
[2009/06/28 10:28] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Then, I’m ready for the question hehe
[2009/06/28 10:28] Soro Dagostino: All in favor?
[2009/06/28 10:29] Patroklus Murakami: of the constitutional amendment? aye
[2009/06/28 10:29] Pip Torok: aye
[2009/06/28 10:29] Sonja Strom: aye
[2009/06/28 10:29] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye.
[2009/06/28 10:30] Soro Dagostino: There are two senators’ with Seve day votes
[2009/06/28 10:31] Soro Dagostino: for the record I vote No.
[2009/06/28 10:31] Pip Torok: does that affect the two thirds majority iyo?
[2009/06/28 10:31] Pip Torok: ah …
[2009/06/28 10:31] Soro Dagostino: Yes
[2009/06/28 10:31] Patroklus Murakami: yes pip. one more vote in favour needed to pass
[2009/06/28 10:31] Jamie Palisades: mm – – either of the others absent can vote yes
[2009/06/28 10:31] Sonja Strom raises hand.
[2009/06/28 10:31] Soro Dagostino: Yes Sonja
[2009/06/28 10:32] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sorry, is the voting over?…
[2009/06/28 10:32] Sonja Strom: I would like to propose that a vote against would not really be a vote to “block” the amendement, but that it would be a vote not in favor of adopting the amendement.
[2009/06/28 10:32] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah yes, sorry — i got some lag
[2009/06/28 10:33] Sonja Strom: Thanks
[2009/06/28 10:33] Sonja Strom: This is a matter of interpretation, but that is how I see it.
[2009/06/28 10:33] Pip Torok thought it wd have been the general interpretation …
[2009/06/28 10:33] Patroklus Murakami: that’s how i would take a no vote sonja but, it’s really up to RA members to say what they intend
[2009/06/28 10:33] Sonja Strom:
[2009/06/28 10:33] Soro Dagostino: It is a constitutional amendment.
[2009/06/28 10:33] Jamie Palisades: (maybe a language difference? not sure I see the distinction. A vote against is a vote to not do something. No?)
[2009/06/28 10:34] Soro Dagostino: That is the understanding of the chair.
[2009/06/28 10:34] Gwyneth Llewelyn: A vote of no is that it doesn’t pass; anyone can reintroduce const. amendments in the future
[2009/06/28 10:34] Pip Torok: depends on your macchiavellian / non-m caste of mind jamie!
[2009/06/28 10:34] Gwyneth Llewelyn:
[2009/06/28 10:34] Soro Dagostino: Agreed
[2009/06/28 10:35] Danton Sideways: Bye all, I’ll be running along now
[2009/06/28 10:35] Sonja Strom: bye Danton
[2009/06/28 10:35] Soro Dagostino: Ciao.
[2009/06/28 10:35] Patroklus Murakami: bye danton
[2009/06/28 10:35] Delia Lake: bye Danton
[2009/06/28 10:35] Pip Torok: bye danton!
[2009/06/28 10:35] Jamie Palisades: Ta Danton. Well, in any case, I deeply appreciate the clarifications here, ladies and gentlemen; we owe it to our merger partners to know where they stand. We’ll see how the vote comes out. Frankly, if it does not pass this time, the new RA probably should return to the issue — personally I would like NOT to be in the position again of negotiating a merger without some clarity on those points.
[2009/06/28 10:36] Soro Dagostino: We have some additional items on the agenda. Is someone here to be the proponent?
[2009/06/28 10:36] Soro Dagostino: From The SC?
[2009/06/28 10:37] Delia Lake: my apologies but Claude put out these agenda items and he is not here
[2009/06/28 10:37] Soro Dagostino: Should they be postponed?
[2009/06/28 10:38] Delia Lake: I would recommend that, yes
[2009/06/28 10:38] Soro Dagostino: Chair will accept that as a Motion . . . RA Memeber?
[2009/06/28 10:38] Pip Torok: seconded
[2009/06/28 10:39] Soro Dagostino: Heh! you moved
[2009/06/28 10:39] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m fine in postponing, assuming that only Claude can do that presentations…
[2009/06/28 10:39] Soro Dagostino: Second?
[2009/06/28 10:39] Gwyneth Llewelyn is happy to second Pip
[2009/06/28 10:39] Soro Dagostino:
[2009/06/28 10:39] Pip Torok: lol!
[2009/06/28 10:39] Patroklus Murakami: thirded
[2009/06/28 10:39] Soro Dagostino: Now, all in =favor?
[2009/06/28 10:39] Pip Torok: aye
[2009/06/28 10:39] Patroklus Murakami: aye
[2009/06/28 10:40] Sonja Strom: aye
[2009/06/28 10:40] Soro Dagostino: Opposed?
[2009/06/28 10:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
[2009/06/28 10:40] Soro Dagostino: ooops
[2009/06/28 10:40] Soro Dagostino: sorry
[2009/06/28 10:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: sorry! that was an aye for postponing ))
[2009/06/28 10:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn was not fast enough hehe
[2009/06/28 10:40] Soro Dagostino: Motion carried
[2009/06/28 10:40] Sonja Strom: (not an aye for opposing? lol)
[2009/06/28 10:41] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (no no, Sonja!!)
[2009/06/28 10:41] Gwyneth Llewelyn:
[2009/06/28 10:41] Sonja Strom:
[2009/06/28 10:41] Soro Dagostino: Any further business?
[2009/06/28 10:41] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Just one clarification really…
[2009/06/28 10:41] Soro Dagostino: Yes?
[2009/06/28 10:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie suggested that the territory accession of the AA would happen between July 7th and 16th
[2009/06/28 10:42] Soro Dagostino: Yes?
[2009/06/28 10:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: The agenda somehow mentions we should “vote” on it,
[2009/06/28 10:42] Jamie Palisades: must be a typo
[2009/06/28 10:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: but I would like to suggest that we skip the voting, this is an executive procedure really and should be best left in the hands of the Chancellor
[2009/06/28 10:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, Jamie, that’s what I thought
[2009/06/28 10:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m clarified
[2009/06/28 10:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you
[2009/06/28 10:43] Soro Dagostino: It is. Late nights on the computer.
[2009/06/28 10:43] Pip Torok: nuits blanches ….
[2009/06/28 10:44] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, ok, just wondering, I don’t want to get accused of deliberately skipping an important vote and trying to delay the merger further
[2009/06/28 10:44] Sonja Strom: lol
[2009/06/28 10:44] Jamie Palisades smiles
[2009/06/28 10:44] Jamie Palisades: Well, in case it’s not obvious, as the executive charged with operational enactment of the merger, my job was and is to deliver certainty as much as possible One hurdle passed in today’s meeting … another is when the effective date occurs. So we hope to time its effectuive date for whatever date LEAST perturbs the RA election
[2009/06/28 10:44] Sonja Strom: Thank you for that
[2009/06/28 10:44] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So long as Linden Lab is not pushing sims around during *election day*, I’m fine with any date
[2009/06/28 10:45] Soro Dagostino: Are we ready to adjoourn.?
[2009/06/28 10:45] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Please
[2009/06/28 10:45] Pip Torok: so move
[2009/06/28 10:45] Sonja Strom: second
[2009/06/28 10:45] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Let’s adjourn! hehe
[2009/06/28 10:45] Jamie Palisades: hhaha oh god, spare us THAT Gwyn
[2009/06/28 10:45] Soro Dagostino: Moved and seconded
[2009/06/28 10:45] Soro Dagostino: In favor
[2009/06/28 10:45] Patroklus Murakami: aye
[2009/06/28 10:45] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye
[2009/06/28 10:45] Pip Torok: aye
[2009/06/28 10:45] Sonja Strom: aye
[2009/06/28 10:46] Jamie Palisades: Informally, FWIW, I believe deeply in the UDHP, authored post-WWII by a committe chaired by a fellow citizen of mine … but am pleased to not have it as a hammer over the merger’s head.
[2009/06/28 10:46] Soro Dagostino: Someone poke Pat
[2009/06/28 10:46] Patroklus Murakami: i already said aye!
[2009/06/28 10:46] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Pat voted “aye”… there is some chat lag sometimes
[2009/06/28 10:46] Soro Dagostino: Ah, sorry — missed it.
[2009/06/28 10:46] Patroklus Murakami: jamie, the amendment hasn’t passed/failed yet
[2009/06/28 10:47] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie, since the SC declared the merger to be constitutionally sound, there was no doubt any more.
[2009/06/28 10:47] Soro Dagostino: We stand ajourened
[2009/06/28 10:47] Jamie Palisades: my need to have things clarififed, Pat, has been served by the record here either way
[2009/06/28 10:47] Sonja Strom: But it should not be a hammer over the merger’s head anyway…
[2009/06/28 10:47] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, a lot could be said about it, Sonja
[2009/06/28 10:48] Sonja Strom: They are not incompatible at all so far as I see.
[2009/06/28 10:48] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That was the SC’s decision too, Sonja. So…
[2009/06/28 10:48] Jamie Palisades: Indeed, SOnja — note, though that if somethign abomniable happened — say, Al Andalus elected only to permit persons of Asian heritage to participate — that would NOT be beyond SC challenge — because that’s not a determinstic result of the enacted bill;
[2009/06/28 10:48] Soro Dagostino: Well folk — I have been here since 4:30 — gone!
[2009/06/28 10:48] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Any bill that doesn’t go against either the Constitution or the UNHR and is validated by the SC as not doing so, doesn’t need to “fear” anything
[2009/06/28 10:49] Sonja Strom: I think probably you are right about that Jamie, but would they do that?
[2009/06/28 10:49] Gwyneth Llewelyn: And you’re right on that, Jamie. Technically, yes, the SC could oversee the ‘selection’ procedure
[2009/06/28 10:49] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But that’s up to them, not to us

Permalink.

RA Transcript: July 12, 2009
by Brian Livingston » Tue Jul 14, 2009 5:46 pm
Note: This transcript is in two parts. I had to leave the meeting before its conclusion, so this portion of the transcript ends at 10:39 AM SLT. Soro recorded the remainder of the meeting and will post it as soon as possible.

Permalink.

RA Transcript: 2 August 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Aug 02, 2009 8:27 pm
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: if you can manage to touch the recorder on the table in the center, arria, that would be helpful. and everyone else too
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: also sitting on the floor next to the table is an amphora that will give you an agenda if you touch it.
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: I cannot touch anything ( I dont see the recorder)
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ah, here’s carolyn!
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: but I consent to be recorded
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: hi carolyn, sorry for the insanity….
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: if you see the table its in the centre of it arria
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: hi carolyn
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: and thanks for making our quorum
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: yea – please Rose
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: hi zaphod
[2009/08/02 Soro Dagostino: Hello Carolyn, welcome.
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: Hi Zaphod
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: please take a seat on one of the benches — it’s a whole new setup, so there are no traditions.
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: great
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: Hi Justice
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: hello to all of you
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: I consent to be recorded
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: Do we think that everyone who is going to arrive has arrived?
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: thanks i was already looking for that the very minute it started to play….
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: stand up
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Well…except that Rose wants to make sure we all hear the anthem, so if you turn on your music you can hear it
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: Again if there are any RA member who don’t have the affirmation, please IM.
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: houraaaahhhh for CDS/AA
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: houraaaahhhh for CDS/AA
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: houraaaahhhh for CDS/AA
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Claude, I’m going to turn over to you for the inauguration.
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: hurray
[2009/08/02 Robert Galland: I will log off and be back in two minutes or less. Please excuse me.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: affirmations…
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: Welcome to the 11th Representative Assembly.
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: nods
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: Our tenth elected RA, and our largest by far.
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: All the RA members should have the affirmation.
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: At one time we did this indvidually, but as we are now so many…
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: …I think we should embrace the cacophony and all type (or cut/paste – hence the cards) at once.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I, Cindy Ecksol, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: I, Sonja Strom, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Micael Khandr: I, Micael Khandr, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Robert Galland: I, Robert Galland, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: I, Pip Torok, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Soro Dagostino: I, Soro Dagostino, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly swear by the great George Carlin that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators. May George rest in peace.
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: I, Carolyn Saarinen, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: I, Arria Perreault, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: Before I hand things over to the new LRA…
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: I, Arria Perreault, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: …I want to remind her that it is traditional for the new RA to deliver a brief ‘state of the CDS’address at the beginning of the term.
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: Congratulations all…
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: thank you claude
[2009/08/02 Micael Khandr: Thanks, Claude.
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: ….and I yield the floor to the new LRA.
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: thank you
[2009/08/02 Robert Galland: Thank you, Claude.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: can I please as Nafttali, Zaph, junius, rose to touch the recorder on the table to give consent to recording?
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: did you see mine?
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: yes, arria, I did not mention your name.
[2009/08/02 Danton Sideways: woot
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: grins
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ok, a brief state o fthe CDS
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: your lovely cloud is still working correct Arria
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: ty
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: much was accomplished in the last term, not the least significant being the marriage of CDS and Al Andalus
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: we are financially healthy, socially doubled in size…
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: and of course the RA is a whole new animal, twice the size it has been and with the challenges inherent in any new organization
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: as I mentioned on the forum, I’m going to ask your indulgence as we learn to work…and play together.
[2009/08/02 notetaker 2.0.1: notetaker 2.0.1 [script:notetaker 2.0.1] Script run-time error
[2009/08/02 notetaker 2.0.1: Stack-Heap Collision
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: in particular, I’d like to direct your attention to the big blue ? on the platform
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: this is a “question queue” and what I’d ask is that if you would like to speak, rather than IMing me or speaking out, you click on the queue.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: we will all see that you have “queued up” and I will authorize the speakers in the order in which they queued.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: and I’d ask that everyone try to keep their turn on the floor down to 2 minutes if possible
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: I dont see it today
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Rose Springvale has a question
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I’m going to see if we can do this without a clock — hopefully we will be able to discipline ourselves.
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: hi jamie
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: Hi Jamie
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: Cindy…
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ah, I see Rose has a question
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: thanks, just wanted to let you know that the back rows here are out of chat range
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Rose, you have the floor
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: thus my comment
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: *sigh*
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ah yes…well…
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: about music… too far away.. so people might want to move forward
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Carolyn Saarinen has a question
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: apologizes for interruption
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: good idea.
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Carolyn Saarinen
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Carolyn?
[2009/08/02 You decline Reading Avgi, Isle of Awakening, Avgi (106, 38, 22) from A group member named sabreman Carter.
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: There is no need for this room to be so large
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: Could we have the members area reduced to let others sit closer?
[2009/08/02 Jamie Palisades waves from a really horrid ajaxlife avatar interface with no visuals, and questionable hotel internet, but here all the same
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: great yu could make it jamie
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: good suggestion
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: will work on it with Moon….that one we missed when we resdesigned this week
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: so my seat is available
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: Ok
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: all right…..
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: not anymore
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok feels better already!
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: lol
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: if you don’t have a copy of the agenda, please touch the amphora under the table. arria I will hand you one.
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: grins] 2009/08/02 Pip Torok blushes
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: can others use member’s seats for this meeting, so they are in chat range?
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: thats healthy pip
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Arria Perreault has a question
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: yes, I don’t see why not…
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: good for your face
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Arria!
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: ty
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: you clicked!
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Arria Perreault
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: question?
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: yes
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: please
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: my question was about agenda. I would to have it before the meeting
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: it was on the forum arria
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Friday afternoon
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: that will be my intent, to have it on the forum on Friday
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: greetings delia
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: yes
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Sonja Strom has a question
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: Hi Delia
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sonja Strom
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: great
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: sonja?
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen shouts: Everybody in the cheap seats, move up so you can hear
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: (when you see “Nxt in queue” with your name pop up, please take the floor
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: thx carolyn…
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: It looks to me like everybody would be in chat range if the LRA and Arria could stand on the floor.
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: Thanks.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I do not see anyone out of chat range right now
[[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: under event, yes I see
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: yea I can hear you all fine
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: Can everybody hear Cindy fine?
[2009/08/02 Pip Torok: i can
[2009/08/02 Micael Khandr: Yes.
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: me too
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: i can, if zap and junius can, we should be okay
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: yep
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: yes
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: Rose?
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: yes
[2009/08/02 Junius Inaka: yes I can
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: ok, then the problem is over…
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: great, i’ll monitor anyone else coming in
[2009/08/02 Claude Desmoulins: Yes
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ok…the agenda.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: any concerns or additions?
[2009/08/02 You decline Peacefest SUNDAY AUGUST 2nd Schedule! from A group member named Siri Vita.
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: nips from her coffee looking from above at this theatre, and feels home
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: A point that can wait til the end
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: I IM’d you Cindy
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ok, thank you carolyn. please queue up at the appropriate time
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: all right.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: next meeting…two weeks from today, 16 aug at 9am
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: any objectsion?
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: any requests for 7 day vote?
[2009/08/02 Sonja Strom: I will not be able to be there, and request a 7-day vote for that meeting.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: noted
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: anyone else?
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: nope
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: please note that if something comes up, you can always question a 7day vote by IMing me or posting to the forum
[2009/08/02 Robert Galland nods
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: ah good
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Carolyn Saarinen has a question
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I meant “request” not Questions
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Carolyn Saarinen
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Caro?
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: Here’s an example I found on XSL
https://uncensored.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&file=item&ItemID=685336
It is pretty cheap and has Away and Busy options as well as just Online/Offline
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: Also, as a closely related matter, I think it would be helpful to clarify what admin permissions RA members have. What problems are we able to resolve for citizens? Are there issues that should be refered to specifically skilled persons?
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Caro, could I ask you to hold these to the end of the meeting “Concerns of RA members”?
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: would like to get to the agenda
[2009/08/02 Carolyn Saarinen: Sure
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: thx!
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: so next on the agenda…election of Chancellor
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I believe we have two candidates, Jamiei Palisades and Zaphod Epoch
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I see Jamie…Zaph, are you here?
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: yes i am
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ah, great!
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: still following
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I’m going to ask each candidate to make a short statement to the RA.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, since you’re on a tenuous connection, would you like to go first?
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: whoops!
[2009/08/02 Rose Springvale: oops
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: that answers THAT question
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: ok, Zaphod, you have the floor.
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: please keep your statement to 5 minutes
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: honoured house dear mister chancellor
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: i first of all want to apologize my poor english in some expressions i wil make
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: nods
[2009/08/02 Naftali Torok: can feel with yu
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: as being a citizien of the cds for quite a while right now and following the politics of the cds and learning about it i ws able to see a tremendous done work on all the sims belonging
[2009/08/02 Lilith Ivory: Hi Sudane
[2009/08/02 Sudane Erato: hi
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: and with the merge of the al anduls locations it was enriched in my believe
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: unfortunately i see that the visitors of the sims are not very many so i think this must have to be changed
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: and in the politics as done right now, i think that point is not made important enough
[2009/08/02 Countdown Timer V3.0: Time is up!
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Arria Perreault has a question
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Arria Perreault
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: I see arria has the first question for Zaph. Arria?
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: that is the reason why i decided in the last moment so to speak to apply for the chancellor and to try my best to make cds more important to the rest of the whole sl
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: thanks
[2009/08/02 Cindy Ecksol: arria, you have a question?
[2009/08/02 zaphod Enoch: i am finished
[2009/08/02 Arria Perreault: Zaphod, I think that culture and education are important in SL. What is your position regarding these two domains?
[2009/08/02 Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************

(continued)
Cindy Ecksol
Master Word Wielder

 
Posts: 447
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 8:37 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Top
Re: RA Transcript: 2 August 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Aug 02, 2009 8:38 pm
(continued)

(continued)
Cindy Ecksol
Master Word Wielder

 
Posts: 447
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 8:37 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Top
Re: RA Transcript: 2 August 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Aug 02, 2009 8:50 pm
(continued)

(continued)
Cindy Ecksol
Master Word Wielder

 
Posts: 447
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 8:37 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Top
Re: RA Transcript: 2 August 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Aug 02, 2009 8:57 pm
(continued)

Permalink.

RA Minutes 16 Aug 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:27 pm
Meeting on 2009-08-16
Those present: RA members -Cindy Ecksol, Micael Khandr, Pip Torok, Naftali Torok, Soro Dagastino, Joaquin Gustav
Chancellor – Jamie Palisades
Seven day votes: Carolyn Saarinen, Sonja Strom, Arria Perreault
Cindy Ecksol is in the chair.
Cindy Ecksol looks around and counts to see if we have a quorum yet….
Jamie Palisades: hmm – woudl that be lese majeste? I didn;t grow up in a country with a monarch
Jamie Palisades: Well, excluding the Bush administration
Cindy Ecksol: I think we need one more….
Lilith Ivory: hehe Jamie
Micael Khandr: I was thinking the same thing, Jamie . . .
Cindy Ecksol: sonja and Carolyn have requested 7 day votes, so they will not be here.
Cindy Ecksol: and speaking of seating…are you all going to leave poor micael all by himself on my right?
Micael Khandr: Do hey form a quorum?
Micael Khandr: Not being here now?
Cindy Ecksol: no, micael, we need seven present
Jamie Palisades: what’s quorum these days? 7 of 13? or 6 of 11? i SEEM TO RECALL NOT ALL SEATS ARE FILLED
Jamie Palisades: (caps lock sorry)
Cindy Ecksol: I believe all seats ARE filled…am I wrong about that?
Jamie Palisades: 7 of 12, counting Nafi?
Cindy Ecksol: yes…
Jamie Palisades: well aa has 6, no? with 5 filled i think, but I am not the authority
Cindy Ecksol: ah, which reminds me: forgot to put swearing naftali in on the agenda….
Cindy Ecksol: why don’t we all look at the agenda now — notecard in the urn nest to the table
Cindy Ecksol: *next to
Cindy Ecksol: and if you have not yet touched the recorder on the table to consent to recording, please do so now
Lilith Ivory has indicated consent to be recorded.
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades has indicated consent to be recorded.
CLEOPATRA Xigalia has indicated consent to be recorded.
Micael Khandr: Point of information, Cindy: how often are the RA meetings?
Cindy Ecksol: Micael, the normal schedule is every two weeks.
Cindy Ecksol: you’ll notice on the agenda that I am suggesting a meeting next week. that’s because I will not be available the following week.
Jamie Palisades mutters – and meeting frequently might be tough in the sumer, or with 13 members, so that’ll be one issue for y’all.
Cindy Ecksol: but if the group would rather stick to the bi-weekly schedule, I will arrange for someone to sit in for me.
Jamie Palisades grins
Micael Khandr: OK–will we then have a three-week break ’til next meeting after that?
Cindy Ecksol: no, we’ll just make the next meeting on Sept 6, two weeks after.
Micael Khandr: OK–my wife was just wondering . . .
Cindy Ecksol: three weeks is too long a break.
Cindy Ecksol:
Pip Torok: can I suggest that the Chancellor reports in the Forum instead of to the RA if it isnt 1-weekly?
Cindy Ecksol: ah, yes — RL
Soro Dagostino: I suggest that we also use the group chat to let folk know of the meetings.
Cindy Ecksol: I just sent out notices, but we can do chat too…hold on an di will
Jamie Palisades hears Pip, will get clarity when we get to that agenda item
Pip Torok: ok
Soro Dagostino: I am saying a day or so before.
Cindy Ecksol: oh, I see
Jamie Palisades: ((Assuming that everyone reads the Forums has never bee a winning strategy for us))
Cindy Ecksol: Soro, would you be willing to take on that little task?
Soro Dagostino: Helelel
Cindy Ecksol: I believe you have group posting privileges
Soro Dagostino: After pulling teeth.
Cindy Ecksol: ah, here’s kedwyn!
Cindy Ecksol: I forget — is she an RA member?
Cindy Ecksol: And where did Gwyn go?
Micael Khandr: Gwyn said she had to switch locations and would be back.
Cindy Ecksol: *sigh*
Soro Dagostino: Gwyn went to change computers.
Soro Dagostino: I thought.
Cindy Ecksol: all right, hopefully she will be back very shortly and we can officially start
Cindy Ecksol: but unofficially — anyone have any agenda comments?
Micael Khandr: Point of information, Cindy: who changes the CDS web site to reflect the merger?
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, can you answer that?
Cindy Ecksol: I’ve lost track…
Jamie Palisades: Micael, that’s my problem, and awaits the appointment of a webmasterm for which you will see a position notice out
Micael Khandr: OK–thsnks, Jamie.
Jamie Palisades: the existing legacy system is a little clunky to change quickly, though I am doing some things with the balky tools, in the short term. Thanks for the reminder, though
Cindy Ecksol: all right, I’m going to go ahead and start with items that are “information only” and will not require any kind of vote.
Naftali Torok: ok i am back sorry guys
Cindy Ecksol: please note that we are not a quorum, so we will not be able to approve anything binding
Naftali Torok: had rl tel here
Cindy Ecksol: also please note the question queue behind me. if you’d like to ask a question or make a comment, please click the big blue question mark to queue up and I’ll recognize speakers in order of queuing.
Cindy Ecksol: if you have not clicked th erecorder on the table to indicate recording consent, please do so now.
Cindy Ecksol: Future RA schedule: is next week at 0900 ok with you?
Naftali Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Micael Khandr: I’ll ask my wife . .
Pip Torok: fine with me
Cindy Ecksol: will will have to confirm with the others, but if I can get a quorum, we’ll do it then.
Soro Dagostino: ok
Cindy Ecksol: actually it just occurred to me: from now on I’m going to Doodle our RA meetings so that we’ll have positive feedback on who expects to attend
Cindy Ecksol hits her forehead and says “Duh!”
Cindy Ecksol: easier than just waiting around…
Pip Torok: quite!
Naftali Torok: doodle?
Joaquin Gustav: its ok for me too
Cindy Ecksol: Doodle is a tool for scheduling meetings — you will get an e-mail link from me Naf
Naftali Torok: i see
Cindy Ecksol: ok, I don’t think we need a quorum to swear Naftali in.
Soro Dagostino: I would think not.
Cindy Ecksol: naftali, do you have a copy of the affirmation?
Kedwyn Parmelee has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: naf?
Cindy Ecksol: you there?
Cindy Ecksol: if you would post your affirmation ito chat we can all cheer for you
Pip Torok: she may have crashed … ill check
Cindy Ecksol: no, she just accepted the card…
Solomon Mosely has indicated consent to be recorded.
Naftali Torok: sorry readingyour card
Naftali Torok: yes i am here
Pip Torok: she’s here …
Cindy Ecksol: ok, if you can post affirmation into chat we’ll be good
Naftali Torok: i missed it
Naftali Torok: sorry reading all the notes what do yu want from me
Naftali Torok: yes
Micael Khandr: Yes, what DO you want from us, Cindy?
Naftali Torok: lol
Cindy Ecksol: ok, naf, let’s try this: I’ll post — you just say “I do”
Cindy Ecksol: I, Naftali Torok, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
Naftali Torok: giggles
Naftali Torok: see i am a bad member….
Naftali Torok: but i am honest
Naftali Torok: ok there we go
Cindy Ecksol looks expectantly at Naf
Naftali Torok: I, Naftali Torok, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
Pip Torok: lol
Micael Khandr: I now pronounce you RAL and RA member.
Cindy Ecksol: thank you!
Cindy Ecksol: and congratulations
Cindy Ecksol: ***** APPPPPPPLLLLAAAUUUSSSSEEEEEEE***********
Joaquin Gustav: bravo!
Pip Torok: congratulations!!
Soro Dagostino: WOOOOOT!!!!
Kedwyn Parmelee: .-‘`’-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-‘`’-.
Jamie Palisades claps
Naftali Torok: oeps that feels real
Cindy Ecksol: next item: Jamie, would you like to give your report?
Micael Khandr: It is downhill from here, Naf . . .
Soro Dagostino: hehehe
Naftali Torok: looks huilty at cindy who puts time into this winks(was in the kitchen drinking a quick soup)
Soro Dagostino: REally steeply
Jamie Palisades: Sure. Let me ask Pip for a clarification first
Jamie Palisades: Pip, you were sayign somethign about the format for these reports?
Jamie Palisades: how can we best do this?
Pip Torok: yes … if the timimg of the RA means you would have a problem delivering reports in a timely fashion … then publish them throught the Forums
Naftali Torok: gets a bit dissy looking at the question mar turning like mad
Jamie Palisades: got it. Will do.
Jamie Palisades: Ok, for this meeting then:
Pip Torok: fine
Jamie Palisades: Thank you, and again, congratulations to all elected, and a thank you to the majority
of you for your confidence in me, allowing me to serve CDS again. First general
reports, then on to govenment projects, and land.
Jamie Palisades: I have two general items, brief notes on the procedural status of the RA, and Al
Andalus.
Jamie Palisades: On the RA (as Cindy and I discussed) we need, and do not have, an LRA-appointed RA Archivist, to continue the work that Publius and Brian did to keep our web lists of current statutes in order…
Jamie Palisades: Passing laws has little practical merit if people can’t find them … I have made some candidate suggestions to Cindy.
Jamie Palisades: Also, let me report, for those of you who did not attend, that the CDS SC met and
confirmed Naftali Torok’s appointment to the RA,, * a n d * and the practicality of treating the AA-elected reps, this term, as a “faction” under our rules.
Jamie Palisades: I suggested that, so obviuosly agree.
Jamie Palisades: but
Jamie Palisades: let me point out, we only did that in order to retrofit our approved merger, rather awkwardly, into the existing faction-centered political structure of our laws.
Jamie Palisades: I mention this because all agreed, last term, that we need
to work on the laws, to make any future similar mergers more smooth.
Jamie Palisades: “We” means you, of course
Naftali Torok: nods
Jamie Palisades: We had some chats last term about constitutional amendments on the table, with varying approaches. I mention it just to remind us all that this is unfinished work.
Jamie Palisades: Other general item: Al Andalus operational merger issues. Let me just say that the
preliminary terraforming is done; that we are with Rose’s help converting AA rent boxes successfullly, in a way that should not affect the residents at all; and (as most know) we have a very nice inaugural ball there last week, so we’re off to a fine start.
Naftali Torok: yes
Jamie Palisades: …
Jamie Palisades: On to my second item — new government activities. This is a lead-in to budget talks
we will have after 1 September, as I expect to proposed some changes that will affect
the budget.
Jamie Palisades: Much of what do works, and is likely to continue as is You will have seen the posting for this term’s civil service positions: speaks for itself. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2528
Jamie Palisades: but there are some possible additions also
Jamie Palisades: traditionally we had one big events pool of funds
Jamie Palisades: and one big events czar
Jamie Palisades: czarina, in fact
Jamie Palisades: But I suggested something last term that I and we did not implement, and I plan to go
forward with it — a continuing decentralization of our events programming.
Jamie Palisades: details were posted here, last term: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2372.
Jamie Palisades: basically, region by region and culture-oriented citizen panels, who can spend some of
our budget, subject to admin oversight (so we are not hiring our cousins).
Jamie Palisades: So please expect some budget details for that, as well, in our early september meeting.
Jamie Palisades: The other new-ish matter for government operations is how we deal with “embassies”.
I’d like to bring some proposed actions to your next meeting, on that one, when Sonja
will be back with us, as it’s an area of special interest for her.
Jamie Palisades: …
Jamie Palisades: my last item is land.
Jamie Palisades: In summary, AA is in good shape fiscally; I am about to open up and offer (under the commercial special-rent land program) some more of the unused CN space; and we’ll have some more terraforming of the new sims.
Jamie Palisades: Guild: I need to meet again with the Guild to understand their plans for their role, as they were mostly dormat last term. We may expect some GMP updating from them, it’s hoped. I find it a very helpful tool, as the volunteer NGO guideline it is, though as a very-small-group project, I am hesitant to give it the force of law.
Jamie Palisades: Finally, as to sims if the current 11 sim configuration proves economically stable and well rented, I hope to come to you nexty, as dissused some last term, with a proposal to extend the NFS city structure to the East – basically, at the back wall of the Schloss.
Jamie Palisades: that’s it thanks for your time.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks jamie!
Cindy Ecksol: questions?
Jamie Palisades: and bear in mind there is VERY little i do here that you can’t undo if you wish
Cindy Ecksol: (please queue)
Cindy Ecksol: no questions?
Naftali Torok: great thanks jamie
Naftali Torok: (still reading)
Cindy Ecksol: all right then, moving on….
Cindy Ecksol: Joaquin pointed out to me in IM that he also needs to be sworn in today
Naftali Torok: tru
Cindy Ecksol: so if you will all indulge us, I’ll ask him to post his affirmation
Cindy Ecksol: Joaquin?
Joaquin Gustav: yes
Joaquin Gustav: I, Joaquin Gustav, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
Micael Khandr: Bravo!
Cindy Ecksol: thank you and congratulations!
Cindy Ecksol: ***** APPPPPPPLLLLAAAUUUSSSSEEEEEEE***********
Naftali Torok: congrats collegue
Kedwyn Parmelee: .-‘`’-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-‘`’-.
Joaquin Gustav: ty
Pip Torok: bravo joaquin!!
Cindy Ecksol: all right, old business
Cindy Ecksol: Carolyn had planned to report on the in-world status board, but she IM’d me this mornign that she would not be able to make it to the meeting
Cindy Ecksol: so we will just defer that until next meeting
Cindy Ecksol: any other old business that I should have put here?
Naftali Torok: whats the in-world status board?
Cindy Ecksol: Naf, take a look at minutes from last meeting. it was a suggestion that Carolyn had for helping citizens know which RA members were inworld at any given time
Free Radar HUD v1.1 by Crystal Gadgets
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Soro Dagostino
Cindy Ecksol: Soro?
Naftali Torok: i see good plan
Soro Dagostino: There were a couple of items from SC –
Pip Torok: Its a system whereby anyone can tell whther an RA member is onworld at any time
Soro Dagostino: Claude was not here to present them.
Cindy Ecksol: ah, yes…and he did not request time on the agenda….
Soro Dagostino: thanks.
Naftali Torok: yehe just logged off….
Cindy Ecksol: and I do not see him here either unfortunately
Cindy Ecksol: I will follow up with him and see if he wants to present next week
Cindy Ecksol: ok, concerns of RA members…
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Micael Khandr
Cindy Ecksol: micael?
Micael Khandr: Do we have any kind of a census?
Cindy Ecksol: ah, great question!
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, can you tell us where we’re at with this? I know we had one a few terms back….
Jamie Palisades: posted citizen list, by statute
Cindy Ecksol: some really great work….
Micael Khandr: TY–ext we’ll talk about death panels . . .
Cindy Ecksol rolls her eyes
Naftali Torok: grins
Micael Khandr: Jamie–is it possible to gather info from each land-ownwer and citizen?
Micael Khandr: More than name?
Kedwyn Parmelee makes sure she is not afk
Cindy Ecksol: Micael I believe that when we did the census for the development of the GMP we had a questionairre
Cindy Ecksol: of course participation is voluntary….and so is the collecting of the data
Cindy Ecksol: would you be interested in taking this on as a project?
Micael Khandr: Cindy, I was thinking along the lines of a publication (or web site) that has names, photos, locations, and interets of citizens/lan-owners to help in community-building.
Micael Khandr: Yes.
Cindy Ecksol: ah, very interesting idea! I love it!
Micael Khandr: I would need the help of that webmaster Jamie is going to hire . . .
Pip Torok: a sort of extension to the profile of each citizen?
Naftali Torok: nice
Micael Khandr: Yes, in one place, Pip.
Jamie Palisades: Micael – we do hav some data pricacy practices, so there’d be limits – but let me take this off line with you, as I have some similar projects in incubation
Cindy Ecksol: and if you are willing to collect the data and help the webmaster organie it, that would be great.
Micael Khandr: Perfect–thanks, Jamie.
Cindy Ecksol: ok, great!
Micael Khandr: Now, about the death panels . . .
Cindy Ecksol: Micael, I will wait for you to ask specifically to have this as an agenda item when you are ready to report
Pip Torok: !!! …
Micael Khandr: OK, Cindy.
Cindy Ecksol: and about the death panels….well, let’s just say that those were never contemplated in the propsed plan
Cindy Ecksol: sorry, Pip, inside joke for US citizens….
Micael Khandr: Rats . . .I’ll break it to Sarah Palin later . . .
Cindy Ecksol: any other concerns of RA members?
Pip Torok wonders what these “death panels” are ..
Kedwyn Parmelee: well i am sure u must have them with your evil socialized medicine Pip
Pip Torok realises what Sarah Palin has been saying about the UK NHS …
Pip Torok: well that evil scheme has saved me since i was 7!
Kedwyn Parmelee: don’t u know if stephen hawking lived in UK he would….wait he does LOL
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: ok, concerns of citizens?
Jamie Palisades smiles. I might stay for a few minutes after adjornment to follow up on Micael’s citizen profiles issue
Micael Khandr: TY
Cindy Ecksol: wow, quiet crowd today!
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, can you think of any announcements that Rose would want made?
Micael Khandr: Can’t vote . .
Jamie Palisades: Cindy, we get the weekly events both into the notecards …
Jamie Palisades: … send aorund and also into the CDS google calendar
Jamie Palisades: .. which is linked on the CDS website
Cindy Ecksol: yes, of course
Jamie Palisades: .. preparations for Oktoberfest underway that’s about it for now
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thank you
Cindy Ecksol: ah, I do have one issue myself
Cindy Ecksol: we need to have an RA archivist who will handle at least the updating of the portal when we pass legislation, and perhaps posting of minutes as well
Cindy Ecksol: I’ve talked to a couple of people and will speak to a few more.
Cindy Ecksol: the archivist is appointed by RA, so when I find someone who is willing I will let RA know and we will approve
Cindy Ecksol: if you know someone who is willing please IM me….
Micael Khandr: If we have a quorum . . .
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: hopefully it will be easier after the end of the summer
Cindy Ecksol: that’s all I have.
Cindy Ecksol: anything else? or can we have a motion to adjourn?
Soro Dagostino: Move Adjounment
Micael Khandr: Second
Pip Torok: seconded
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Micael Khandr: Aye
Pip Torok: aye
Soro Dagostino: YAY!
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Soro Dagostino:
Cindy Ecksol: excellent
Cindy Ecksol: doesn’t always go by my time schedule, but I’m encouraged that we’re relatively efficient
Jamie Palisades: rigth then
Cindy Ecksol: at least compared to some meetings of the past!
Micael Khandr: Nice work, Cindy–ahead of schedule!’

Permalink.

RA Minutes 23 Aug 2009

Cindy Ecksol is in the chair.
Soro Dagostino has indicated consent to be recorded.
Sonja Strom has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: I see we have a quorum, so let’s get started.
Pip Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: agenda and some other documents are in the urn under the table — please click to get your copies
Naftali Torok: hoppaaaaaaa, present…..comingg
Lilith Ivory: Hi Wasp
Cindy Ecksol: and also pleas eclick the recorder on top of the table to indicate your consent to be recorded
Wasp Thor: hello, everyone
Carolyn Saarinen has indicated consent to be recorded.
Rose Springvale has indicated consent to be recorded.
Joaquin Gustav has indicated consent to be recorded.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Cindy I hope that isn’t a practical joke
Lilith Ivory has indicated consent to be recorded.
Naftali Torok: goooooood evening /afternoon/morning alll
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I don’t want to be raking thru the ashes of someone’s ancestor
Cindy Ecksol: uh oh….what, stui?
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: urn was Moon’s idea….
Naftali Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: I promise no ashes
Wasp Thor has indicated consent to be recorded.
StuiChicanne Darkstone has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: in the olden days they kept important documents in urns…haven’t you heard about the Dead Sea Scrolls?
Naftali Torok: ah talking about the mundus/?
Pip Torok: England nor Aussie wd give you any!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I have heard of the dead sea salt
Pip Torok: like your outfit Wasp
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, could you please touch the recorder?
Naftali Torok: thats great for your hair stui
Wasp Thor: thank you
Naftali Torok: lol
StuiChicanne Darkstone: one day I was walking home from work and ended up spending ?120 on that stuff
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I didn’t even want it
Cindy Ecksol: ok, let’s get started.
Cindy Ecksol: chit chat later — I will need to leave on time today
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *whispers*
Jamie Palisades has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: administrative details: for thos ewho haven’t been here, please note the big question mark behind me to my right.
Cindy Ecksol: that is the “question queue” so if you wish to speak, please click it and I will recognize speakers in order.
Cindy Ecksol: we also have a timer, but i prefer not ot use it unless we really need it.
Naftali Torok: yes i am sitting on it now….to keep an eye on it….
Cindy Ecksol: one item I left off the agenda: we need to swear in Stui and Wasp
Naftali Torok: tru
Cindy Ecksol: I propose we do that first.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: no swearing – ladies present
Cindy Ecksol: Stui and Wasp, if you clicked on the urn, you received a copy of the “affirmation” we use.
Naftali Torok: lets hope they are quicker then me, last time…..
Cindy Ecksol: could you please add your name in the appropriate place and paste it into chat now?
Cindy Ecksol: while they are doing that if the rest of you could review the agenda and indicate whether you have any additions or changes that should speed things along
StuiChicanne Darkstone: The Confederation of Democratic Simulators is a democratic state. One of the freedoms embodied in our Constitution is that of religious choice as specified in one of its Founding Documents, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
Out of our respect for diverse religious beliefs about taking oaths as well as for RA members who may be non-religious, the following affirmation does not contain any referrences to any supernatural entities. However, anyone taking office who may wish to do so may add the words “So help me God” [or any other entity] at the end, if they wish so. They may also replace the words “affirm” by “swear” if they are so inclined.
—
Please paste the following text into chat:
I, Stui, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulato
Cindy Ecksol: thank you stui! congratulations and welcome to RA
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *LOL*
Cindy Ecksol: ***** APPPPPPPLLLLAAAUUUSSSSEEEEEEE***********
Naftali Torok: hourah 3 x
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think I pasted too much
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and yet too little
Naftali Torok: better too much than too less
Cindy Ecksol: you did fine
Cindy Ecksol: Wasp? are you with us?
Pip Torok: APPLAUSE
Sonja Strom: Welcome
Wasp Thor: yes
Soro Dagostino: George would approve.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: rs, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
Pip Torok: hi Gwyn!
Wasp Thor: I just have to figure out how to paste it to chat
Wasp Thor: LOL
zaphod Enoch: welcome
Cindy Ecksol: ah, I see
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I would bow but the outfit doesn’t allow it
Rose Springvale: just in the chat bar Wasp
Rose Springvale: it will fit
Naftali Torok: lol
Cindy Ecksol: would you like me to paste for you and you can just say “yes”?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: like a cheese wire
Wasp Thor: yes thank you
Cindy Ecksol: I, Wasp Thor, having been elected as a Member of the Representative Assembly of the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, do solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as such to the best of my ability, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the Confederation of Democratic Simulators, and that I will preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of Confederation of Democratic Simulators.
Wasp Thor: Yes
zaphod Enoch: welcome
Gwyneth Llewelyn notices that Cindy has personality problems and says hi to all, btw
Rose Springvale: bravo!
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: Thank you! and congratulations and welcome to RA
Cindy Ecksol: ***** APPPPPPPLLLLAAAUUUSSSSEEEEEEE***********
Naftali Torok: welcome wasp
Sonja Strom: Welcome Wasp
Jamie Palisades smiles and applauds
Lilith Ivory applauds
Pip Torok: welcome
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Welcome indeed, Wasp
Joaquin Gustav: congratulations, Wasp
Cindy Ecksol: all right, moving along. any changes to agenda?
Soro Dagostino: Welcom Wasp
Pip Torok: “glad to have you on board” ….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: YAY !
Cindy Ecksol: no agenda changes?
Naftali Torok: not for me
Cindy Ecksol: ok, future RA schedule.
Pip Torok: nor from me
Soro Dagostino: Move approval of the Agenda
Cindy Ecksol: Sept 6 is Labor Day in US and I will not be available. But that’s our current schedule
Cindy Ecksol: whoops, yes Soro is right
Cindy Ecksol: can we have a second?
Carolyn Saarinen: Second
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Soro Dagostino: Aye
Pip Torok: aye
Wasp Thor: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Jamie Palisades raises hand for perhaps-dumb question
Naftali Torok: i will not be available next week
Sonja Strom: aye
Naftali Torok: 30 august , rl concert
Cindy Ecksol: motion passes.
Cindy Ecksol: ok…
Cindy Ecksol: dates.
Cindy Ecksol: Naf, no meeting next week
Cindy Ecksol: proposal is for Sept 6 or 13
Naftali Torok: oki
Naftali Torok: clear
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, did you havea comment?
Pip Torok: propose sept 6
Jamie Palisades: Sorry if Im; not up to speed, but did yuo elect a statuoty Deputy LRA for this term? That would matter, in terms of the feasibility of meetigns without Cindy.
Carolyn Saarinen: Usually fortnighly Naf
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oops I don’t remember if we did or not…
Cindy Ecksol: we have not yest done so.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m away camping on 20/21st sept so it works for me
Jamie Palisades smiles – may I suggest you do, fairly soon?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Definitely a good suggestion
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, I don’t believe there’s a constitutional imperative for that, although we can certainly do so.
Jamie Palisades smiles. Only a statutory one,
Cindy Ecksol: wow, did we do that?
Cindy Ecksol: then I guess we should elect one.
Jamie Palisades grins, points at red haired poruguese senator
Jamie Palisades: her fault
Cindy Ecksol: ah, ok.
Cindy Ecksol: thank you for bringing it up.
Jamie Palisades: (and not a bad idea if the LRA ever got incapacitated)
Sonja Strom: hi Idetoshi
Naftali Torok: still trying to translate: statuoty Deputy LRA f
Naftali Torok: lol
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Pip Torok: hello idetoshi
Jamie Palisades: statutory, required by statute. Sorry Nafi
Idetoshi Kenzo: hi all
Rose Springvale: smiles at naf… person to stand in if Cindy is absent
Cindy Ecksol: ok, if no objections, let’s do it.
Naftali Torok: i see
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No objections from me
Cindy Ecksol: In view of his past experience, I would like to nominate my fellow faction member Soro Dagostino as deputy LRA
Naftali Torok: smiles back thankful at rose
Gwyneth Llewelyn would definitely second Soro
Cindy Ecksol: can i get a second on that?
Pip Torok: second
Joaquin Gustav: i second soro too
Wasp Thor: I second it
Cindy Ecksol: thank you Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn points at her own words
Cindy Ecksol: any discussion?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Yay for Soro
Pip Torok: move to vote
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well…. Soro should at least say if he’s available
Cindy Ecksol: Soro?
Naftali Torok: ok for soro
Naftali Torok: no sorrow for soro…..
Soro Dagostino: Yes — thank you for the opportunity
Sonja Strom: or if he wants to
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Naf ))))))
Cindy Ecksol:
Naftali Torok: when he is not sailing….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yay, Soro!
Pip Torok: oooo! Gwyneth Llewelyn: (very!)
Cindy Ecksol: lol! soro is multitasking again i think….but he indicated to me that he would be willing
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Goodie, goodie.
Naftali Torok: great
Cindy Ecksol: I believe Pip has moved for a vote
Soro Dagostino: I said thank you for the opportunity
Naftali Torok: looks around, who’s there finally….
Gwyneth Llewelyn votes aye for Soro as Deputy LRA
Cindy Ecksol: second?
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Pip on the move, sorry
Wasp Thor: I second it
StuiChicanne Darkstone: just so long as it isn’t me doing the stand in – no one would have a clue what I am talking about
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor…
Pip Torok: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: Aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Wasp Thor: AYE
Naftali Torok: lol same for me Stui, but yes Aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles @ Stui
Soro Dagostino: aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: yes I’m one for Soro
Cindy Ecksol: ok, motion carries
Cindy Ecksol: congratulations, Soro!
Sonja Strom: Congratulations and thanks, Soro.
Cindy Ecksol: now next question: I will be out on Sept 6 — can you chair the meeting??
Soro Dagostino: Thank you all.
Pip Torok: yes congratulations
Soro Dagostino: LOL
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Cindy
Cindy Ecksol:
Cindy Ecksol: hey, I’m a practical type!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro that’s the deep end there
Rose Springvale: will you have quorum?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (good, Cindy, good!)
Naftali Torok: mumbles…..boter bij de vis( butter with the fish, as we say in dutch
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ))
Lilith Ivory: hehe
StuiChicanne Darkstone: quorum sounds like an aftershave
Naftali Torok: lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Stui
Cindy Ecksol: unless anyone has objections to the Doodle polling method, I intend to do that for every meeting
Rose Springvale saves that phrase…
Naftali Torok: imao
Soro Dagostino: Yes Ms LRA — I will be available.
Cindy Ecksol: so we will know whether there is aquorum or not ahead of time
Naftali Torok: ecellent Cind
Pip Torok: great idea Doodl
Joaquin Gustav: Doodle worked
Naftali Torok: it worked great for me
Wasp Thor: as long as we have dancing and latin music I say aye
Carolyn Saarinen: I think it IS an aftershave
Gwyneth Llewelyn *scratches head*
Cindy Ecksol: it certainly worked for me — was much easier than showing up and wondering who else would be here!
Naftali Torok: uses nose….
Naftali Torok: spares us time
Naftali Torok: gives more fun in the meetings
Cindy Ecksol: and also an easy way to request a 7-day vote: just poll “no” and you get it automatically
Carolyn Saarinen: Works for me
Cindy Ecksol: old way is fine too — e-mail to LRA
Cindy Ecksol: all right, great!
Cindy Ecksol: moving on.
Cindy Ecksol: Carolyn has an update on the in-world status board investigation
Cindy Ecksol: Caro?
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok
Carolyn Saarinen: I wont take up everyone’s time with all my notes on this, but they are available if any one wants them.
Gwyneth Llewelyn listens…
Cindy Ecksol: (members please use Question Queue to ask questions rather than interrupt persentation)
Carolyn Saarinen: We obviously have people in our community who could make such a system for us, but those with the ability are likely to be busy. If we can get an off-the-shelf system at reasonable cost, I think we should buy. It would save time.
Naftali Torok: yes kisk my A…..::)
Naftali Torok: kick
Carolyn Saarinen: I’ve spoken to the creator of the system which seems to best suit our needs. He tells me we can have a set up for use in multiple locations/multiple avatars for L$1000.
Carolyn Saarinen: So, how do we feel about that?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s insanely cheap!!!
Jamie Palisades: Not going to be a problem from the budget end.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Soro Dagostino
Cindy Ecksol: Soro?
Pip Torok: certainly reasobaly priced
Naftali Torok: time= money, lets do it
Soro Dagostino: Do we want to consider the new phone system set up by Lindens as part of the project?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ^^
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I wonder if I say I’ll pose for a foto for his vendor if he’ll take a bit off the price
Naftali Torok: ah
Carolyn Saarinen: This is the one that has Away and Busy options as well as just on/Off line
Naftali Torok: now thats an intersting project indeed
Naftali Torok: pointing at the phone thing
Cindy Ecksol: I looked at that phoen thing and decided I definitely do NOT want to do it.
Carolyn Saarinen: Everyone’s pics go on the boards stui
Naftali Torok: but lets first end this subject
Cindy Ecksol: yes, thank you naf
StuiChicanne Darkstone: oh what shall I wear ?
Naftali Torok: does the system also have other communication toold
Pip Torok: im with Cindy on the phone thing
Cindy Ecksol: are there any objections to the IDEA of an in-world status board?
Naftali Torok: like mail/ im/ notes etc
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I love the idea
Pip Torok: none from me
Jamie Palisades: Hi, bunny.
Rose Springvale: hi brian!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No objections from me at all, rather the contrary…
Wasp Thor: good idea
Joaquin Gustav: lets do it
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Brian ))9 hello
StuiChicanne Darkstone: so long as I don’t get stalkers
Lilith Ivory: Hi Brian
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Stui
Soro Dagostino: Move approval
Sonja Strom: Second
Brian Livingston waves quietly
Gwyneth Llewelyn can get stalked by anyone, just look at my blog, it always says where I am
Naftali Torok: sends a handkiss to brian
Pip Torok: (your stalkers have leavers!:)
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor of acquiring the online status board system for $100L?
Cindy Ecksol: whoops…$1000L
Gwyneth Llewelyn: L$1000, and aye !
Carolyn Saarinen: 1000
Sonja Strom: aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Wasp Thor: AYE
Naftali Torok: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: oui !
Pip Torok: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: Aye
Cindy Ecksol: ok, great!
Jamie Palisades raises hand on the board status thing
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie?
Jamie Palisades: Shall we take off line the exact details of whetehr the owner matters, archiving, getting reimbursed , all that?
Wasp Thor: where does the momey come from
Jamie Palisades: Wasp, we will reimburse
Cindy Ecksol: Yes, I was just going to suggest that Carolyn get together with you and Rose and work out details
Jamie Palisades: but also with some of these devices the ID of the object “owner” matters
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hmm
Jamie Palisades: ok, good, and thanks Caro
Carolyn Saarinen: So, I’ll get back to the creator.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We always have the “special avatars”…. the content manager, etc
StuiChicanne Darkstone: maybe my box can recieve fan mail too ?
Cindy Ecksol: Carolyn, I’ll leave it in your hands to figure it out with them and report back to us. will need to find locations too.
Jamie Palisades nods
Cindy Ecksol: so still work to be done, but let’s move it forward
Cindy Ecksol: thanks for the great work on this.
Carolyn Saarinen: I can ask him to make delivery to whoever we like I guess
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Joaquin Gustav
Cindy Ecksol: Joaquin?
Joaquin Gustav: ty,
Joaquin Gustav: Did the creator ralk about updates
Joaquin Gustav: talk
Pip Torok: (good point)
Jamie Palisades: can we take that under advisement with Caro and get back to you on details?
Naftali Torok: good point Joa
Carolyn Saarinen: He said he could add other functions later if we needed them, for a fee. will ask about automatic updates on the basic system.
Cindy Ecksol: thank you jamie
Naftali Torok: nods
Joaquin Gustav: ty carolyn
Cindy Ecksol: I think the fee is so low that it’s worth paying for enhancements if necessary
Cindy Ecksol: ok, moving on
Jamie Palisades nods
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Cindy Ecksol: next we have Jamie to talk about regional event expenditures
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie?
Pip Torok: (lovely feeling … bespoke software!)
Jamie Palisades: Roght, let’ see if I can do this one in under the alloted 15 mins
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Jamie Palisades: This is about augmentation to our events budget,
Jamie Palisades: Last year we used this events budget:
a. Major events budget – One per term (like Oktoberfest), for
a total of L$ 60000/yr, so L$ 5000/mo
b. One funded social event per month – L$ 5000/mo
c. I recreation event per sim per year (like skiing) at L$
5000 x 4 / 12 = $L 1666/mo
Jamie Palisades: Bear with me, it’s background
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Jamie Palisades: That totals 11666/month. We probably spent about two third of

(continued)
Last edited by Cindy Ecksol on Sun Aug 23, 2009 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Cindy Ecksol
Master Word Wielder

 
Posts: 447
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Re: RA Minutes 23 Aug 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Aug 23, 2009 4:04 pm
(continued)

that total, last term. Even then, though, We noted then that we were spending about half of what our conservative-projected revenus suggests we ought to spend, on local culture, events and education.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if there’s a bear with you Jamie it’ll make you quicker
Jamie Palisades: I think of you more as a cross than a bear, kitten.
Jamie Palisades: …
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Jamie Palisades: We easily can support more. So, one of the elements I plan to include in next meeting’s planned budget for the term is a set of extra line items.
Jamie Palisades: I chatted with Cindy about this, and we thought it would be a good idea to mention them earlier, at this meeting, so that we can get any initial feedback or reactions now, instead of waiting for next meeting, when it might get lost in all of the budget details.
Jamie Palisades: …
Jamie Palisades: I will propose that we set aside portions of an expanded events budget for four citizen-led small volunteer panels, which (as Gwyneth and I discussed last term) would relly be a delegation of executive branch power, subject to myself and Sudane watching administratively.
Jamie Palisades: The exact numbers are in consultation now — remember I am
making civil service appointments this next week, and want my own team to be consulted — and we can talk about the right *numbers* at our budget consultation meeting, next time. For now, though, I’d like any feedback or reactions to the *concept* :
Jamie Palisades: : and to be specific, on this planned scheme:
Jamie Palisades: 1. A cultural & Arts commission, to seek, develop, consider and be a funding source for activities involving our cultural and museum NGOs, and any embassy/inter-sim ambassador activities
Jamie Palisades: 2. An Alpine regional commission to seek, develop, consider and be a funding source for themed activities in the NFS and AM sims.
Jamie Palisades: 3. An Andalusian regional commission to seek, develop, consider and be a funding source for themed activities in the AA sims.
Jamie Palisades: 4. A Roman regional commission to seek, develop, consider and be a funding source for themed activities in the CN and LA sims. …
Naftali Torok: wow great plans
Jamie Palisades: I plan to propose that the funding be roughly commensurate with the populations in question; and that some regional events (and their budgets) be devolved down to those panels. I also am considering suggesting that one or two chairs for each of those panels be stipended by us, as I suspect some work will be involved. I’d expect their decisions to be made in an informal but publicly transparent process; probably would attend some of their meetigns myself; and we would require that persons who are seeking funding abstain from any vote on their own proposals.
Jamie Palisades: so :
Jamie Palisades: That’s the basic idea. It may change due to the consultations noted above, but still, please expect to see it built into next meeting’s budget plan Comments?
Naftali Torok: hey lets read jamie
Naftali Torok: yu go fast
Gwyneth Llewelyn: )
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Jamie !
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
Naftali Torok: not fair…..ronfl
StuiChicanne Darkstone: allow me to be that bear
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn?
Cindy Ecksol: you have the floor
Jamie Palisades: done open for slings and arrows, Ms LRA
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, I just wish to thank Jamie, for using this term to roll out the huge proposal
Pip Torok: sounds well thought out but wd appreciate the days to really considert the implications
Gwyneth Llewelyn: speaking for myself, I’m quite in favour of that budget!
Cindy Ecksol: (please use the queue if you have comments)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I agree, Pip
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Also, I’d like to understand the reporting method
Gwyneth Llewelyn: from each comission to the Exec
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and know if at least the Exec will present a short briefing on the commisions’ work to the RA)
Jamie Palisades: (I’ll hold responses for a bit, then make then when Cindy likes)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I guess the answer is “yes”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok!
Jamie Palisades: and yes
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, why don’t you respond to each?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks, that’s all ? very good idea, Jamie, thanks so much!
Jamie Palisades: heh heh I just did
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: that was easy.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks for the answer
Cindy Ecksol: ok, Stui, I believe you’re next
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: StuiChicanne Darkstone
StuiChicanne Darkstone: YAY me !
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ok
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I just wonder if it is necessary to have a seperate commission for culture and arts when you have one for each set of sims?
Naftali Torok: nods
Naftali Torok: worth to considder
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmmh
Jamie Palisades: Stui, we have some stuff in CDS — the museums, a sculpture walk, and “embassy” activity come to mind – that are not really them-specific, and affect everyone
StuiChicanne Darkstone: seems like a level of admin that would be worked upon where it could be resolved regionally
Jamie Palisades: *theme-specific
Jamie Palisades: but it;s worth giving a seond though
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* I also like a theme-neutral over-arching group …
Naftali Torok: nods
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It’s good for cohesion.
Jamie Palisades: fooey+ s e c o n d t h o u g h t sorry
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, speaking strictly for myself, I’d support it.
Naftali Torok: hi Micael
Rose Springvale: hey Micael
Pip Torok: hi Micael
Cindy Ecksol: ok, Carolyn, you are next up.
Wasp Thor: Hi Micael
StuiChicanne Darkstone: is it designed to function for CDS ?
Jamie Palisades: this is exactly the kind of feedabck I was hoping for
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Carolyn Saarinen
Jamie Palisades: how so, Stui?
Micael Khandr: Hi Pip.
Micael Khandr: Hi Wasp
Soro Dagostino: Hello Micael
Micael Khandr: Hi Soro
Micael Khandr: Sorry I’m late, Cindy
Cindy Ecksol smiles
Cindy Ecksol: happy to see you
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well my query is, will the arts and cultural commission work towards seeking out opportunities to expand arts fully or work towards funding that which is already functioning ?
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades: ah
Jamie Palisades: up to them we hope for creativity
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (very good question!)
Jamie Palisades: i expect they’d support existing stuff … as part of that … it it works
Cindy Ecksol: I believe Carolyn has a question….Caro, you have the floor
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it would be rather unfair to have an arts commission that cannot assist those with opportunities but no present basis if it is using it’s funds on upkeep primarily
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Carolyn Saarinen: Thanks, first of all:
Carolyn Saarinen: Yay, we’ve won the Ashes! Eat it Ponting!
Carolyn Saarinen: Now
Brian Livingston pokes zaphod
Gwyneth Llewelyn *scratches head*
StuiChicanne Darkstone: (were they in that urn?)
Jamie Palisades: heh
Naftali Torok: lol
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *checks his agenda for particles*
Carolyn Saarinen: Are we also making provision for educational activities that aren’t specifically cultural?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *sniffs*
zaphod Enoch: sorry had to be somewhere else to solve problems
Naftali Torok: looks around in front of screen…
Cindy Ecksol: great question, Carolyn!
Carolyn Saarinen: The other day, a citizen pointed out to me that it’s been repeatedly suggested that there be classes available in the sims
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah! That’s from the Guild budget!
Jamie Palisades: Carolyn, I’d hope we define it that way, yes.
Pip Torok: such as formal classes caro?
Soro Dagostino: sigh
Carolyn Saarinen: such as building/scripting
Jamie Palisades: we have had some exp[eriments with classes through the CDS Guild
Pip Torok: (what Id meant )
Carolyn Saarinen: This was being talked about when I was a CN resident
Jamie Palisades: haven;t always worked out in terms of turnout though
Naftali Torok: yesss, lets pick that idea up again
Jamie Palisades: they tried sort version:” willing teachers, absence of good PR & thus students
Gwyneth Llewelyn is trying to get Moon to come in-world and explain how the Guild classes work
Pip Torok: hi Delia!!
Naftali Torok: Delia
Cindy Ecksol: ok, let’s see…I think Soro is up next. Soro, you have the floor
Naftali Torok: are there still guild classes going on nowadays?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Technically, yes
Soro Dagostino: Thank you.
Naftali Torok: mm
Pip Torok: mmm from me too …
Naftali Torok: there s moon
Naftali Torok: lol looks at ceiling where the moon is raising….
Soro Dagostino: I am a little concerned that regional rivalries might commence.
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Naftali Torok: looks for sunglasses
Moon Adamant: hello all
Pip Torok: id suggest crossing that bridge if we ever came to it, Soro …
Micael Khandr: Regional rivalries?
Rose Springvale: hi moon
Lilith Ivory: Hi Moon
Wasp Thor: Hi Moon
Naftali Torok: monny
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Soro Dagostino
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: StuiChicanne Darkstone
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: zaphod Enoch
Naftali Torok: same q here: Micael Khandr: Regional rivalries?
Cindy Ecksol: I’m skipping Stui right now because he has had a chance to speak.
Cindy Ecksol: Zaph, you had a comment or question?
Naftali Torok: ajj
zaphod Enoch: as for the educational questions i moght be of help
Soro Dagostino: The “Local groups” might lose sight of the integration of CDS.
Soro Dagostino: Done.
Micael Khandr: How are “local groups” defined?
zaphod Enoch: as be still connected to munich i know thea have an educational language shool there called DESK
Carolyn Saarinen: Well, the regions DO differ, cultural/educational rivalry might be a good thing.
zaphod Enoch: it would be great to have a dependance of the desk in cds
Micael Khandr: Just because I don’t like fog . . .
Cindy Ecksol:
zaphod Enoch: offering language courses
Naftali Torok: now that might be an idea, to look for dependances in cds/ Aa
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I believe that perhaps to have a budget sent to each region that can only be used for cultural and art would work better as then it allows areas to save, and even to agree transfer of funds to other regions, rather than it being arranged by who is capable of bring to the table a proposal. Either that or to play to strengths using regions best suited to cultural events and then using other spaces when it is a region specific event.
Cindy Ecksol: ok, might I suggest that we’re getting into some detail here that is at a bit deeper level than we can handle in this forum?
Jamie Palisades: Ms LRA, I have a feeling we could go all day on this one. Maybe I shoudl post to Forums, so we can have more chat there?
Cindy Ecksol: What I’d like to suggest is that we take this conversation onto the forums
Pip Torok: agree cindy
Jamie Palisades chuckles
Cindy Ecksol: ah, thanks, jamie!
Micael Khandr: Agreed.
Naftali Torok: agree
Gwyneth Llewelyn notices how Cindy and Jamie are in sync
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
zaphod Enoch: well whatever
Jamie Palisades: if only, Red, if only
Cindy Ecksol: not a bad thing…and i did NOT prompt that!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Jamie
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks all.
Soro Dagostino: Motion to postpone.
Cindy Ecksol: and thanks to Jamie for brining this forward
Micael Khandr: Can we discuss Jamie and Cindy on the forums, too?
Pip Torok: second
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Jamie Palisades: Soro? not really needed – no action item on table will occur in budget presentation
Wasp Thor: aye
Micael Khandr: Aye, aye
Jamie Palisades: but hey, knock yourselfs out
Pip Torok: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Cindy Ecksol: true…but good to close discussion
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye ? but I believe that the Exec has just presented a “draft overview” really
Jamie Palisades nods
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, well, details will follow…
Naftali Torok: oki
Cindy Ecksol: thank you all….and please DO get in the habit of checking the forums for ongoing discussion
Cindy Ecksol: it’s a good thing!
Soro Dagostino: so long as its over.
Cindy Ecksol: next….
Jamie Palisades dusts off chair in plebe section, sits down carefully so as not to poke self in butt with sword
Cindy Ecksol: I believe Naftali would like to inroduce a bill to change election dates. Please note that this is a “first reading” and I would like to suggest in advance that we not vote today on this
Cindy Ecksol: but let’s hear Naftali first. Naf?
Naftali Torok: tries not to become tooo enthousiat……..looking at her rl calendar in future…..
Naftali Torok: oh yes
Naftali Torok: lets see
Naftali Torok: Whereas there seems to be general agreement that the current election schedule forces campaigning into times of the year when most citizens are more distracted by their real lives than usual, we propose the following:
Amend Article I, Section 2 of the CDS Constitution to read:
“New RAs shall take office on 1 June and 1 December.”
Naftali Torok: smiles…
Cindy Ecksol: thank you naf
Cindy Ecksol: do we have a second to naftali’s motion?
Naftali Torok: but totally agress with what she has written
Pip Torok: second
Cindy Ecksol: thanks, pip.
Wasp Thor: I second it
Cindy Ecksol: discussion?
Micael Khandr: Being new–when would campaigning be then?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, everything else would start one month earlier?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: e.g. campagning; roll call, etc
Naftali Torok: and not in the bussy xmas time
Micael Khandr: May 1 and Nove 1 then?
Naftali Torok: or in the summer vacation times
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I would think it best to hold the whole process in the new year
Micael Khandr: Why, Stui?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: for personally I am very busy before Christmas
Pip Torok: how wd this affect oktober fest?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oooh lol
StuiChicanne Darkstone: in my work it’s the very busiest time
Naftali Torok: yes but thats just why….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: OktoberPArtyFair
Cindy Ecksol: campaigning would be mostly post-oktoberfest
Cindy Ecksol: which was one of the reasons for picking these dates
Naftali Torok: in between okt fest and xams
StuiChicanne Darkstone: from October – december it’s chaotic
Moon Adamant: sorry all
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Soro Dagostino
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: zaphod Enoch
Naftali Torok: ajjj did we forgot about Moon?
Cindy Ecksol: no….
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Micael Khandr: Moon left.
Naftali Torok: mm
zaphod Enoch: i do have bigger building probs in the biergarten
Cindy Ecksol: OK, Soro, did you have a question on this?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: why not Jan start for Feb? which is always a bit less busy
Gwyneth Llewelyn: She doesnt have a lot of free time; if we come back to the subject of classes later, Moon might log in again
zaphod Enoch: allmy builds are send beack to me
Rose Springvale: stui, that’s what it is now
Cindy Ecksol: (queue please)
Cindy Ecksol: we are discussing Naftali’s proposal
Naftali Torok: great gwyn thanks
Cindy Ecksol: Soro, you have the floor
zaphod Enoch: would be good if anybody can figure out what is happening
Soro Dagostino: It was requested to present the motion – while I was looking — it got done.
Soro Dagostino: done.
Cindy Ecksol: Zap, do you have a question on this topic?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sonja Strom
Cindy Ecksol: Sonja, Zaph is passing on this…you have the floor
Sonja Strom: I would like to let everybody know there is a poll and conversation about this topic in the CDS forum, here viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2534 Thank you.
zaphod Enoch: nope sorry i did wrong
Naftali Torok: ok here is the motion again: Whereas there seems to be general agreement that the current election schedule forces campaigning into times of the year when most citizens are more distracted by their real lives than usual, we propose the following:
Amend Article I, Section 2 of the CDS Constitution to read:
“New RAs shall take office on 1 June and 1 December.”
Cindy Ecksol: thank you sonja
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: In theory, I have absolutely no problem with the changes.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: In practice, I wonder if we shouldn’t do a broader poll?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: e.g. a formal referendum…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Changing election dates is a major thing,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and
Carolyn Saarinen nods
Cindy Ecksol: lol! we can use doodle!!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Eeek
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol
Pip Torok: doodle WOULD be neater!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: it would also require changing some of the clauses on the AA/CDS agreement
Cindy Ecksol: ?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: e.g. instead of 6 months for the transition phase,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: there would be only 5
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It’s a very minor thing though
Naftali Torok: mmmm
Naftali Torok: nods
Pip Torok: a “short parliament” …
Cindy Ecksol: ok, good point.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Cindy Ecksol: Rose, you had a question or comment?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m ok with doing the poll on Doodle, although, as a matter of principle, I don’t like that we start using a lot of off-world tools
Rose Springvale: two actually
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry, I’m finished)
Rose Springvale: one, i’m sure the AA CDS agreement is amenable to shortened transition
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (go ahead, Rose )
Naftali Torok: agree with gwyn
Rose Springvale: but more importantly
Gwyneth Llewelyn agrees with Rose too
Rose Springvale: i’m very much opposed to taking more off world
Rose Springvale: to doodle or elsewhere
Rose Springvale: we are in SL to be in SL, nto on the net all the time
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Cindy Ecksol:
Gwyneth Llewelyn *covers her mouth*
Pip Torok: what wd you propose Rose?
Rose Springvale: i don’t even like the forums, as you all know
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Bravo!!!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oops
Micael Khandr: Brava?
Rose Springvale: anything official we do should be done with total transparency in world. imho
Rose Springvale: done
Jamie Palisades smiles – CSDF favors direct citizen referenda now? And offworld?
Naftali Torok: must say i only started to read them regularly last weeks
Cindy Ecksol: good point
Cindy Ecksol: ok, if we want to do a poll, we can certainly do it in-world as we did for the GMP survey
Micael Khandr: We have forums? (just kidding)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I find forums to be unregulated bitch fests normally
Naftali Torok: good idea
Naftali Torok: and fun as well
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sonja Strom
Naftali Torok: it makes us creative inworld
Cindy Ecksol: Sonja? you have the floor
Pip Torok: yes … but they do get news and discussion going Stu ….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (times change, Jamie )
Sonja Strom: I see one problem with a Doodle poll, which is that it would *not* require a confirmation the participant was a citizen of the CDS. I kind of wonder why it would be in any way better than the poll already existing in the CDS forum. Thank you.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh excellent point, Sonja!
Cindy Ecksol: yes, so true!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hmm
Naftali Torok: pip not everybody has that much time….
Cindy Ecksol: it was just a thought
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but would you go to a tabloid newspaper to gain your insight ?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie?
Cindy Ecksol: (and then Soro and then I’m going to call “time”)
Micael Khandr: Cough . . .
Cindy Ecksol: looks like we lost jamie…

(continued)
Cindy Ecksol
Master Word Wielder

 
Posts: 447
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 8:37 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Top
Re: RA Minutes 23 Aug 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Aug 23, 2009 4:07 pm
(continued)

Jamie Palisades smiles. Two quick things
Jamie Palisades: nope
Cindy Ecksol: or not
Naftali Torok: whisles at jamie
Naftali Torok: get a wake
Jamie Palisades: 1. as to doodle, I think we need to work and talk more about whether citizen consultations should be off world. As an RA tool, it does not trouble me if the results are always made transparent
Naftali Torok: he vanished
Naftali Torok: oh sorry
Jamie Palisades: but as a general citizen tool, he, even MORE diffusion of our community? not so sure
Jamie Palisades: second
Carolyn Saarinen: Good servants, bad masters
Jamie Palisades: 2. as to the dates, I just have not heard any reason why a campiagn in November is any more or less annoying than a campaign in january,
Jamie Palisades: done, thanks
Gwyneth Llewelyn claps
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Soro Dagostino
Cindy Ecksol: Soro? a comment?
Soro Dagostino: I think the January time for a campaign is a good time.
Soro Dagostino: It lets us focus on governerment — not social and other affairs.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: new broom and all that
Soro Dagostino: done.
Cindy Ecksol: thx
Cindy Ecksol: Can I get a motion to defer this item to next meeting?
Soro Dagostino: So Move.
Naftali Torok: nods
Pip Torok: second
Cindy Ecksol: thx
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Sonja Strom: aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Naftali Torok: yep
Pip Torok: aye
Wasp Thor: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: YEP !!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: abstain…
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Cindy Ecksol: naf, if you will post that text on the forum we can discuss there.
Naftali Torok: oki
Micael Khandr: Aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Cindy Ecksol: thanks everyone for insightful comments
Cindy Ecksol: ok, concerns of RA members?
Naftali Torok: yes
Sonja Strom: yes
Sonja Strom: I would like to share some information with you.
Cindy Ecksol: is that “yes” you have concerns or something else?
Naftali Torok: smiles
Cindy Ecksol: (queue is easier for me to tell)
Cindy Ecksol: naftali?
Naftali Torok: as an Ra member as well as a citizen , i just wanna give my concern about new building and terraforming in our sims…..might be a futrure concern…
Naftali Torok: more specific, the plot of Brian
Brian Livingston: Wha?
Naftali Torok: not yu brian
Naftali Torok: but what is going to happen with your former land
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What is Brian plotting?
Naftali Torok: check it out there, if yu walk from Am to CN
Brian Livingston sighs in relief and wipes a bead of sweat off his brow… his evil plans remain undiscovered
Naftali Torok: yu crash
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Soro Dagostino: Digging a Rabbit hole.
Naftali Torok: lol
Cindy Ecksol:
Naftali Torok: exactly
Rose Springvale: actually the land is owned by Aliasi now
Cindy Ecksol: ok, maybe better handled with Jamie and Aliasi?
Soro Dagostino: Naftali = Alice
Naftali Torok: yes and everybody is free to devellop his fantasy, but i think
Naftali Torok: its good to keep in mind that we have a certain landcape theme
Naftali Torok: oki
Naftali Torok: just wanna mention this theme
Cindy Ecksol: Sonja?
Sonja Strom: I would like to let the RA know I am founding a village at the base of the largest mountains on the original mainland, on the snow sims.
Sonja Strom: It is called Arosa.
Sonja Strom: That area has the best skiing I have found in the SL world.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes
Pip Torok wonders about moslem architexture in LA …
Sonja Strom: I would be happy to work together with the CDS on this project, possibly for the village to become a franchulate of the CDS – that is, a part of the Confederation on the mainland.
Naftali Torok: lol, thinking of wintersports
Cindy Ecksol: ah, interesting!
Sonja Strom: As you might imagine with it being mainland area, at the moment it is disorganized.
Sonja Strom: But there are already several nice houses there and a pretty good feeling overall, with scenic mountains in the background.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Very interesting
Cindy Ecksol: thanks, sonja! will look forward to hearing more
Sonja Strom: I would be happy to let you know any more of the particulars about it.
Sonja Strom: Thank you.
Cindy Ecksol: anyone else with concerns? citizens?
Sonja Strom:
Cindy Ecksol: /next
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Naftali Torok
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sonja Strom
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Carolyn Saarinen
Cindy Ecksol: ah,m there we go!
Cindy Ecksol: Carolyn?
Carolyn Saarinen: Me first?
Cindy Ecksol: yes please
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok, only to refer back to the point I made earlier.
Carolyn Saarinen: A citizen did ask what the current staus of the education/classes scheme was. I think I need to talk to the Guild about that. Correct?
Cindy Ecksol: yes….definitely
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok I’ll follow it up.
Cindy Ecksol: and if necessary let’s put on next agenda
Carolyn Saarinen nods
Brian Livingston has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: was kind of aside track today
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Rose Springvale: Three things
Rose Springvale: 1, next week is the anniversary of the LA mundus ceremony
Naftali Torok: nods
Rose Springvale: i’ve had no response to my posting on it…
Rose Springvale: so am not sure if it should be cancelled
Naftali Torok: thinks , need to clear up my inventory to find a newobject…..
Rose Springvale: 2. Solomon Mosely is planning a panel discussion on Health Care issues for Sept 5
Rose Springvale: that will be held in the Al Andalus Auditorium
Soro Dagostino: IN a boxing ring?
Rose Springvale: i’ll be gone that weekend, so he might appreciate some help if anyone has time
Rose Springvale: 3. I have sent out the first call for floats for the Oktoberfest parade
Rose Springvale: so please let me know you will do it
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (2. is at which hour?)
Rose Springvale: its the same amount of work for 2 floats as 20
Naftali Torok: i am available for Mundus ceremony
Rose Springvale: hold on, let me get the info
Brian Livingston hopes it’s not a death panal… those are scary.
Naftali Torok: lol
Rose Springvale: i thnk he’s planning for 1 pm on the fifth, but i dont’ see it on the calendar righ tnow
Micael Khandr: I thought we discussed death panels last week . . . ?:)
Pip Torok hopes Sarah doesnt venture to the UK .. (death panels indeed!:)
Naftali Torok: looks at Brian,(missing his Rabbit hole….and specially the vege garden.)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (ok, I might be able to help, Rose ? at least push people towards the right place and such!)
Lilith Ivory does still not know what that means
Rose Springvale: as for the panel.. he is planning to bring in experts from the major political parties and some neutral people too
Rose Springvale: just politics Lilith
Lilith Ivory:
Cindy Ecksol: ok, very good. thanks rose
Rose Springvale: done unless questions
Naftali Torok: looks on her virtual watch…..feels her stomache…hungry
Soro Dagostino: Move to adjourn
Carolyn Saarinen: 2Lives unworthy of life” You know who I mean
Cindy Ecksol: thx, soro
Pip Torok: second
Cindy Ecksol: (love how the RA reads my mind)
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor
Sonja Strom: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: Aye
Naftali Torok: good
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I had just a tiny thing to say…)
Pip Torok: aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Wasp Thor: aye
Jamie Palisades: so speak
Micael Khandr: aye
Rose Springvale: i’ll listen Gwyn
Naftali Torok: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: only with permission of Miz LRA
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and lol
Naftali Torok: lol
Cindy Ecksol: we’re listening
Naftali Torok: eras open
Cindy Ecksol: go ahead gwyn, and then I’ll adjourn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It’s easy really
Sonja Strom’s ears perk up
Soro Dagostino: As usual
Gwyneth Llewelyn: last week, during the informal meeting,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: people were talking about getting a “social site”
Jamie Palisades: feh, her power dissapates with the gavel this is just an assemblage of rowdies now
Jamie Palisades: mm hmmmmm
Gwyneth Llewelyn: for CDS citizens to share interests, tell everybody who’s who and so on
Gwyneth Llewelyn: well
Naftali Torok: ah
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Try this: http://social.slcds.info/
Gwyneth Llewelyn: See if that somehow fits your ideas
Cindy Ecksol: ah, great!
Cindy Ecksol: and let’s discuss on forums, ok?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: If not, well, we always have the forums…
Naftali Torok: a getting-everybody-to-know-play….
Cindy Ecksol: I really need to run…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes .)
Cindy Ecksol: thanks all!
Joaquin Gustav: ty gwyneth
Naftali Torok: thanks cindy
Cindy Ecksol: meeting adjourned….

Permalink.

RA Minutes 6 Sept 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:18 am
Meeting on 2009-09-06
Those present:
Pip Torok is in the chair.
Lilith Ivory has indicated consent to be recorded.
Higgs Magnifico: and the point is ?
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino: We will “try” to follow some order today.
Higgs Magnifico: thats dificult though
Soro Dagostino: Once the meeting commences, you sould touch the Question symbol to place your statement in order.
Soro Dagostino: Hello Jamie
Joaquin Gustav: Hello jamie
Jamie Palisades: Good morning , and such other times as it is
Soro Dagostino: If your statement is over long — I’ll cough.
Soro Dagostino:
Lilith Ivory: Hi Jamie, Hi Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi!
Soro Dagostino: Hello Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you PiP!
Joaquin Gustav: Hello gwynete
Higgs Magnifico: hi to the new
Jamie Palisades attempts to negotiate the chairs for hoi polloi, with mixed results
Carolyn Saarinen: AO off Jamie?
Pip Torok: brb for drink of COLD water …
Soro Dagostino: do try to be civil and allow our business to proceed.
Jamie Palisades: actually Caro, i did – but with a slow rez, I got the phsyical chair prim first (with a bad sit target uinexplicably), not the poseball over it
Higgs Magnifico: dont get drunk pip
Higgs Magnifico: lol
Carolyn Saarinen: Brought my own this week
Pip Torok: not on adam’s ale Higgs
Jamie Palisades: wise. I;’ll wait for the chair poseballs and grab them when they arrive .. rather lke my strategy with Senator Llewellyn there
Soro Dagostino: Hello Danton
Lilith Ivory: Hi Danton
Pip Torok: hi Danton
Soro Dagostino: Lets begin?
Higgs Magnifico: hey danton
Soro Dagostino: Would everyone touch the recorder and consent to recordation.
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino has indicated consent to be recorded.
Carolyn Saarinen has indicated consent to be recorded.
StuiChicanne Darkstone has indicated consent to be recorded.
Sonja Strom has indicated consent to be recorded.
Higgs Magnifico has indicated consent to be recorded.
Joaquin Gustav has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades has indicated consent to be recorded.
Danton Sideways: Hi all
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Danton, hello!
Danton Sideways has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino: The Agenda is a little short, are there any revisions?
Higgs Magnifico: in Bozonion Higgs perhaps
Carolyn Saarinen: I have acouple of points of info, but they can wait.
Soro Dagostino: Please, we can add them as new business?
Carolyn Saarinen: Sure
Gwyneth Llewelyn apologises in advance for any signs of afk’ishness
Soro Dagostino: Carolyn?
Carolyn Saarinen: Yes, fo you want me to raise them when we get to new business?
Soro Dagostino: Just tell the group the topics.
Micael Khandr: Kuzenteit
Soro Dagostino: So they get mentioned in the Agenda.
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok, updates on the online indicator and on education in CDS
Soro Dagostino: Thank you.
Soro Dagostino: Any other amendments to the Agenda?
Pip Torok: yes … one from me Soro
Soro Dagostino: Pip — please
Pip Torok: (sorry i meant one addition at the end)
Soro Dagostino: New Business?
Pip Torok: yes
Soro Dagostino: Topic?
Pip Torok: clearance of an LA plot (by Liliths house) of Symos exhibition
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmmh clearing of a plot is mostly the Executive’s duty, unless you’re suggesting that the RA authorises some very special use of it…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and even that would be mostly an Executive function, Pip!)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: IMHO…
Jamie Palisades: well, let it be a question then
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok A question it shall be
Soro Dagostino: The topic is added as a new item of business.
Soro Dagostino: A correction from the chair — I seem to have forgotten Jamies report.
Jamie Palisades: It’s in the written agenda
Soro Dagostino: Oh?
Soro Dagostino: I guess it is.
Soro Dagostino: Sorry.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Indeed it is
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Soro Dagostino: Any other changes to the Agenda?
Soro Dagostino: Is there a motion to approve the amended agenda?
Micael Khandr: so move
Carolyn Saarinen: seconded
Soro Dagostino: Moved and seconded
Soro Dagostino: Any discussion?
Soro Dagostino: Ready to vote?
Micael Khandr: Aye
Soro Dagostino: All in favor
Pip Torok: aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Micael Khandr: Aye, aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: me hearties
Soro Dagostino: Thos opposed
Soro Dagostino: Motion carried.
Micael Khandr: That’s arrr, Stui . . .
Soro Dagostino: Now to the report of the Chancellor . .
Soro Dagostino: Jamie, you have the floor.
Jamie Palisades smiles, stands up
Jamie Palisades: Good day all.
Jamie Palisades: Not a long one, today.
Jamie Palisades: We will take up another issue of interest to me next on the agenda, which is the cultural commissions –
Jamie Palisades: so, not going to talk about that in this segment.
Jamie Palisades: Not much for this session — the budget presentation doesn’t have as much utility in the absence of both Cindy and Rose, who are both out this week as you know, so I asked her to hold it over to your next meeting.
Jamie Palisades: ..
Jamie Palisades: I am bringing several more parcels of land in CN on line as commercial properties, this week (under the special bid process approved last year).
Jamie Palisades: CN has by the way proves tougher to sell.
Jamie Palisades: I suspect it’s overpriced, and — a nod to Arria — probably needs a more uniform price per prim, compared to the rest of CDS>
Jamie Palisades: That, in my view, is a major change that requires your review — though it’s always hard to say, with our tangle of law …
Jamie Palisades: but really, a sim-wide rent change is an n act to decrease land revenue
Jamie Palisades: so ought to come heren according to me
Robert Galland has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades: thus, expect a proposal this term, on that
Jamie Palisades: if the Guild springs back to life, I;d hope to involve them
Jamie Palisades: ..
Jamie Palisades: We also are waiting for the completion of terraforming on the Monastery sim, and the joining sims between AA and CN, so they can be approved — and added to our GMP. There were some vacations; I think that all will get done fair early in this month, September.
Jamie Palisades: (As the US huromist says, with vacations and all, it’s been a slow month here in Lake Wobegon)
Jamie Palisades: ..
Jamie Palisades: Same comment, unfortunately, on our web presence. I would liek to see out main materials on an easier-to-use, more WYSIWYG platform, and, as I said just before Gwyn tried her bootleg project, to add light social networking. But again, some of the protagnoists are offline for AUgust, coming back now we hope. Expect to see some other prototypes cropping up in beta soon
Jamie Palisades: some of yuo may have looked at the tool Gwyneth posted at the domain she controls, social.slcds,info
Jamie Palisades: I am equally worried about the eas eof use on our main site http://www.slcds.info
Jamie Palisades: CMS systems are not always simpleton-friendly
Jamie Palisades: nd we donlt want to disenfranshie simpletons
Jamie Palisades: especially as you have one for your chancellor
Jamie Palisades: ..
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m a simpleton
Micael Khandr: True . . .
Soro Dagostino: And Deputy LRA )
Jamie Palisades: I;m in good company then
Jamie Palisades: ..
Jamie Palisades: As we prepare for Carolyn’s RA member online indicator, i expect we also should plan to talk about what to do with public property in CDS again. After all – it ought to BE somewhere. There is an old, rather outdated and never completed study of all public buildings … SOME parts of which we should revisit, to settle some questions that will guide building and rebuiiding. Let me just mention some of them now, so that we are all thinking about the topic.
Jamie Palisades: for example
Jamie Palisades: 1. Will this CN location be the RA’s permanent home?
Jamie Palisades: 2. Same question for the SC and the Rathaus in NFS.
Jamie Palisades: 3. Should the ground floor of the Rathaus be redone to front on the Platz, so that it .. and not two houses on the main platz which could be commercial .. as the NFS welcome center for the government?
Jamie Palisades: 4. Should we not have some CDS government functions housed in AA? And, where?
Jamie Palisades: that sort of thing
Jamie Palisades: So please start thinkng about it
Jamie Palisades: Soro, may I tajke up Pip’s question as a question at this time? I;m done for now otherwise
Soro Dagostino: Yes, its time for questions
Jamie Palisades: (so open for that and any other questions)
Jamie Palisades: Pip? You were talking about the 79AD exhibit?
Pip Torok: shall I frame it as a question?
Jamie Palisades: well, is it time to make it go away?
Soro Dagostino: Please touch the question mark for a turn
Jamie Palisades: and ought we find anotgher home for it?
Pip Torok: Now that the exhibition has been there for a year (maybe a little less) and considering that the function was to aid the sale of plots in LA (which are now nearly all sold) isn’t it time to dismantle that exhibition? (done)
Pip Torok: (sorry … forgot about the questionmark
Jamie Palisades: OK good point, Will so. I rather like it, and will see if we can;t get the righs to have it in some public space.
Jamie Palisades: ,any other Q, Mr LRA?
Soro Dagostino: Any others?
Pip Torok: One thing we might consider is a similar exhibition featuring Moorosh architecture
Jamie Palisades: oo nice idea — i wonder if there;s a source we can get at
Carolyn Saarinen: Satir
Jamie Palisades nods
Jamie Palisades: good idea
Soro Dagostino: Any other Q’s for Jamie?
Jamie Palisades: Ill stay up for the “culture commissions” idea, then, if that;’s OK
Soro Dagostino:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, please, I was going to ask if you have any more ideas to share with us on that, Mr Chancellor ))
Pip Torok: Yes one … is it the defacto policy that _themes_ be highlighted by their separation from each other in differing sims?
Soro Dagostino: next on the Agenda
Soro Dagostino: Please get in line.
Jamie Palisades: interesting. Can you explain that a little, Pip? Do we do that now?
Soro Dagostino: Order please
Jamie Palisades: oops – as soon as Soro tells me who;s next
Soro Dagostino: No one.
Micael Khandr: Question mark . . .
Soro Dagostino: Is the meet
Pip Torok: yes … in the middle of LA (a roman sim) appeared a non-roman (Persian) building … that concerns me
Soro Dagostino: Order please.
Soro Dagostino: Micael
Soro Dagostino: You have the floor.
Micael Khandr: No, Soro, just reminding people to use the question mark to queue up–sorry
Soro Dagostino: The Matter before us is now the Regiona activity commissiions.
Pip Torok: Sorry Soro, I forgot yet again
Soro Dagostino: Who wishes to speak
Micael Khandr: Caro
Carolyn Saarinen: are we still on the question jamie raised?
Soro Dagostino: That is the item before the body
Jamie Palisades smiles politely c licks big “?” so as to pick up that line of chat.
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok, my two penn’orth
Soro Dagostino: Touch the ? Mark to set order.
Soro Dagostino: Caro
Carolyn Saarinen: I’d advocate consistancy of theme within sims. Although some variety can seem like a good idea, the end result can be Mainland, which no-one likes. Secondly…
Soro Dagostino: Yes?
Carolyn Saarinen: and more tricky is the matter of sims side by side. I haven’t looked lately, but IMO the juxtaposition of CN and an alpine resort looks messy.
Carolyn Saarinen: Each is ok by itself, but proximity makes them jar.
Soro Dagostino: That may be a little off topic.
Carolyn Saarinen: Sure
Jamie Palisades scratches his head, squints at agenda, looks at the chair. May I suggest that some of us still are in Question Time, and ask the chair whether he wants us to take that up now?
Soro Dagostino: Stui
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well Sorry I am rather confused as to which point we are presently debating
Sonja Strom: lol
Soro Dagostino: REgional Activity commissions
Gwyneth Llewelyn *chuckles*
StuiChicanne Darkstone: okidoky
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I might make comment later
StuiChicanne Darkstone: sorry
Soro Dagostino: Jamie and Pip moved into it.
Soro Dagostino: Jamie?
Soro Dagostino: Your next
Jamie Palisades nods
Jamie Palisades: Accepting the ruling that we are on item 3, that is the topic for which my hand is raised. We can chat about Pip and Caro’s other quetsion after the meeting, or at the end of the agenda, if you like. Now. As to the cultural commissions … to recap …
Jamie Palisades: I would like the thematic neighborhoods to take control of their own programming, and devolve much of our events budget down there. We’ve talked about this, and done some experimenting, for a while now.
Jamie Palisades: …
Jamie Palisades: Event programming, and event control, both are executive functions.We are talking about devolving the programming half — Choosing artists, venues, actually hosting the event.
Jamie Palisades: …
Jamie Palisades: By event control I mean approving payment terms and making payment so that people don’t pay themselves, or pay extraordinary amounts.
Jamie Palisades: …
Jamie Palisades: just as an example
Jamie Palisades: AA has long has a Friday event which Joaquin here hosts
Jamie Palisades: he;s good at it
Jamie Palisades: it works
Jamie Palisades: more or less on its own
Joaquin Gustav: ty
Jamie Palisades: (and do go attend – great dancing , great music )
Jamie Palisades: but from an admin point of view
Jamie Palisades: my poitn is, we shoudl be etting that sort of thing happen, and getting the gov;’ out of the way
Jamie Palisades: other than to write cheques
Jamie Palisades: and, instead of me or you the RA or the PIO picking it all
Jamie Palisades: let’s have informal town halls at the themes locales from time to time, to affirm those choices
Jamie Palisades: as Gwyn pointed out
Jamie Palisades: this is not really a new formal structure, but rather, under our laws …
Jamie Palisades: .. and executive branch decision to delegate
Jamie Palisades: .. while leaving the money issues up here, where you can swat me (or whoever) if it gets out of control
Jamie Palisades: done
Jamie Palisades: Last meeting I asked for feedback – and here we are
Soro Dagostino: Do you think it in order to refer this question to your office?
Jamie Palisades: Soro, no action from RA required: this is a consultation
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Exactly ))
Soro Dagostino: I don’t see need for RA to take action
Pip Torok: agree
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ agrees with Jamie and Soro and Pip
Jamie Palisades: (which from a cold point of view, is a very nice way of saying … your chance to stop me if you like )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ?
Soro Dagostino: Micael — your next in order
Jamie Palisades: ( which I think I ought to provide, when we make big changes )
Micael Khandr: TY, Soro–
Micael Khandr: I agree with Jamie, btw
Micael Khandr: My question/issue is thatjust as the neighborhoods determine theri own cultural activities, perhaps the neighborhoods should also decide building issues–the topic we discussed earlier.
Jamie Palisades: ooo interesting – will reply when it;s in order
Soro Dagostino: Point of order . . .
Soro Dagostino: The chair believed the two issues were within the regional activity discussion.
Soro Dagostino: Proceed
Jamie Palisades: ?
Micael Khandr: ?
Soro Dagostino: Hmmmm, The topic is within the Agenda item.
Micael Khandr: Are we waiting for others to weigh in, Soro?
Soro Dagostino: Regional commisions
Jamie Palisades: just waiting for direction as to whether we take up Micael’s topic, I am in queue to answer him if so
Micael Khandr: Or for me to say something more?
Soro Dagostino: Gwyn?
Soro Dagostino: Wait one.
Soro Dagostino: That is what I was saying — you were in order micheal
Soro Dagostino: The architectural issue was properly before the body.
Soro Dagostino: Proceed
Micael Khandr: Well, I think that the more authority we can push down to the hoods the better–with oversight at the top level, as Jamie suggests
Pip Torok: agree
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I debate
Soro Dagostino: Is there a proposal regarding structure?
Micael Khandr: I suggest further that the overall rules be basic parameters, and that each hood organize their decision process according to their traditions.
Micael Khandr: That each hood’s plan come here for approval.
Micael Khandr: But might be different from each other.
Soro Dagostino: Or to the chancellor.
Pip Torok: agree with M’s last sentence
Micael Khandr: Yes.
Micael Khandr: I’m done.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I wonder who at hood level will put forward plans
Soro Dagostino: Gwyn — your next in order
Carolyn Saarinen pokes her with a stick
Soro Dagostino: Stui — if you would touch the ? — you would be next.
Micael Khandr: Bless you, Stui . . .
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I did
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it says I am already in the queue
Soro Dagostino: Hmmm, , I see now.
Jamie Palisades: me too, some time ago
Carolyn Saarinen: keeps tellin me I’m already in the queue
Soro Dagostino: Proceed
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I proceed?
Soro Dagostino: Yes
StuiChicanne Darkstone: tk u
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well I have a lot of concerns with regard to this proposal and think that it requires more detail
Carolyn Saarinen: Should be a specific agenda item?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: on account that in AA there is not an effective lower level authority to decide a plan
Soro Dagostino: We had ask for folk to post to the forums
Micael Khandr: I disagree.
Soro Dagostino: But none did.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I don’t believe in using the forums personally
Sonja Strom: Soro, where was that in the forum? I don’t remember seeing it there.
Jamie Palisades smiles and keeps poking the big “?”, and eventually shrugs & makes a sign of the evil eye at it
Pip Torok: But how then do you communicate concerns between meetings, Stu?
Soro Dagostino: Jamie
Soro Dagostino: You are next.
Micael Khandr: We did agree to use the forums, Soro, although some objected to out-of-world conversation. I disagree with Stui’s assertion that there is no lower-levelaauthorityi n nAA
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well I would sooner communicate directly
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry, as said, I’m very afk’ish today and please apologise for that; I’ll let Jamie speak, he might, after all clarify the questions I had )
Jamie Palisades: rioght
Soro Dagostino: Jamie
Jamie Palisades: We have several threads Let me take up two of them, then see if we WANT to take up the third.
Jamie Palisades: (1) is short
Jamie Palisades: As for local governance styles, I agree with Micael. Whatever the issue — cultural events or otherwise — if we wish to delegate, we should identify a convener/protagnoist or two, and let them use whatever process is locally sensible, as long as it is open to all and transparent> This avoids another layer of overgovernment.
Jamie Palisades: (2) As for *land* issues .. which SEEMS to be what we’re discussing
Jamie Palisades: Micael, there is sim design, covenant writing, and covenant enforcement. The first two are rare and episodic — and require RA approval — so let me focus on the third, which is the recurring maintenance in-the-ordinary-course one.
Jamie Palisades: FYI, the rough process now, is that local theme compliance is a subset of land covenant compliance. As with all such, a problem is initiated either by (rare) spontaneous inspection, or by a complaint to the executive branch. I have in fact received one about one of the matters mentioned — In LA, not in AA, by the way.

(continued)
Last edited by Cindy Ecksol on Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
Cindy Ecksol
Master Word Wielder

 
Posts: 447
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Re: RA Minutes 6 Sept 2009
by Cindy Ecksol » Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:19 am
(continued)

Jamie Palisades: ..
Jamie Palisades: One who follows our ways, closely, will note that these things usually take 4-6 weeks to work through — and are usually only disussed publicly when a resolution is reached. Bear in mind, it’s very much like the city inspector coming to you to tell you that you must take down your garage.
Jamie Palisades: It’s a government confiscation issue Not small , policy-wise
Jamie Palisades: So. Mostly it’s a personal negotiation thing, and at this time does not involve formal consultation the local nodes, Micael. Not to say it could not — just that it does not now. We DO have a consulting process called the Building Advisory Committee. It is moribund because, as with most of the CDS Guild activity this last term, it has not been populated.
Jamie Palisades: So there IS a chance to build a structure requiring more local control, Micael, if you wanted to “go there”, but I think a debate would be better framed by a more detailed proposal.
Jamie Palisades: hwich leaves me with (3), the original topic I introduced
Jamie Palisades: cultural commissions as ONE instance of devolution to local control
Jamie Palisades: I plan to do it
Jamie Palisades: end of comment
Jamie Palisades smiles, shrugs, sits down
Soro Dagostino: Comment:
Soro Dagostino: That is a request for a raised hand
Carolyn Saarinen: hand up
Jamie Palisades: I’m good, on this one, Soro, if no one has any more.
Soro Dagostino: Ok, moving to the next agenda item.
Soro Dagostino: Change of election dates.
Jamie Palisades glances at Caro, shrugs again
Carolyn Saarinen: It’s ok, let’s move on.
Soro Dagostino: Ooops — Caro?
Soro Dagostino: Sorry —
Carolyn Saarinen: table it for next time
Micael Khandr: Not sure.
Soro Dagostino: The ? mark does not clear after someone speaks
Soro Dagostino: So I can’t tell who is next in order.
Jamie Palisades: Maybe there’s a special Cindy only thing you do to clear it, shrug
Carolyn Saarinen: reset script?
Soro Dagostino: No clue!
Soro Dagostino:
Jamie Palisades grins at Pip — I could eject it as out-of -theme while Cindy’s gone …
Soro Dagostino: heheheh
Pip Torok: hehe
Jamie Palisades: a theme violation itself from what I understand about Colonial Roman architecture
Soro Dagostino: She would be pissed . . ooops
Jamie Palisades: yah, discretion is the better part
Lilith Ivory giggles
Free Radar HUD v1.1 by Crystal Gadgets
Soro Dagostino: Thank you
Soro Dagostino: Who is next on the change of election dates?
Soro Dagostino: Caro –?
Soro Dagostino: Sonja
Sonja Strom: I think it could be good to move the election times, but have a concern about the RA voting to extend its own term.
Carolyn Saarinen: I’m fine
Carolyn Saarinen: yay Long Parliament
Carolyn Saarinen:
Sonja Strom: A referendum could also be a possibility, as a “Should the election times be moved? Yes/No”
Pip Torok: Time for research into RL practice on that concern imo Sonja
Sonja Strom: And/Or we could have the decision come into effect for the next RA, from January to November. Thanks.
Micael Khandr: Wouldn’t the referemdum be responded to by the people in this room . . . ?
Pip Torok: thats always the problem of governor and goverened Micael
Soro Dagostino: Jamie
Sonja Strom: Micael, I would think so, but a referendum would extend the question to the whole community of the CDS.
Jamie Palisades: I have no opinion at all abotu the merits of the scheulde chagne — but IF you do, then I note that Sonja’s soluion is very fair – …
Jamie Palisades: .. the electorate owuld know in advance …
Jamie Palisades: .. that they are choosing the next set of reps for a long term. Done
Soro Dagostino: I only comment — its an easy topic to learn the use of the referendum
Micael Khandr: I’m fine with a referendum.
Pip Torok: me too
Soro Dagostino: Does some one want to make that an amendment.
Soro Dagostino: Move and Second?
Sonja Strom: Do we have a bill we are working on? If so I don’t know the wording of it.
Soro Dagostino: It was to have been done in the forum —
Pip Torok: true … i suggest Sonja present the motion at the nexr RA meeting
Soro Dagostino: Last meeting there was just a proposal regarding the time.
Pip Torok: But Sonjka point is valid imo Soro … a referendum
Sonja Strom: It seems to me we could wait until the next RA meeting for this bill.
Soro Dagostino: Pip – do you move to table — with a note that the proposal be brought to move the topc to a Referrendum
Pip Torok: so move
Sonja Strom: I can bring a possible bill up for discussion in the forum.
Micael Khandr: second
Soro Dagostino: Second?
Soro Dagostino: ty
Soro Dagostino: Discussion?
Soro Dagostino: ooops — non-debatetable
Soro Dagostino: All in favor
Micael Khandr: Aye
Sonja Strom: Stui, if you want to have something included but don’t want to post in the Forum about it, you and I can chat about what you want.
Pip Torok: suggest that the most fruitful discussion be next week in the Forum
Pip Torok: aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Soro Dagostino: Uhhhh???
Sonja Strom: I vote aye for extending this discussion to the next RA meeting.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I vote for extension
Soro Dagostino: Everyone voted?
Pip Torok: so do I …
Micael Khandr: Aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Micael Khandr: I mean, Yes
Soro Dagostino: Opposed?
Soro Dagostino: Motion carries — some one [pokeGwyn and tellher. )
Sonja Strom laughs
Sonja Strom: I will
Sonja Strom: Soro, I think your question was about what I said to Stui? It was because he said he did not want to post in the CDS Forum.
Micael Khandr: Her ankle keeps twitching . . .
Soro Dagostino: Now to Carolyn’s Announcements.
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok
Carolyn Saarinen: two bits of news: Re-education in the sims…
Carolyn Saarinen: Moon tells me that she is in the process of translating a course she wrote for a university from Portugese…
Carolyn Saarinen: this will be a comprehensive course in building. 12×2 hour sessions.
Carolyn Saarinen: She also advised me to talk to Jon I’m guessing that’s Jon Seattle, so I’ll do that.
Carolyn Saarinen: Second, I’ve been in touch with the maker of the online indicator system..
Carolyn Saarinen: I hope to meet him very soon, maybe later today to look it over. If it seems ok I’ll arrange delivery to Rudeen Edo.
Carolyn Saarinen: That’s all.
Soro Dagostino: Thank you
Sonja Strom: Thank you for this work, Carolyn.
Soro Dagostino: Any other new business?
Carolyn Saarinen: NP
Soro Dagostino: I forgot to announce — the next meeting of RA is Sept. 20th, @ 0900
Soro Dagostino: Two weeks
Soro Dagostino: Is there a Motion to adjourn?
Carolyn Saarinen: so moved
Soro Dagostino: Second?
Sonja Strom: second
Soro Dagostino: All in favor?
Pip Torok: ayer
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye !
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Pip Torok: aye
Soro Dagostino: Motion carries — we are adjourned until Sept 20th at 0900
Soro Dagostino: Thank you all

Permalink.

RA Meeting 11 October 2009: Transcript
by Cindy Ecksol » Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:34 pm
Meeting on 2009-10-11
Those present:
Soro Dagostino is in the chair.
Soro Dagostino: Hello Sonja
Sonja Strom: Hello
Soro Dagostino: Hopefully we will have a quorum.
Sonja Strom: Yeah
Sonja Strom: Too early to tell
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hello all!
Sonja Strom: Hi Gwyneth
Soro Dagostino: Hello Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good morning/afternoon
Sonja Strom: Hi Joaquin
Joaquin Gustav: hello!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hello, JoaquiN!
Soro Dagostino: Hello Jaaquin
Joaquin Gustav: Hello friends
Sonja Strom:
Joaquin Gustav has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino: Pip and Stui are near.
Sonja Strom has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino: Need one more . . .
Soro Dagostino: Good day Pip . . .
Pip Torok: good day … good day everyone
Joaquin Gustav: good day pip
Pip Torok: are we quorate?
Soro Dagostino: Not yet
Pip Torok: hi Jo
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Almost, almost!
Sonja Strom: Hi Pip
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And hi Pip
Soro Dagostino: Stui is about.
Soro Dagostino: Need another.
Pip Torok: shall I shout a word in his ear?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Would it work anyway?
Soro Dagostino: Please do . . .
Pip Torok: hehe
Soro Dagostino: Here he is.
Joaquin Gustav: helloStui
Soro Dagostino: Hi Stui
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Welcom, Stui!!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Good day all
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m here
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good day indeed
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro can I sit in your seat ?
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
StuiChicanne Darkstone: so I can see the view
Pip Torok: you forestalled me Stu!
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Joaquin Gustav: Rose is here!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ha from here you can see everyone !
Pip Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well other than me *LOL*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol
Sonja Strom: With that seat comes a lot of privilege.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and a lot of responsibility!…
Sonja Strom: yes!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well it doesn’t come with a cushion
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Like, well, Spiderman
Joaquin Gustav: Rose! good morning
Rose Springvale: hi everyone
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi, dear Rose
Soro Dagostino: Hello Rose.
Sonja Strom: Hi Rose
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro we’ll buy you a cushion
Pip Torok: hi Rose …
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Good day Rosy !
Rose Springvale: looking at my friends list…sigh. one shy of quorum?
Sonja Strom: It looks to me like it has a cushion.
Soro Dagostino: Yes
StuiChicanne Darkstone: oooh the Cushion rezed !
Soro Dagostino: What has happened to the builder
Sonja Strom:
Soro Dagostino: Lawyer.
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Rose Springvale: so .. rob, naf, wasp, micael, arria, cindy… who’s the other one?
Rose Springvale: feels the need to start some peer pressure
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it’s not me
Soro Dagostino: There is an agenda in the pot
Rose Springvale: look stui, matched your feathers
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino: Please consent by touching the recorder on the table.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oooh indeed, Rose
Gwyneth Llewelyn: wow that dress is gorgeous…
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Rosy we’ll have to do a photoshoot
Rose Springvale: thanks!
Rose Springvale: it comes long too
Rose Springvale: Nikky Ree
StuiChicanne Darkstone has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: mmmh
Sonja Strom: wow yeah, it is!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, I have to take a look at Nikky!
Rose Springvale: thanks
Rose Springvale: oh
Rose Springvale: well take lots of money lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn: LOL
Rose Springvale: caro is the other
StuiChicanne Darkstone: anyone want some caberet while we wait ?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’ll skip on the CDS rent payments then
Rose Springvale: i thought she’d be here
Gwyneth Llewelyn *chuckles*
Rose Springvale: i had to lol
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I can do a dance
Rose Springvale: i gave all my money to the boobie ball lol
Sonja Strom: ok Stui
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What is a “boobie ball”????
Rose Springvale: then when i tried to pay rent, sl wasnt doing transactions!
Rose Springvale: oh gwyn!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ^^
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ~ Time to River Dance ~
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Seriously, I don’t know what that is
Rose Springvale: here, i’ll find the notecard.. fundraiser for Breast cancer…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Right! I thought as much lol
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ha I have an idea
StuiChicanne Darkstone: for the CDS christmas card
Gwyneth Llewelyn: … but for a foreigner, hearing those two words out of context….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we can all riverdance
StuiChicanne Darkstone: here
Rose Springvale: smiels
StuiChicanne Darkstone: in a line
Pip Torok: sounds sound like a Goon-show record!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Pip can be santa claus
Sonja Strom: Maybe the first agenda item should be “Gathering RA members”
Pip Torok: the Ying-Tong Song …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe Sonja ? you’re quite right!
Rose Springvale: the boobie ball raises money by getting prominent personalities to go topless
Sonja Strom:
Soro Dagostino: Yep!
Joaquin Gustav: i have the same problem with transactions
Pip Torok: need 5 yrs to grow a beard!
Rose Springvale: even Herr Baron stripped down to his kilt
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I AM NOT GOING TOPLESS !
Sonja Strom: Second is “RA Collective Riverdance”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Stui
Rose Springvale: stui dear, you are always topless lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Not today, he isn’t!
Soro Dagostino: Welcom Fern
StuiChicanne Darkstone: that’s why I won’t
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Sonja Strom: Hi Fern, welcome
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I could wear a bra I suppose
Rose Springvale: hi Fern
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hello , Fern
Fern Leissa: Hi
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Squeeze a boob find a friend !
Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl
Pip Torok: hi Fern
Rose Springvale: fern if they have a meeting you might want to move up to the front row.. just outside of chat range for some of them
Rose Springvale: but still a rep short
Fern Leissa: JThanks
Rose Springvale: let me try ims, see if i can get anyone to wake up
Soro Dagostino: That would be good.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Do we still have a problem with the chat range?… we can move closer to the audience I suppose
Soro Dagostino: I sent a note to all,
Rose Springvale: i’m sending private ones
StuiChicanne Darkstone: JAMIE !!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi Jamie
Soro Dagostino: Hello Jamie.
Sonja Strom: Hi Jamie
StuiChicanne Darkstone: one for soro !
Rose Springvale: Hi Jamie
Pip Torok: hi Jamie
Jamie Palisades smiles, nods,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmmh is that a Highlander outfit?
Rose Springvale: have you all heard from Arria?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Jamie is in a skirt
Sonja Strom: very nice, isn’t it?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *squeezes Jamie’s boob*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: nice skirt
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
Rose Springvale: we know cindy is out and i think caro said she’s gone
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Jamie are you going topless for the boobie ball ?
Rose Springvale: sent notes to naf, micael, caro and wasp
Soro Dagostino: Ok, we do not have a quorum.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m very excitable
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I had a lot of cookies
Jamie Palisades smiles, curtsies, makes a note of prejudice against Scots for his future SC appeal to have you all hung in the Platz
Sonja Strom: sugar high!
Soro Dagostino: Lets talk about the items on the Agenda — and wait for 7 day votes?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: sure…
Rose Springvale: message back from Rob, on the road, so he wont’ be here
Rose Springvale: can you do that?
Joaquin Gustav: the ones that confirmed in doodle we are all here
Rose Springvale: can you get quorum from 7 days?
Soro Dagostino: Yes, any action is subject to ratification.
Rose Springvale: cool
Soro Dagostino: We are all kept in suspense.
Sonja Strom: I don’t know about a quorum, but we can have an open conversation.
Sonja Strom: We have done that in the past.
Pip Torok: good idea
Sonja Strom: Just not have any votes at this meeting…
Jamie Palisades smiles, raises hand on a point of order
Soro Dagostino: We always have open discussion — no order at all . . .))
Soro Dagostino: Jamie
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we could talk about Christmas !
Soro Dagostino: Non action items.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, the Winter Holidays in the CDS …
Soro Dagostino: Administrative reports.
Sonja Strom: Halloween
Jamie Palisades: Just confirming – I think disvussion;s fine, but an actual initiation of a vote & motion today, later confirmed by additional 7 days absentee votes, would fail for the lack of quorum here, no?
Sonja Strom: I agree with Jamie.
Rose Springvale: if she comes, we have a quorum yes?
Soro Dagostino: I just saw that .
Soro Dagostino: Yes
StuiChicanne Darkstone: the things you have to do for a bottle of aftershave
Pip Torok: hi caro!!
Rose Springvale: you have to stop drinking that stuff Stui!
Soro Dagostino: Hello Carol
Rose Springvale: yay caro, quorum maker!
Carolyn Saarinen: Hi, sorry i’m late, log in and TP problems
Sonja Strom: Hi Carolyn
Soro Dagostino: Would you all please touch the recorder to consent to recording the meeting.
Pip Torok: (tell me about ’em!)
Sonja Strom: sorry about the problems…
Carolyn Saarinen has indicated consent to be recorded.
Sonja Strom: I know what that is like
Soro Dagostino: Jamie do you have a report?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I see Caro hi
Jamie Palisades: Soro, the only major item is the continuation of the budget chat from last week
Pip Torok: errm agenda !!a ???
Pip Torok: *IIa
Soro Dagostino: We will wait for that.
Jamie Palisades: yes – i was looking for that, too, pip
Sonja Strom: In the amphora.
Soro Dagostino: Any changes to the agenda?
Sonja Strom: Under the table.
Soro Dagostino: Any?
Sonja Strom: I don’t have any changes.
Soro Dagostino: Do I hear a motion to approve the Agenda as published?
Pip Torok: so oved
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Seconds
Pip Torok: *so moved
Soro Dagostino: Thank you
Soro Dagostino: any discussion?
Soro Dagostino: All in favor?
Pip Torok: aye
Sonja Strom: aye aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Soro Dagostino: Opposed?
Soro Dagostino: Motion carries.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry, aye)
Soro Dagostino: A note — The next meeting is October 25.
Soro Dagostino: Cindy will be back . . . Yay!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Soro Dagostino: I know she has a seven day vote.
Soro Dagostino: Moving to the agenda items.
Soro Dagostino: Jamie, would you move to the Budget report, and then we will take up the In-world status board report.
Pip Torok: (gesundheit)
Soro Dagostino: Jamie?
Soro Dagostino: Rose — Poke Jamie
Jamie Palisades: Thanks
Jamie Palisades: budget
Soro Dagostino:
Jamie Palisades: a reminder
Jamie Palisades: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2575
Jamie Palisades: is the URI from which we were working last week
Jamie Palisades: and to recap
Jamie Palisades: much of our budget is rote, that is to say, a simple knockoff of necessities
Jamie Palisades: – we collect rent from citizens
Jamie Palisades: – we pay rent (tier) to Linden Lab
Jamie Palisades: as you saw form Sudane’s presentation here in late August
Jamie Palisades: that yields a nice small surplus every month
Jamie Palisades: from which we set aside 25%
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh-huh
Jamie Palisades: and really, here today, we are talking about how to spend the rest
Jamie Palisades: ..
Jamie Palisades: now before I talk about that
Jamie Palisades: let me point out
Jamie Palisades: there will be other things to talk about OTHER than the monthly routine operation budget
Jamie Palisades: e.g.
Jamie Palisades: 1. Rent harmonization
Jamie Palisades: 2. new sims if any
Jamie Palisades: 3. and revising our payments to the Lindens
Jamie Palisades: (which could go up or down, so we need to plan for that, long term, too)
Jamie Palisades: but those aren’t today’s topic
Jamie Palisades: today, we just start where Sudane left off — how do we spend the mild surplus generated from steady state monthly operations?
Jamie Palisades: ..
Jamie Palisades: and looking at the Forum URI, you can see there are 3 sanswers
Jamie Palisades: none of which are wholly new
Jamie Palisades: the first two speak for themselves, an dboth follow from old acts of the RA
Jamie Palisades: a. stipends to executive branch officials, except me
Jamie Palisades: which makes the volunteer work a *little* more palatable for them
Jamie Palisades: and we’ve done for years
Jamie Palisades: and b. some of our web hosting costs
Jamie Palisades: the real judgment gets exercised in the third category, which is events
Jamie Palisades: we underspent in prior years
Jamie Palisades: this year we are proposing, as you know, to devolve some work to regions
Jamie Palisades: now – from a “CDS law” point of view
Jamie Palisades: this is my presentation on the expenses I plan to authorize
Jamie Palisades: and you may if you wish change it by an act of the RA
Jamie Palisades: frankly, most terms, the RA didn;t touch the budget
Jamie Palisades: *sigh* some terms, a chancellor didn;t either
Jamie Palisades: but if you do NOT act, anyway, this is what we plan to do
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Jamie Palisades: before any issue of amendment or approval, though
Jamie Palisades: there’s consultation
Jamie Palisades: and on this matter particularly, events plans, this is the point to get feedback
Jamie Palisades: if you look in detail at the event budget
Jamie Palisades: it uses numbers (derived from our past activity under Rose’s creative guidance) …
Jamie Palisades: .. for CDS-wide events
Jamie Palisades: like Oktoberfest & Feria & the inaugural balls
Jamie Palisades: but this leaves a little less that L$50000/month unspent
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Amazing how little the CDS spends…
Jamie Palisades: you can see that in item 5 (c) in the posted notes
Jamie Palisades: isn’t it
Jamie Palisades: so
Jamie Palisades: our NEXT problem
Gwyneth Llewelyn grins
Rose Springvale: jamie, is it 50000 per month or per term?
Rose Springvale: sorry, out of order
Jamie Palisades: is to figure out how to coordinate regional citizen involvement in decisions about that
Jamie Palisades: … 50000 per month
Carolyn Saarinen: Blimey!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ^^
Soro Dagostino: Exclamations of disbelief are in order!
Gwyneth Llewelyn gasps.
Soro Dagostino:
Jamie Palisades: well
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Wow, the CDS is definitely a *rich* community lol
Jamie Palisades: let’s not get too excited abuot that
Jamie Palisades: no
Jamie Palisades: consider
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No, we wish to buy a few sims as well
Jamie Palisades: let’s say we have one concert per week at L$7000 in a sim
Soro Dagostino: And congratulations to Jamie and Sudane for a job well done
Jamie Palisades: 7×4 = 28
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (yes, Soro, we should vote on that!!!)
Jamie Palisades: so there’s half your budget gone
Gwyneth Llewelyn: True, true. Jamie )
Jamie Palisades: Rose, Could I ask you to ralk a little about what’s happening in SL with venues, tip jars, and the trends in paid musicians?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Please do!
Rose Springvale: sure
Jamie Palisades: *talk, i mean – but rock too, by all means
Carolyn Saarinen: About $180USD
Rose Springvale: maybe Joaquin will have things to add too
Jamie Palisades: (I use 275/1 this season Caro)
Joaquin Gustav: not really
Rose Springvale: As you all know, there is some great live music available in SL
Joaquin Gustav: i am following your exposition
Joaquin Gustav: and i could prepare a list of entretainers
Rose Springvale: for the most part, live music is a great attraction to sims, and especially beneficial when the sim is trying to attract traffic, either to sell goods, or land or concepts
Rose Springvale: STANDARD rates for good musicians like Joa right now, are 5k per performance
Rose Springvale: some performers will negotiate their prices for consistent engagements
Rose Springvale: soem will work for tips
Rose Springvale: i generally only agree to pay 5k to performers who have 3 things, just for background… 1, an active group
Joaquin Gustav: yes, and there is also an option of bringing a thematic dj
Rose Springvale: 2. their own stream
Rose Springvale: 3. assistants
Joaquin Gustav: sorry rose
Rose Springvale: for major events, i like to have performers who pretty much guarantee us 40 avis
Rose Springvale: now
Rose Springvale: in most sims
Rose Springvale: the cost of the musician, and the cost of the land make live music very expensive
Rose Springvale: and many venues close on an ongoing pattern
Rose Springvale: recently
Rose Springvale: through the efforts of a group called Live Music Venues
Rose Springvale: there has been an experiment going around with cover charges
Rose Springvale: ticketed performances
Rose Springvale: where popular performers are paid a) from ticket sales
Rose Springvale: or b) the revenue is shared by both the musician and the venue owner
Rose Springvale: Mankind Tracer created this system
Rose Springvale: and has volunteered to do a performance for us if we are interested in trying it
Rose Springvale: the point being
Rose Springvale: that when we dont’ have anything to sell
Rose Springvale: then our music becomes entertainment
Rose Springvale: and sadly
Rose Springvale: in MOST of our events
Rose Springvale: most of the people attending are not CDS citizens
Jamie Palisades: .. or that could be a good thing, if we are selling land
Rose Springvale: yes. is that what you wanted Jamie?
Jamie Palisades: .. yes, thanks. And we should take a second to
Jamie Palisades: acknowledge some of our colleagues
Rose Springvale: smiles
Jamie Palisades: Pip, Caro. Stui, Joaquin, Cindy and Sonja come to mind
Jamie Palisades: who really do regularly make a point of showing up at our social events
Jamie Palisades: i am sure I have missed some’
Rose Springvale: smiles
Jamie Palisades: and we’ve seen all of you at one time or another
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Rose Springvale: but there are some we have NEVER seen
Jamie Palisades: but it helps us promote CDS, so – thanks
Jamie Palisades: anyway, grin
Jamie Palisades: that’s where the money goes
Jamie Palisades: and
Jamie Palisades: what I hope to see NEXT
Jamie Palisades: is
Jamie Palisades: (with rose’s help, quelle surprise)
Jamie Palisades: Andalusian, Alpine and Roman citizen panels convene to advise us on how to use the rest of those funds for programs
Jamie Palisades: several of you alreday have been good enough to agree to help us convene those
Jamie Palisades: I doubt we’d just do an arithmetic split of the funds
Jamie Palisades: but that’s an issue we will need to work out as the demand for programming evolves
Rose Springvale raises hand
Jamie Palisades: and with that – and a request for your input on it – I’m done, believe it or not.
Soro Dagostino: Rose
Rose Springvale: i can wait until after the ra soro… i think they get to go firs
Rose Springvale: first
Soro Dagostino: Is there a motion to approve the budget?
Rose Springvale: oh
Rose Springvale: lol
Jamie Palisades: you are welcome to, though it’s not legally required
Rose Springvale: i had one more comment
Sonja Strom: I would like to hear what Rose wants to say.
Soro Dagostino: Then no action is necessary for today?
Soro Dagostino: Rose?
Jamie Palisades: me too, Sonja
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I’d be fine in approving the budget but allowing for some more time to discuss?)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (e.g. Rose m)
Rose Springvale: yes, i wanted to add that it is really important as we look at these allocations to remember that most of the events that sprinkle our calendar today
Rose Springvale: are privately funded.
Rose Springvale: ie
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Rosy ! ROSY ! Rosy !
Rose Springvale: we have not given any financial support to theater of the clouds,
Soro Dagostino: The reason for the Motion — is to allow for discussion
Rose Springvale: or to the Old Bowl
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (oh, ok, Soro!)
Jamie Palisades: (that’s Pip’s AM artists group, yes?)
Rose Springvale: CDS has been financing the Al Zahra concerts since they started collecting the funds from aa in July
Pip Torok hears of the Old Bowl and suddenly pays attention ….
Rose Springvale: yes, that’s Pips place
Rose Springvale: so one of the things the regional groups may want to consider is supporting what is already being done
Rose Springvale: if they choose NOT to
Rose Springvale: then some of that programming will no doubt be revised
Soro Dagostino: [what isn’t “Pip’s place?] Rose Springvale: lol
Pip Torok: now now!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: my house
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it says “Stui’s”
Soro Dagostino: Don’t be to sure
Rose Springvale: smile
Soro Dagostino:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I shall check for his shoes under my bed tho
Rose Springvale: that’s all unless you have questions
Soro Dagostino: What is the sense of the body?
Pip Torok: (mostly non-existent shoes these days)
Soro Dagostino: Do we need a Motion to approve?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: two different things I believe ? one is the budget, the other are the Regional Comissions, which, in fact, don’t need explicit RA approval
Jamie Palisades: and ar etheir own agenda item, I think
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It’s just an Executive function, they can delegate it to anyone
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and that too, Jamie
Soro Dagostino: Regional Commissions are on the Agenda.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, well, I’ll move a motion to approve the budget, so that we can discuss it properly hehe
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think we should buy a gavel
Pip Torok: seconded
Soro Dagostino: Discussion?
Soro Dagostino: Ready for the vote?
Gwyneth Llewelyn was a bit busy in browsing through the forums,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oh sorry
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I have a question
Gwyneth Llewelyn *raises hand*
Gwyneth Llewelyn clicks on the question mark thingy
Sonja Strom: Thanks for all the work on this to Sudane, Jamie, Rose, and anybody else I might not have mentioned.
Soro Dagostino: Yes Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, since Jamie probably has this written somewhere,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: or has a link to a forum thread,
Jamie Palisades: ?
Rose Springvale gasps. all i do is spend it!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: it’s easier to ask…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What percentage of the overall revenue of the CDS is going to be allocated to events?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I’m sure that the requirements for having a standing reserve will have been already figured out etc)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Rosy ! can we have a christmas tree that’s hugest ?
Soro Dagostino: Stui . . . BONK, BONK
Jamie Palisades: ah. OK. Hmmmmm. (using calculator)
Soro Dagostino: the gavel.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: L$76450 is the monthly revenue?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro just bonked me
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Quoting from the forum post… “Potential budget for these = L$76450 ? 7000 ? 2750 ? 12000 ? 1666 = no more than L$49700”
Jamie Palisades: Net income after tier is projected at L$101750/month
Jamie Palisades: so even just by eyeball,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah ok!!!
Pip Torok: can I suggest 60% of the “no more than” figure for entertainment?
Jamie Palisades: L$14000 or so per month is CDS wide events
Jamie Palisades: and we are talking about L$49700 max here for the regions
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok… so mmmh
Jamie Palisades: per month
Jamie Palisades: so that’s what, about 63% ?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah ok
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Something like that, yes
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So mmh
Jamie Palisades: 14+50/102
Gwyneth Llewelyn: what are the extra L$25k for?
Jamie Palisades: in rough shorthand
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Further expansion? Financial reserve?
Jamie Palisades packs his suitcase for Cuba .. um .. i mean …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl
Pip Torok: lol
Jamie Palisades: heh, no, it goes to the website, stipends and reserves
Jamie Palisades: remember
Jamie Palisades: sudance has asked and we long ago agreed to set side 1/4 into reserve
Jamie Palisades: *sudane, sorry
Gwyneth Llewelyn: AH ok, that’s what I was wondering!
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Jamie Palisades: that was covered in the August RA budget show she provided
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, roughly L$25k for reserves
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (yes, I was trying to get that forum thread, the nice one with the slides and all!)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The reason I was asking that,
Soro Dagostino: Any more questions?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: is because I’m interested in knowing if we can afford further expansion this term
Rose Springvale: oh Gwyn
Soro Dagostino: Is the body ready for the vote?
Jamie Palisades: well, that, as I said Gwyn, is completely separate
Jamie Palisades: here’s why
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I guess we could ? at the expense of cutting on the events…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok.
Gwyneth Llewelyn listens
Jamie Palisades: we WERE disussing the operating budget
Pip Torok: always something to keep in mind
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and agrees, yes
Jamie Palisades: EXPANSION is a CAPITAL budget item
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Rose Springvale: why would we cut events? we’d have more sims more people, more money
Jamie Palisades: which means taking money out of our banks funds
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, yes
Jamie Palisades: *banked funds
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Perhaps I should have asked the question slightly differently….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (because the funds are NOT zero )
Jamie Palisades: which — well I did not check it to bring to this rpeort, but they are pretty high
Rose Springvale: ” can we build a new sim please?”
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (yes, ROse!)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I should perhaps ask, can we AFFORD it?
Sonja Strom: Here is Sudane’s presentation: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=2520
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Taking into account that we have at least the following overhead…
Jamie Palisades: And the answer would be, yes, easily
StuiChicanne Darkstone: can we have a big bridge ?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (oh thanks, Sonja!)
Jamie Palisades: sure prims are cheap. Wanna build it?
Soro Dagostino: That is getting off topic.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: – buying new sim
Rose Springvale: yes!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmmh
Soro Dagostino: And we are running short on time.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ordering a new sim IS budget
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But ok, Soro,
Jamie Palisades: may I suggest, Soro, that we bring back a CAPITAL budget report to a future meeting?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I understand that we don’t need to put a new sim in the RUNNING budget
Gwyneth Llewelyn: right
Soro Dagostino: Certainly
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Agreed
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, I have no more questions then
Jamie Palisades smiles, and for Stui;s benefit, curtsies briefly
Soro Dagostino: Whew!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol
Soro Dagostino: All in favor of the motion?
Jamie Palisades looks down frowning – must be the damn kilt scripts
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Jamie watch you don’t tuck your plaid skirt into your panty hos
Soro Dagostino: Not jamies curtsy
Jamie Palisades: the, um, approve budget motion sorry
Soro Dagostino: The motion on the floor.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye
Soro Dagostino: Hello?
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Pip Torok: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Soro Dagostino: Opposed?
Soro Dagostino: Motion carried.
Jamie Palisades: thank you all.
Soro Dagostino: Congratulations to Sudane and jamie.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What was your vote, Soro? (you vote too, you know )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Whew ? we have a budget *again* ! That’s a rare coccasion in the CDS!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Sorry honey
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I don’t eat sushi
StuiChicanne Darkstone: strictly beef!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: oops
Gwyneth Llewelyn: LOL
Soro Dagostino: Who is the proponent of the In-world status board propsal?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: was looking at gestures
Rose Springvale: carolyn
StuiChicanne Darkstone: someone wanted one
Carolyn Saarinen: That would be me i guess
Soro Dagostino: Report?
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok
Carolyn Saarinen: I consulted with Rose about placement earlier this week…
Carolyn Saarinen: We decided on AA (fortress)…
Carolyn Saarinen: CN (forum)…
Carolyn Saarinen: NFS (Marktplatz)…
Carolyn Saarinen: Being area where citizens/and visitors are already directed for information…
Carolyn Saarinen: Rose was a bit concerned that the set up should be of reasonable size and in-theme at each location…
Rose Springvale smiles
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (a fine concern to have )
Carolyn Saarinen: Rudeen began setting up the first in NFS yesterday.
Carolyn Saarinen: I haven’t seen it yet. Has anyone?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: yes she asked me for a key
Rose Springvale: yes
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (no )
Rose Springvale: its up and running
Soro Dagostino: Any further RA action necessary for today?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and it talked to me today
Soro Dagostino: Caro?
Carolyn Saarinen: yes?
Sonja Strom: I saw Rudeen working on it, but have not seen it completed.
Soro Dagostino: Any further action required from RA today?
Soro Dagostino: Ok, I guess none.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmh
Carolyn Saarinen: I don’t think so. You do, technically, owe me L1000
Carolyn Saarinen:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sorry, I was opening the notecard
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No “actions”, but some discussions I believe?
Rose Springvale: ah, jamie will put that in for reimbursement
Soro Dagostino: Regional commisions
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes
Soro Dagostino: Proponent?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And the whole III. point which we have been postponing…
Jamie Palisades: mm hmm?
Jamie Palisades: I can do regonal commissions, but what about point III?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (hello , Micael!)
Soro Dagostino: Welcome Micael
Pip Torok: hi Micael
Sonja Strom: Hi Micael
Micael Khandr: (Hello–sorry I am late)
Soro Dagostino: touch the recorder and consent please.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Micael Khandr !
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m personally worried that we never manage to *start* discussing III b. at the RA
Jamie Palisades: Rapdily, then, on agenda item II(c)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok!
Jamie Palisades: Micael K, Pip T and Arria P have kindly agreed to serve on various of the regional programming panels. Sonja also has, and would do equally well, though we will need to sort out whether that, or a different role – relating to consulates – is our best use of her gracious volunteer time
Jamie Palisades: And I have two other requests outstanding. Resulting, one hopes, in two persons to convene each of three citizen panels,
Jamie Palisades: As we discussed several meetings ago, these will be open, preannounced meetings, so any citizen can give input, and the conveners will work by consensus to bring results to us for implementation. Those results will be subject to budget approval in the usual way — that is, Rose and Sudane and I will be slightly involved, primarily in payment approvals, to make sure all’s done appropriately.
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades: (No hiring your own alt, for example )
Jamie Palisades: Done.
Soro Dagostino: Questions?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Wow that was quick and to the point
Soro Dagostino: Any action required?
Soro Dagostino: Jamie?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, this time I have no questions lol ? except perhaps if we should create a new forum section just for them?
Soro Dagostino: An executive decision?
Rose Springvale: probably can use the current events place..
Gwyneth Llewelyn: You’re right, Soro, sorry!
Pip Torok: I’d suggest we wait for the need for a forum section to arise …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Soro Dagostino: New Business — Commerce Zoning Commission — report?
Jamie Palisades:
Soro Dagostino: Proponent
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: that’s me
Gwyneth Llewelyn: All right, I don’t see any action for the RA to take action upon; unless, of course, we want just to pass a vote of confidence that the regional comissions are a “Good Thing” and that the RA is happy about seeing them happen
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok
Soro Dagostino: Stui — status?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well we had a meeting yesterday, it was very busy – lots of heads and talking and lots of good points made and valuable feedback
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we have posted a transcript to the forum
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’ll get the link in a moment
Rose Springvale: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2581
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and we meet next week to further discuss
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and thankyou to Rosy for the link
Rose Springvale:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: progress
Soro Dagostino: Questions
Soro Dagostino: None appearing
Sonja Strom: I have one.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well who could question me ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Sonja Strom: Me!
Sonja Strom: heheeh
Soro Dagostino: Yes Snja
Soro Dagostino: Sonya
Carolyn Saarinen switches to ThinkPol title
Sonja Strom: What role does the Commission play? Should it reach a decision to sugguest to the RA, or be a discussion that brings up ideas?
Sonja Strom: In other words, would it take a vote on what should be done?
Sonja Strom: Thanks
Gwyneth Llewelyn: In my opinion, “yes”
Pip Torok: and mine too FWIW
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe sorry
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Actually mmmh
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well we will bring a report back that will hopefully represent the best concensus that can be reached
Gwyneth Llewelyn: the Exec sets covenants
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But I believe that the RA has to approve them
Gwyneth Llewelyn doesn’t remember exactly the steps
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *nods to Sonja*
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we do our best
Soro Dagostino: If I recall, RA has the final vote.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: for the best outcome possible
Sonja Strom: I am okay with that, so long as there is at some point a report or recommendation made.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I think so too. So these should be recommendations on Covenant changes to be proposed by the Exec to the RA.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and strangely the comission would report first to the EXec but that’s ok, I see from the transcript that the Exec is well-represented at the meeting)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well we do require more than a week to do so
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes yes Stui
Soro Dagostino: Stui, there will be additional reports?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No rushing lol
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we have decided to have another meeting next week
Soro Dagostino: Is there a motion to table?
Sonja Strom: I understand, but I was wondering about the structure of it – – what it would do.
Rose Springvale: table? report was given….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it took nine months to make me – if you give me one week to change the world I may break
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Not table… oh, like Rose said
Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl Stui!
Soro Dagostino: No action before us?
Jamie Palisades: Nope
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But I’m fine to go to the next point, and thank all the citizens who participated on that meeting ))
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No, none, Soro.
Sonja Strom: I hope everybody understands why I asked the question I did,
Sonja Strom: but otherwise I am okay with how it is for now.
Soro Dagostino: Ok, looking at the clock.
Soro Dagostino: The Linden partnership issue?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Riiiiiiight

(continued)
Cindy Ecksol
Master Word Wielder

 
Posts: 447
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 8:37 pm
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Top
Re: RA Meeting 11 October 2009: Transcript
by Cindy Ecksol » Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:45 pm
(continued)

StuiChicanne Darkstone: Sonja we appreciate this is an important issue for CDS and for individuals – we won’t hurry through and we will get a result at the end
Carolyn Saarinen: Well Prokofy Neva hates it!
Soro Dagostino: I propose that it be referred to the executive for analysis.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m involved,and Rosy and Jamie – it’s bound to work
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good, Caro! So let’s approve it immediatelY!
Soro Dagostino: And report.
Pip Torok: interesting! (I wonder why??!! ))
Carolyn Saarinen: More seriously it does seem to add some fuel to her Feted Inner Core argument. The LL FAQ even acknowledges that.
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Caro
Jamie Palisades chuckles. On the partnership, I see no downside. While I think their plan was a whiff of exactly the sort of elistism and favoritizm that Prok hates — that’s not necessariyl a reason for CDS not to take advantage of it
Carolyn Saarinen: However, since the scheme is a fait accomplis, if it brings advantage to the CDS, I for one, am prepared to be pragmatic.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m definitely interested in signing it
Jamie Palisades: Heh we’ll see who they approve
Pip Torok: and me too … in spades
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Isn’t there a deadline for the first submissions?
Soro Dagostino: Jamie you will report at the next meeting?
Jamie Palisades: There is, and I will
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Will we be in time, if we keep postponing the discussion?
Soro Dagostino: Thank you.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (just being pragmatic here hehe )
Pip Torok: id like to put a motion that Jamie sign it for us ASAP if time is pressing
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hmm
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Without discussion?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol
Rose Springvale: would like to hear sudane’s experience
Carolyn Saarinen: We need a proposal to ‘sign up’ with I believe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Rose, yes!! Me too!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: If she’s allowed to give it publicly, of course (she might not be)
Jamie Palisades chuckles. Her experience is with the “Blake Sea” donation of Linden owned sims to the SLNE neigborhood, as I recall
Rose Springvale: maybe we need a special meeting
Jamie Palisades: yes, I hear some of you FIC get put under NDAs, gwynnie
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But we in the CDS have this big advantage, getting a first-hand report from someone who has been working with LL on this
Jamie Palisades: in the new open Linden regime
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe Jamie ? yes, I keep forgetting how many NDA’s I’m under
Jamie Palisades: so here is what I will take away, unless the RA acts otherwise :
Jamie Palisades: 1. wait until we get a report if the deadine allows
Pip Torok: in the end, what does signing ACTUALLY commit us to? .. I suggest nothing yet
Jamie Palisades: 2. signup, if it does not, and we can always withdraw
Pip Torok: my point exactly
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But yes ? my point is, we will have to move “close” to the mainland, and probably get a few more sims to play with ? that has some implications (General Master Plan AGAIN!)
Jamie Palisades: (nothing there’s no assurance of selection, we not being on anyone;s special buddies list)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah ok
Gwyneth Llewelyn: You are both right, Jamie & Pip
Rose Springvale: not so sure about that
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I agree
Pip Torok: is that a commitment Gwyn?
Carolyn Saarinen: Why aren’t we on the ‘Special Buddies Lit’?
Jamie Palisades: hmm not necessarily Gwyn but for further discussion – im not sure the only benny of the “new FIC” is free land adjacency
Gwyneth Llewelyn: You’re right about “sign first, see if we got selected, discuss it only if we are”
Pip Torok: i thought we were Caro (if unofficial)
Jamie Palisades: Ok, good we have a plan then
Gwyneth Llewelyn: There are a few more benefits for sure ? being listed on the Community Gateway page I guess
Pip Torok: i put the motion
Rose Springvale: do we have the personell to support this?
Soro Dagostino: Restate your Motion please?
Pip Torok: i wd certainly give it time
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Pip’s motion: “Pip Torok: id like to put a motion that Jamie sign it for us ASAP if time is pressing”
Jamie Palisades: Caro, we actually *act* indpendent – or most of us do – and we are smaller than some of the huge commercial developments — so arguably we owuld not be as handsome a strategic partner, as, say, some commercial interests
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Rose: that is one of the many concerns, yes
Sonja Strom: Hi Solomon
Pip Torok: to ask our chancellor to sign up, and to do it soon if time is an issue
Gwyneth Llewelyn confirms the seconding of Pip’s motion hehe
Rose Springvale: though LL has been taking care of us lately…
Jamie Palisades: ladies & gentlemen> sounds like a good motion to me .. and one that wil generate another report next mtg
Solomon Mosely: /smiles
Soro Dagostino: The chair has read the LL rules.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, at this stage, I believe we’re the oldest community in SL outside of the mainland
Solomon Mosely: poorly
Soro Dagostino: It does not seem to contain a deadline.
Jamie Palisades: I agree Gwyn – even the Edge is gone – and if Luskwood went away, well, grin
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe and luskwood is mainland, technically
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (even though they have Estate Tools)
Rose Springvale amends all her marketing notecards…
Jamie Palisades: There’a a lot in the app FAQ that *implies* speed, though, Soro
Soro Dagostino: Are you ready for the Question?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But Rose raised a good question too
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (tbd )
Soro Dagostino: BONK BONK
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (we might need to have a budget for “personell”)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol sorry Soro ? yes, Question please
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro is like Bill Clinton always bonking in the office
Soro Dagostino: The chair comments the motion may be premature.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Stui
Pip Torok: (hehe:)
Pip Torok: I’d respectfully suggest the motion is not premature
Jamie Palisades: Rose have more? Anyone else?
Jamie Palisades: or can you vote?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: If time is of the essence to be in the *list* of *potential* communities, then the motion is not premature; if afterwards we *do* get selected, as Jamie & Pip pointed out, we can always discuss details and drop it eventually.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So I’m fine in agreeing to allow Jamie to sign up now, and worry later if we get selected
Soro Dagostino: As respectful as I am about Mr. Palisades and his judgement, I dislike RA allocating its powers to him.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, the Exec does sign things on behalf of the CDS…
Soro Dagostino: Within his authority.
Rose Springvale: i think we can go ahead like this though
Jamie Palisades: Mr LRA, we’re not you are proposing to have me make an revocable act
Rose Springvale: bring back details
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah wait ? thus the motion, Soro!
Jamie Palisades: nd this is not the kind of thing I would want to sign CDS for, without the RA behidn it, anyway
Sonja Strom: I think in this case it makes sense, because what the Chancellor would be signing us up to is an opportunity.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: If the RA approves that the Chancellor can sign us up on behalf of the CDS, we’re not really “allocating powers” ? we’re delegating the Will of the Citizens to an executive act hehe
Micael Khandr: Agree
Pip Torok: exactly Gwyn!
Soro Dagostino: Should a committee be appointed from the RA to review?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (well, the SC can always disagree on that interpretation, of course…)
Pip Torok: no … no point imo
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No point, unless we get approved… we might not be
Soro Dagostino: Ready for the question?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: why risk losing the opportunity for the sake of a talking shop ?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hear, hear!
Sonja Strom: We could always withdraw from the partnership, right?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I can talk about anything anytime anyone wants…
Soro Dagostino: All in favor?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if they miss the discussion so
Pip Torok: aye
Micael Khandr: Aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye aye aye
Sonja Strom: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE !
Soro Dagostino: Opposed?
Soro Dagostino: Nay.
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Soro Dagostino: Motion carried.
Soro Dagostino: Any further business?
Soro Dagostino: Do I hear a Motion to adjourn
Pip Torok: so move
Soro Dagostino: Second?
Rose Springvale: wait
Rose Springvale: lol
Rose Springvale: nm… never get citizens concerns!
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’d like to hear some
Soro Dagostino: Gustav must go.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aww
Pip Torok: true but at this point a citizen WDhave intervened …
Rose Springvale: at least ask.. if they are here for all this time
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* it’s the only polite thing to do!
Soro Dagostino: Ok Any Citizens Concerns?
Rose Springvale: no when the item on the agenda says citizens concerns, and adjournment is asked for instead
Pip Torok: true enough …
Jamie Palisades smiles
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I mean, Rose, the only polite thing to do is to ask about citizen’s concerns, since the point is on the agenda, BEFORE moving to adjourn!)
Joaquin Gustav: i am sorry i must leave
Rose Springvale: and now everyone is intimidated
StuiChicanne Darkstone: see you soon Joaquin !
Joaquin Gustav: ty soro and everyone
Sonja Strom: ok Joaquin
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (see you, Joaquin )
Rose Springvale: bye joaquin
Jamie Palisades: No prob, thanks Joa
Pip Torok: hehe! (someone doesnt know _me_ …
Soro Dagostino: Hearing no person ready to address the body.
Sonja Strom: Do any citizens here have concerns to bring up?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Don’t be shy
Sonja Strom sees no typing
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (well, Stui never is… haha )
Sonja Strom: hahaa
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Rose Springvale: i have a lot of things, but not now.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oooh
Rose Springvale: will ask for agenda time i guess
Gwyneth Llewelyn: “now” would be perfect!
Rose Springvale: nope, pouting
Sonja Strom: yes
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Rose ? ok, it’s your call, really )))
Rose Springvale: someone should look at the election schedule
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh oh …
Rose Springvale: well, i just mean
Jamie Palisades smiles
Rose Springvale: if factions are going to be organized
Jamie Palisades: with the new, higher minimum threshold
Rose Springvale: or people recrutied to be citizens before the next election
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh-huh
Soro Dagostino: *sigh*
Rose Springvale: that deadline for citizen ship will be soon
Soro Dagostino: There goes the day.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Soro ))
Jamie Palisades: naah – just a cautionary note for ths month
Rose Springvale: yes, but it takes time to sell to people, and teach them. and i know that at least a few people have talked about an AA faction
Rose Springvale: which doesn’t exist today
Pip Torok: the elephant in the room as far as I’m concerned …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay
Rose Springvale: and i look at hte calendar
Rose Springvale: and see one more meeting in october
Carolyn Saarinen: I’d just like to point out that in group terms Andalusians may not be citizens!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ^^
Rose Springvale: ?
Pip Torok: ??
Jamie Palisades smiles. How so, Caro?
Carolyn Saarinen: I for one don’t have access to that role in the CDS group
Gwyneth Llewelyn is confused
Rose Springvale: ohhh
Rose Springvale: you mean tags
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ahhh
Rose Springvale: i’m working on that
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Right!
Jamie Palisades: ahhh – well, even if we are behind in group roles
StuiChicanne Darkstone: that’s true !
Pip Torok is confused
Jamie Palisades: the citizens list is managed from rent rols
Jamie Palisades: rolls
Rose Springvale: cds group tags
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes
Jamie Palisades: and rent rolls are managed by Sudane. and posted, and somewhat more up to date
Gwyneth Llewelyn: “groups” is not exactly “important”
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Jamie
Rose Springvale: none of the AA reps have government officials tags either
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s unfair!
Carolyn Saarinen: Ok, I just didn’t know what implications it might ahve
Rose Springvale: nor access to notices
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No, don’t worry, Carolyn
Rose Springvale: some real
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m just a kitten
Pip Torok: can i suggest that the AA delegates bring this up urgently as an agenda item?
Rose Springvale: they should be able to post to both groups though, and if CDS ra want group powers in teh AA grou p for notices, we can do that too
Micael Khandr: Wouldn’t that just be assumed?
Rose Springvale: all land owners in AA have group notice access
Rose Springvale: well, MK, they have to JOIN the group
Rose Springvale: and may not have groups open
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Micael Khandr: No agenda item necessary–just do it?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It’s fine to send them a “reminder”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Actually, I believe that Sudane has a mailing list for every citizen ? it’s little used
Rose Springvale: not since the merger gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *with every citizen’s email, sorry
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oooh
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s bad!
Rose Springvale: well, we don’t use it in CDS
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok hmm
Sonja Strom: Hi Junius
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* ? very seldom ? only sometimes to remind people that the elections are upcoming, but it is inconsistently used
Junius Inaka: Hello
Jamie Palisades smiles
Pip Torok: hi Junius
Jamie Palisades: by the way it’s not just a list
Rose Springvale: hey Junius.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I can see Jamie’s cycling shorts
Jamie Palisades: CDS law requires us to post it
Rose Springvale: email?
Jamie Palisades: no, the names of all citizens
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well well. Since we’re over the hour, I propose that we discuss forming an eventual comission to deal with the “citizen roll” next session?
Rose Springvale: thinks she was only talking about email
Rose Springvale: ugh
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We *could* have a Subscribe-O-Matic or similar thing
Rose Springvale: delegate to the exec lol
Rose Springvale: or hippo groups
Jamie Palisades: http://portal.slcds.info/index.php?id=191
Jamie Palisades:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, or Hippo groups
Micael Khandr: Thisis an excutive function, no?
Rose Springvale: which will tie into our proposed land system
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Jamie ? right!
Rose Springvale: oh, btw, i’m keeping a list of acts that have expired or need amendment
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Actually, probably the SC has to oversee that the laws in place are being *followed* mmmh
Pip Torok thinks “ah yes … land system …”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Goodie, Rose
Soro Dagostino: Any additional Citizen’s concerns?
Rose Springvale: yea, its fascinating reading …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: .)
Rose Springvale: i thought you adjourned and we were just chatting
Soro Dagostino: No.
Pip Torok: no rose …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: no, we didn’t adjourn formally yet
Soro Dagostino: No vote.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: This all goes on record.
Carolyn Saarinen: no we didn’t adjourn
Rose Springvale: sorry.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Why “sorry”? Having the citizen roll up to date is important!
Pip Torok is glad to see it on record
Micael Khandr: Yes
Sonja Strom: We are in the “Concerns of Citizens” section.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Me too, Pip!
Rose Springvale: i didn’t mean to speak on the record
Rose Springvale: shuts up
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aww why not?? it’s a quite serious concern, Rose!
Jamie Palisades: no matter was a good idea to get it out
Micael Khandr: Always a lawyer . . .
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But yes,it was a very good idea indeed
Carolyn Saarinen: Somebody read Rose her Miranda
Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl Caro
Rose Springvale: you have to catch me first
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Carolyn Saarinen: We know were you live!
Gwyneth Llewelyn wonders if the CDS still has Janitors ? the old police force
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We lost our last member of the Secret Service though ? the one that nobody admits that the CDS had.
Pip Torok recoils in horror … “Janitors?” …
Carolyn Saarinen: Has an SLPD uniform
Rose Springvale: Lilith is a janitor!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe Pip ? yes, old law!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oooh
Rose Springvale: didn’t you see her float?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, so Lilith has to know what to do to arrest people!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha true Rose ? lol
Micael Khandr: Are we chatting or is this on the record?
Pip Torok: Now i know why pl dont talk of the “good old days” …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, we SHOULD now adjourn
Carolyn Saarinen: still not adjourned
Soro Dagostino: Not adourned.
Gwyneth Llewelyn moves motion to adjourn then
Pip Torok: so move!
Jamie Palisades:
Micael Khandr: I third the motion to adjourn
Soro Dagostino: Wonderful!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
Gwyneth Llewelyn: poor Soro
Soro Dagostino: In favor.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Micael Khandr: Aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Pip Torok: aye
Soro Dagostino: Opposed?
Soro Dagostino: Adjourned at 11:17 PDT.
Rose Springvale: thank you to the RA members for coming… we appreciate your service.

Permalink.

RA meeting 25 October: Transcript
by Cindy Ecksol » Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:47 pm
Meeting on 2009-10-25
Those present:
Cindy Ecksol is in the chair.
Wasp Thor: Hello, everyone
Lilith Ivory: Hi There
Joaquin Gustav: hello, welcome
Rose Springvale: hi Lilith!
Wasp Thor: Hi Micael
Micael Khandr: Hi Wasp.
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Timo Gufler: hi
Lilith Ivory: Hi Timo
Arria Perreault: Hi Timo
Rose Springvale: hi timo… brb. forgot something in my office
Arria Perreault: Hi Lilith
Arria Perreault: Hi Cindy
Lilith Ivory: Hi Arria
Robert Galland: Hi everyone, sorry, was afk
Cindy Ecksol: ok, I think we’re administratively good.
Cindy Ecksol: recorder is on, so please touch to consent to recording
Robert Galland has indicated consent to be recorded.
Moon Adamant: hello all
Wasp Thor has indicated consent to be recorded.
Joaquin Gustav has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: agendas are in the urn on the floor next to the table here, so please touch to get an agenda
Arria Perreault: Hi SOnja
Joaquin Gustav: ty Cindy
Timo Gufler: Hello Moon and Sonja
Arria Perreault: Hi Gwyn
Arria Perreault has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: and just a “heads up” if you haven’t looked at the forums this morning, you might want to check new postings from Jamie and others
Robert Galland: Ok, thank you
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi all (sorry, lagged out!)
Cindy Ecksol: I’m sure we’ll get links as we go along, but while we’re getting set may as well be productive
Moon Adamant: hmmm packet loss
Cindy Ecksol: morning stui!
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: beat you Cindy
Cindy Ecksol: I was just about to ask what creative spot you were going to sit on today
StuiChicanne Darkstone: snooze you lose
Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles and apologises
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I can’t even stand up again, sorry
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Cindy I am not sitting there
Rose Springvale: hi Calli
Cindy Ecksol: hee hee!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: they want me to conduct the show
Cindy Ecksol: maybe I should make you sit there…..
Callipygian Christensen waves to Rose and everyone else
Joaquin Gustav: hello Calli
Cindy Ecksol: ok, I see a quorum, so let’s get started
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Cindy Ecksol: everyone have the agenda?
StuiChicanne Darkstone has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn hasn’t, but don’t mind me.
Rose Springvale: hi brian!
Timo Gufler has indicated consent to be recorded.
Arria Perreault: I have a request concerning the agenda
Cindy Ecksol: in the urn, gwyn
Cindy Ecksol: yes, arria….
Rose Springvale: she’s got technical problems
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe Cindy, I’m stuck on <0,0,0> – no urn for me
Rose Springvale: gwyn
Lilith Ivory has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: (and a reminder to all that we’ll be using the question queue for questions and comments)
Wasp Thor: Gwyn was on my lap
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it’s in the urn next to the ashes of a departed linden
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn, it’s on the forum here too…hold on I’ll give you a link
Cindy Ecksol: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2590
Arria Perreault: Mrs LRA
I have read your answer in the forum, telling that you don’t add the point I have requested in the agenda. I nevertheless consider that the question of the sale of land owned by CDS and that CDS will sell is an important question. The solution of the executive have been debated in the forum. It is clear to me that the land management is a task of the Executive. When I see the number of parcels for sale and the solution proposed that seems to me subject to critics and questions (as everybody can read in the forum), I consider that the Representative Assembly has to discuss the question of land sale by CDS on a general point of view and to set a frame in which the executive can act. I don’t think that only organization of sales (whatever the method) can solve the main problem (many parcels for sale). This question need a real debate and inputs from many people. For these reasons, I ask this Assembly to set in the Agenda of the meeting a discussion about the Bill I have proposed in the forums at the fo
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ( ty, that works )) )
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I shall hold Cindy’s notes
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am the glamorous assistant
Free Radar HUD v1.1 by Crystal Gadgets
Moon Adamant has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: thank you arria.
Cindy Ecksol: Before we get specifically to your point, I’d like to ask everyon eto look at the agenda.
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Sonja Strom: Did Arria finish?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ?
Arria Perreault: I have given my request. I can give arguments later
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I have the link, thanks
Sonja Strom: okay
Cindy Ecksol: you’ll notice that we DO have on the agenda today a discussion of land sales.
Sonja Strom: the “at the fo” ending was a little be incomplete for me.
Cindy Ecksol: I received that request from the Chancellor’s office before Arria posted her proposal and agreed to include it on the agenda
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, on III a.
Cindy Ecksol: I’ll also note that I’ve not refused to discuss Arria’s proposal, just asked her to defer iti to a future meeting
Cindy Ecksol: you’ll also notice that the agenda allows 40 minutes to discuss land sales.
Cindy Ecksol: I expect (and hope!) that all who have concerns abou tthat issue will bring them up today.
Sonja Strom has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: and also hope that whatever action the RA takes today, if Arria or others still feel that we need to consider her bill or other alternatives, that they will propose them for a future agenda
Cindy Ecksol: done
Cindy Ecksol: now…
Cindy Ecksol: Arria, are you making a motion that we modify the agenda?
Arria Perreault: I don’t think that the fact that the request of the Executive come before is relevant. I think that my proposal is more general than the one of the Executive
StuiChicanne Darkstone: are we all sitting comfortably – perhaps we should begin
Arria Perreault: I think that the RA has to define a general frame for these sales. So I make a motion.
Cindy Ecksol: stui….we are already discussing the agenda
Cindy Ecksol: Arria — ifi you want your item on the agenda, you (or someone) must make a motion and someone must second.
Cindy Ecksol: what is the motion?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The motion to discuss Arria’s proposed bill is on the floor, I think
Cindy Ecksol: goodl.
Cindy Ecksol: do we have a second?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And I’d be willing to second that discussion, yes.
Cindy Ecksol: thank you gwyn
Cindy Ecksol: discussion?
Cindy Ecksol: (please queue
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn?
Gwyneth Llewelyn is not sure if the chat lag has eaten my seconding… lol
Cindy Ecksol:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, my apologies….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I just wanted to do a very short comment,
Arria Perreault: Motion is: to add a new point in the agenda: Land selling Act (viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2583#p13853)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: after thinking quite a bit about all this discussion
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I believe that ONE thing is crucial,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: whatever the system we decide upon,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: it has to be VERY SIMPLE
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I mean, the goal ought to be: “as simple as buying land on any other community”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I know that’s a hard goal to set,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: but anything “Too complicated”,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: will just drive people away from teh CDS
Rose Springvale: point of order? are we discussion the motion or the addition to the agenda?
Cindy Ecksol: discussion of the motion, rose
Rose Springvale: is that in order?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Anyway, my chat lag makes things too confusing for me right now, so I’ll hush and wait patiently for the chat lag to go away. Thanks
Cindy Ecksol: thanks, gwyn.
Cindy Ecksol: rose, you are next in queue…was that your question?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Rose Springvale: not sure what my question is. We have a plan we’ve been working on for months
Rose Springvale: and have had no input from the proponent of this motion
Cindy Ecksol: ok…hold that thought please…
Rose Springvale: query the rationale now
Cindy Ecksol: I’d like to stick to the issue of the agenda
Micael Khandr: Cindy–could you repeat the motion on the floor at the moment please?
Cindy Ecksol: before I call the vote, I’d jus t like to comment that the agenda is tight. we have two hours, I’d like to allow respectful discussion of the Chancellor’s proposal
Arria Perreault: add a new point in the agenda under III Land selling Act (viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2583#p13853)
Cindy Ecksol: and also of Arria’s if we vote to add to the agenda.
Arria Perreault: it’s my motion
Cindy Ecksol: I’m not sur ethat we will be able to do both today, so I will say that I plan to vote against modifying the agenda
Cindy Ecksol: any other comments?
Arria Perreault: I will answer to Rose
Rose Springvale: no not now
Cindy Ecksol: no arria, off topic…
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Robert Galland
Cindy Ecksol: yes, robert?
Micael Khandr: Call the vote?
Cindy Ecksol: robert first….
Cindy Ecksol: ?
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Robert Galland: As to this motion, I agree with you that we should have time to hear the Chancellor’s proposal today. At the next meeting, Arria’s bill can receive ample attention and we can then vote. So, I hope we decide to split these items up frankly.
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor of modifyin gthe agenda to add presentation and discussion
Cindy Ecksol: please say aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Wasp Thor: aye
Micael Khandr: What are we “aye”ing?
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor of modifyin gthe agenda to add presentation and discussion
Cindy Ecksol: please say aye
Rose Springvale: cindy
Arria Perreault: aye
Joaquin Gustav: no
Cindy Ecksol: all opposed?
Micael Khandr: no
Robert Galland: no
StuiChicanne Darkstone: nay !
Cindy Ecksol: and I also say nay
Cindy Ecksol: motion fails.
Arria Perreault: May I a question?
Cindy Ecksol: any other modifications to the agenda for today?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Motion fails with 5 aye and 3 nay?
Gwyneth Llewelyn *scratches head*
Cindy Ecksol: no…five nay and 4 aye is my count
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn, sonja, wasp, arria in favor….joa, cindy, micael, robert stui opposed
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah, I guess my chat is really too unreliable today, sorry
Sudane Erato has indicated consent to be recorded.
Micael Khandr: nay
Cindy Ecksol: may I have a motion to approve the agenda please?
Robert Galland: I move so
Cindy Ecksol: second?
Micael Khandr: second
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Robert Galland: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE !
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Carolyn Saarinen has indicated consent to be recorded.
Wasp Thor: aye
Micael Khandr: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE !
Micael Khandr: OK stui . . .
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m excitable today
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Micael Khandr: Today?
Cindy Ecksol: motion carries.
Gwyneth Llewelyn abstains
Sonja Strom abstains
Cindy Ecksol: naftali has requested a 7 day vote.
Arria Perreault: abstains
Cindy Ecksol: I’m not aware of any others.
Arria Perreault: for the firstmotion too?
Cindy Ecksol: arria, motion to amend the agenda failed. the agenda as proposed was just approved.
Carolyn Saarinen: I’d best abstain since I missed the discussion so far.
Cindy Ecksol: no problem, caro —
Cindy Ecksol: ok…future RA meeting: Nov 8 at 0900
Cindy Ecksol: I will pu tup a Doodle the week before the meeting
Cindy Ecksol: old business
Cindy Ecksol: a. In-world status board. Caro, anything new?
Sudane Erato: i can report on thata, if you wish
Carolyn Saarinen: We agreed locations and at least one has been set up
Cindy Ecksol: ah, great! where do we go?
Carolyn Saarinen: Sudane, please continue
Sudane Erato: the board is all set up, save for one feature, that I’d like to have before i duplicate it..
Sudane Erato: that is
Sudane Erato: a notecard from each member
Sudane Erato: which is given out to the toucher if they wish it
Jamie Palisades: I gather ir hands out blank cards, or nothing, if I click on a member now
Sudane Erato: i’d like that before i duplicate it for the other locations, if possible
Cindy Ecksol: ok, shall I send e-mail to the RA members requesting that they send you a notecard?
Micael Khandr: The notecard? When?
Sudane Erato: yes… there’s an ‘example notecard” in there now
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Autographs ?
Cindy Ecksol: ok….great.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And from the Executive too?
Sudane Erato: yes, that would be great
Cindy Ecksol makes a note to followup
Sudane Erato: just the people whose indicators are there
Sudane Erato: RA members
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok.
Cindy Ecksol: ok……thanks Caro, sudane
Cindy Ecksol: love to see things get done
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Cindy Ecksol: next item….
Cindy Ecksol: b, Commerce Commission. Stui?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we held a meeting that was well attended we posted feedback and minutes on the forums… we are to reschedules a meeting at earliest convenience of Rosy and I
Cindy Ecksol: ok, great.
Cindy Ecksol: questions for stui?
Micael Khandr: Why aren’t you wearing a shirt?
Moon Adamant: lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Cindy Ecksol: um….about the commission, micael
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I was doing a foto for my latest project
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: SpaWorld !
Cindy Ecksol: ok…moving on,…..
Cindy Ecksol: item c. Regional commissions
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And why are you crying, Stui? (sorry, please disregard that!)
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, anything new?
Cindy Ecksol: whoops…thought I saw jamie…maybe not
Rose Springvale: he’s here….
Moon Adamant: he’s here
StuiChicanne Darkstone: he’s over my shoulder
Cindy Ecksol: oh, there you are….anything new, jamie?
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Moon Adamant pokes Jamie
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Moon flick his hearing aid
Jamie Palisades raises eyebrow
Jamie Palisades: hearing aid? heh
StuiChicanne Darkstone: or ear trumpet
Moon Adamant:
Jamie Palisades: Anything new, well, yes, I still have three people who I;m waiting to get a yes from
Jamie Palisades: so
StuiChicanne Darkstone: am I one of them ?
Jamie Palisades: by thext wednesday I will ask each of them one more time, then move on with alternatives or without them
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *LOL* I’ll say yes to anything
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks….
Jamie Palisades: I don;t think so, STui, I thikn you and i talked about you being mor likely …
Wasp Thor: Stui, was anything accomplished in the meeting
Jamie Palisades: … to be a arts prograsm CR$EATOR applyibng for funds, than a neutral funds doler0out
Lilith Ivory: as soon as I can see it lol
Jamie Palisades: oops, whihc agenda item are we on?
Cindy Ecksol: actually we’re on “regional commissions”
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Moon Adamant: eheheh
Jamie Palisades: did we mov4e on the regional commissions? apologies if not, that’s what I was answering
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Jamie Palisades: (and have completed, with the note that we’ll fniish all appointments this week)
Cindy Ecksol: stui, did you want to make a quick reply to Wasp on her question?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: have done in IM
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks….
Wasp Thor: I sorry..
Wasp Thor: I’m Sorry! for the troublew
Wasp Thor: trouble
Cindy Ecksol: no problem — bad lag -)
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Cindy Ecksol: next item
Cindy Ecksol: Linden partnership status
Jamie Palisades: Right. If I may
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, I believe you posted to forums on this?
Jamie Palisades: link to the item is here:
Jamie Palisades: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2594
Jamie Palisades: and I havce recommended we procees
Jamie Palisades: *proceed
Jamie Palisades: but
Jamie Palisades: the only thing the program semes to DO, for now …
Jamie Palisades: is supply extra joining connective sims
Jamie Palisades: between a participating sim and … something else
Jamie Palisades: so in this additional post:
Jamie Palisades: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2595
Jamie Palisades: I asked you aanother question: do we in fact want to do what our Sudane here has done with her SLNE — hook up phsyically with someone? or the mainland?
Jamie Palisades: if so trhe program will have much more meaning to us.
Jamie Palisades: I suggest you have two quetsions for the RA
Jamie Palisades: (qa) SHall we apply? (I think so, and think it’s harmless)
Jamie Palisades: and
Jamie Palisades: (qb) DO we ant to pursue land joining? Or just bask in the possible glory of Favored Estate Thingie, and wait to see what other goodies are involved?
Jamie Palisades: done, thanks
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn, question?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well… more like a reply actually
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Although it’s mostly a decision of the Exec,
Cindy Ecksol: you have the floor…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’d definitely like to propose a motion to approve the Exec’s suggestion to apply for the Linden programme
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And, as a side note,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (again, also an Exec decision; we can just appluad it or ignore it)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: that means the guild should think about the best way to “join” the mainland
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Historically, it would be fun to be as close to Anzere as possible,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: but that might be a) impossible b) found not to be feasible c) LL might not like it
Jamie Palisades nodfs
Carolyn Saarinen: Anzere?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, to recap, I definitely support this Executive decision
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks!
Jamie Palisades: (and is there anyone ELSE we’d want to be next to? tough one)
Timo Gufler thinks that it would be great to have CDS in front of a sea
Rose Springvale: excuse me
Moon Adamant: Caro, CDS’ hub in the mainland
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (Caledon!)
Rose Springvale: ther are lots of newcomers here
Jamie Palisades: (the original mainland home of CDS, Caro)
Cindy Ecksol: (thx rose)
Cindy Ecksol: and thx gwyn
Carolyn Saarinen: Ah, “when dinosaurs ruled the grid”
Cindy Ecksol: hold that motion for a moment, gwyn and we’ll get a second
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sure
Sudane Erato: hehe
Cindy Ecksol: but I think Moon is up next
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Moon Adamant
Moon Adamant: thanks
Cindy Ecksol: Moon, you have the floor
Moon Adamant: ok, my question has justly to do with land joining, granting of sims by LL, etc
Moon Adamant: we hae a GMP approved, and being revised
Moon Adamant: this GMP implies expansion in sims and in themes
Moon Adamant: it also implies considerable landforming
Rose Springvale: (GMP = General master plan, for zoning)
Micael Khandr: TY
Moon Adamant: this is not really a question, but a suggestion that
Moon Adamant: hmmm we check carefully if we can still pursue the GMP and the expansions planned
Moon Adamant: namely as to what regards land, and space for future themes
Moon Adamant: done
Jamie Palisades: for information, if there are no obections, what I wqould like to do is submit the app and say we are “interested” in exploring land joins, potentially, noting that as one part of the program, but only subject to further examination. Within CDS we would need to do a planning process — whether by the Guild, if it continues to be viable as a currenbt source of public planning assistance as it once was, or otherwise as the RA sees fit. Today’s plan is to indicate interest in the program, not to commit to any land acts
Cindy Ecksol: done jamie?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Cindy Ecksol
Cindy Ecksol: ah…I’m next
Jamie Palisades: yes thx
Cindy Ecksol: question for jamie: don’t we have to come up with some kind of a “project” to apply for this program? if not, I’m not sure what, exactly, it’s about. what are the benefits to us if not for a joint project?
Jamie Palisades: Fair poinbt
Jamie Palisades: No, we don;t need to do so
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good question!
Jamie Palisades: the program is unspecified as to the possible goodies
Jamie Palisades: buit
Jamie Palisades: ]the only one trhat we’ve seen SO FAR
Jamie Palisades: is the land deal
Cindy Ecksol nods
Jamie Palisades: If Sudane comes bgack, mayb ew3e shud get a few comments from her on her perception of the Blake Sea deal?
Carolyn Saarinen: Typical LL! Sign up now, we’ll you what for later.
Jamie Palisades: which really is the beta test of this program
Cindy Ecksol: yeah, really!
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Cindy Ecksol: Rose?
Cindy Ecksol: Rose, you have the floor
Rose Springvale: i just wanted to point out that we already HAVE a project.. the democracy experiment
Rose Springvale: so lots of logical tie ins
Cindy Ecksol perks up her ears
Rose Springvale: done
Rose Springvale: lol
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we could do a CDS charity calendar !
Cindy Ecksol: followup…rose, what kind of logical tie ins?
Cindy Ecksol: I have not been able to think of any that LL could hgelp with
Rose Springvale: i mean what we are doing now is more project than most sims
Rose Springvale: self government IS a project
Cindy Ecksol: yes…but what would we ask LL to help with if we could??
Carolyn Saarinen: We could offer to ‘civilize’ the Mainland
Sudane Erato: hehe
Rose Springvale: smiles. that’s to be seen.
Sonja Strom is working on that in Arosa
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s our Hidden Agenda?, Caro & Rose ,)
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Rose Springvale: isn’t bay city that?
Jamie Palisades smiles. Arowse. We may talk about that too, soon,
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Moon Adamant
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we could ask LL to set up our welfare state !
StuiChicanne Darkstone: for poor SLers
Cindy Ecksol: Moon, you had another question or comment?
Moon Adamant: mind two things here, after reading the link
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What do you mean, “ask”? *My* hidden agenda is to push LL out of the mainland altogether, and replace the Governance Team with the CDS.
Moon Adamant: one is that apparently we lose some estate powers
Moon Adamant: 4.Ban capabilities will not be granted to Residents on Mainland or in Community Partnership Areas.
Moon Adamant: and also, apparently problems will have to be solved through the Issue Tracker
Moon Adamant: now, hmmm
Carolyn Saarinen: ie ignored
Moon Adamant: well, last time i used teh issue tracker, they replied in 48 hours
Moon Adamant: so… my question is… what powers of estate do we keep?
Carolyn Saarinen: your milage may vary ;/
Robert Galland: Good question
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, good questions ? Sudane might be able to answer some of them!
Jamie Palisades: FWIW, it was my impression that those statements (Moon mentioned about limited powers) only apply to the new land provided as Linden voids – not to a partner’s own estate land. May I suggest we turn to Sudane who has experience with this in the Blake project?
Moon Adamant: you see, these deals with LL are always good to check what happens done
Jamie Palisades: (Sorry if we collided there Moon)
Cindy Ecksol: ah, yes.!
Cindy Ecksol: ok, queue that one up for sudane….
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, I think you have said what you queued to say, no?
Jamie Palisades: i yield my time to Sudane, that’s why I hit to Big ?
Cindy Ecksol: Sudane, can you tell u swhat you know about “no ba powers”?
Cindy Ecksol: *ban
Cindy Ecksol: etc.
Sudane Erato: Ban powers in the Blake Sea?
Cindy Ecksol: yes…moon mentioned that powers in “community partnership” areas are limited
Cindy Ecksol: do you know anything about this?
Sudane Erato: well… this is a very complicated questionm
Cindy Ecksol: does it just apply (as Jamie mentioned) in “granted” areas?
Sudane Erato: they have n ow finally just arrived at a structure
Sudane Erato: there will be a designed group of people with *parcel* autority
Sudane Erato: not estate authroity
Sudane Erato: and the total intent is to facilitate the races
Sudane Erato: not particularly to exert general authroity
Cindy Ecksol: ok, so may be specific to that particular project?
Sudane Erato: if we want to delve into this in detail… we’d have to go into a lot of discusssion… but obviously, this is a very difficult topic for LL
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks
Cindy Ecksol: let’s defer….
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn made a motion to authorize Chancellor to apply on CDS behalf to the program
Cindy Ecksol: do we have a second?
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I second
Sonja Strom: I thought this was passed in our last meeting?
Cindy Ecksol did not see it in minutes
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye !
Micael Khandr: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye !!
Sonja Strom: aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Arria Perreault: aye
Cindy Ecksol: any opposed?
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Cindy Ecksol: abstentions?
Robert Galland: aye, sorry,
Wasp Thor: aye
Cindy Ecksol: motion carries. Jamie, why don’t you post the application to the forum when you get it filled out.
Pip Torok: am present … too late to vote?
Pip Torok: ah ok … thank you
Cindy Ecksol: it’s unanimous, pip, but you can vote if you touch the recorder first
Jamie Palisades has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: ok, moving on — Al Andalus citizens — CDS group roles?
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, I think you were going to do something about that….
Jamie Palisades smniles
Jamie Palisades: may i just inform the RA that my colleague the AA estate owner and I have no idea what this item is about?
Rose Springvale: lol
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Jamie Palisades: perhaps a communication now or later would help?
Sudane Erato:
Rose Springvale: i think you are refering to upgrading group roles but not AA group roles lol
Jamie Palisades: who, for example, asked for the item?
Sonja Strom: I thought we talked about this in the last meeting too…
Carolyn Saarinen: In my case it’s been dealt with, I can’t speak for others
Pip Torok: which item are we on please?
Cindy Ecksol: was discussing the fact that at last meeting Carolyn mentioned that AA “citizens” did not have “citizen” role in CDS group
Micael Khandr: Not in my case . . .
Cindy Ecksol: iie Pip
Jamie Palisades: any chyance of this item bgeing, ah, defined, by its proponent, whoever that might be?
Rose Springvale: oh… let me get back to that
Jamie Palisades: AH
Pip Torok: tks cindy
Jamie Palisades: thanks better
Cindy Ecksol: sorry….
Rose Springvale: i can fix them cindy, sorry, didn’ tknow it was on agenda
Jamie Palisades: just so yu know, we have been rolling through adding them all
Jamie Palisades: but
Cindy Ecksol: IIe.
Jamie Palisades: quite a few
Jamie Palisades: ar eohnly ihtermittently in SL
Jamie Palisades: so we get offers than lay around or even expire
Jamie Palisades: *that
Cindy Ecksol: ok, as long as it’s being addressed. just looking for status.
Jamie Palisades: Shall we just plaan to report it’s completed by next meeting, then?
Cindy Ecksol: yes, please…
Jamie Palisades: ok thx
Cindy Ecksol: next item: II f. election dates
Cindy Ecksol:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *considers Pinching Robert’s shirt*
Cindy Ecksol: New term begins: 1 Feb 2010
Elections: 9-16 Jan 2010
Candidate declaration deadline: 25 Dec 2009
Faction viability date: 25 Dec 2009
Citizen list certification: 12 Dec 2009
Cindy Ecksol: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2579
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: StuiChicanne Darkstone
Cindy Ecksol: stui, you have the floor
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Christmas DAY !?
Cindy Ecksol: can be BEFORE that, stui
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I will have my hand up a turkey’s bits and bobs that day
Cindy Ecksol: just not after….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: what happens if as an 11th hour decision I plop the giblets on the keyboard ?
Moon Adamant: lol
Cindy Ecksol: this is the last time elections will happen in this timeframe
Jamie Palisades: Then you have a messy keyboard.
Arria Perreault: it’s the deadline
Cindy Ecksol: just need to deal with it once more.
Cindy Ecksol wipes hand across brow
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Cindy Ecksol: on to New Business!!!
Jamie Palisades: (Yes, this is not the result of your act, but rather, the usual dates, applied the last time before your changes, correct)
Cindy Ecksol: yes, exactly…
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and Robert can supply me with the LM for his shirt for my Christmas gift
Cindy Ecksol: last time for lousy election deadlines….
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Cindy Ecksol: Rose — land sales proposal please!
Robert Galland: Sure
Rose Springvale: yielding to the Chancellor
Jamie Palisades: Rose? yOU WANT TO LEAD OFF, OR SHOUDOL i SAY A FEW WORDS FIRST?
Cindy Ecksol reminds everyone to queue for questions so rose can finish>
Cindy Ecksol: or Jamie…
Rose Springvale: you
Jamie Palisades: (oopsd caps, sorry)
Jamie Palisades: ok then\…
Rose Springvale: (see, he yells!)
Rose Springvale:
Jamie Palisades: ok folks Like my new microphone talking toy?
Jamie Palisades: First the URL link
Sudane Erato: hehe
Jamie Palisades: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2583
Rose Springvale had to cam in, looked like litiths rats
Jamie Palisades: second the short background
Lilith Ivory: looks like a wipe for me
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Jamie I want your best rendition of Mustang Sally
Jamie Palisades: (heh it IS one of her rats – shh )
Jamie Palisades give sthe micorphone an Ozzy Ozbourne look
Jamie Palisades: background, ahem
Jamie Palisades: once upon a time
Pip Torok: insulting my sally mustang, stu!
Jamie Palisades: CDS sold land through Sudane as estate owner
Jamie Palisades: there was a website listing
Jamie Palisades: a hope to keep it better updated
Jamie Palisades: she tried to keep an informal waiting list
Jamie Palisades: and there usually was one
Jamie Palisades: then
Jamie Palisades: we converted to selling CDS-owned land, in existing sims, by yellow map sale
Jamie Palisades: in other words, anyone can grab it
Jamie Palisades: like Linden mainland
Jamie Palisades: some estates never did that
Jamie Palisades: Caledon comes to mind
Jamie Palisades: becaue they did not like missing the opportunity to meet & greet newbies
Jamie Palisades: we still do NOT do that with NEW sims
Jamie Palisades: last term
Jamie Palisades: I told the RA I thought we should abandon the yellow map plan
Jamie Palisades: and was asked to propose an alternative, and notify the RA
Jamie Palisades: \(as usual, so you can stop us if we’re doing something wrong )
Jamie Palisades: Rose’s posting, the URL above
Jamie Palisades: is that proposal.
Jamie Palisades: We ALSO have recently discvussed another change
Jamie Palisades: or several – about land PRICES
Jamie Palisades: Arria suggested that we auctio off land to the highest bidder
Jamie Palisades: I suggested we give it away and just collect tier
Jamie Palisades: interesting ideas
Jamie Palisades: but not today’s problem
Jamie Palisades: today’s issue is that Rose and I plan to start using the 7 day advance notice – then lottery – method
Jamie Palisades: unles you tell us not to so do by a bill.
Jamie Palisades: May I ask Rose to amplifgy a little, about what our current vacxancies and proospectxs condition is, and how we came to this plan?
Rose Springvale: sure, but i’m not touching the rat
Rose Springvale: thanks
Gwyneth Llewelyn just sees a rabbit but no rats
Rose Springvale: we have today, abandoned or otherwise repossessed land in CDs of about 23 parcels
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Rose Springvale: because there have been inssues in the past about who got to buy the land
Rose Springvale: we looked for a way that would be completely fair.
Rose Springvale: not sensitive to time zone
Rose Springvale: not sensitive to “my friends”
Rose Springvale: not sensitive to faction or project or old timer or newbie
Rose Springvale: the result was a lottery… which hopefully you’ve all read about
Rose Springvale: on Tuesday, i sent out notices to both our groups
Rose Springvale: together representing about 400 individuals
Rose Springvale: and posted on the forums… what land is available NOW
Rose Springvale: there is more that will come available as we process it through the CDS reposession procedure, but this is land that right now is NOT paying tier
Rose Springvale: IF
Rose Springvale: more than one person wants parcels of that land
Pip Torok: link to that “lottery” please?
Rose Springvale: THEN we have the “drawing.”
Rose Springvale: jamies link Pip
Rose Springvale: Timo very kindly created a script
Jamie Palisades: Pip: the idea here, but the extacly method to be disvussed (see Timo’s post in that thread) viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2583
Rose Springvale: which i’ve placed in the prim at the back of the room with the CDS flag logo
Rose Springvale: any of you can see how that works.
Pip Torok: tks jamie
timos random block: Cindy Ecksol cast dice and got 5.
timos random block: Cindy Ecksol cast dice and got 3.
timos random block: Jamie Palisades cast dice and got 5.
timos random block: Jamie Palisades cast dice and got 4.
timos random block: Cindy Ecksol cast dice and got 1.
Rose Springvale: this just gives a way to randomize selections.
Sudane Erato:
timos random block: Micael Khandr cast dice and got 4.
Jamie Palisades smiles.
timos random block: Micael Khandr cast dice and got 5.
Rose Springvale: lol
Rose Springvale: okay, stop the spam!
Rose Springvale:
Micael Khandr:
Jamie Palisades: Are we all toy-craxy, or what?:
Rose Springvale: however, most parcels have not got multiple party’s interest… so may never be an issue
Micael Khandr: You said to touch it . . .
Rose Springvale: Mostly, this gets land back on the roles, in the hands of people who want it and is indiscriminatory.
Rose Springvale: More jamie?
Jamie Palisades: I don’t think so. Thanks. Questions?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Arria Perreault
timos random block: Wasp Thor cast dice and got 2.
Cindy Ecksol: arria, you have the floor
Arria Perreault: Thank you
Pip Torok: yes … what stops ppl from applying for every plot on the list?
Jamie Palisades: May I?
Jamie Palisades: 1. Our land concentration covenants
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Pippet – the question doofah
Pip Torok: (sorry ms LRA)
Jamie Palisades: 2. The faqct that they will be evicted of they are not current on ALL parcels
Jamie Palisades: 3. heh heh
Jamie Palisades: economics of SL – there’s almost zero arbitrage gain
Arria Perreault: I have several questions/suggestions, some on the general problem and some on the proposal of the Executive
Jamie Palisades: and if we try it for this term and do not like the resultws? Fine
Jamie Palisades: and may I point out, some spendthrift could do the same thing in an auction
Jamie Palisades: or under CURRENT law
Jamie Palisades: any of those three ways, they are stuck with our land – and we get paid
Cindy Ecksol: ok, folks….arriai has the floor!
Jamie Palisades: So I think that’s a false issue
Jamie Palisades: Sorry, was answering
Arria Perreault: I ask first
Arria Perreault: or are you diviner
Cindy Ecksol: go ahead arria
Cindy Ecksol: jamie idd not realize that pip was not you
Jamie Palisades: (erk, I answered and only then noticed it was Pip, my apologies to Arria also)
Arria Perreault: I would like to question first the calender: why are we so slow? The yellow map story is not from yesterday.
I would like also ask another question: who are trying to reach for these sales?
Citizen or potential new citizen?
Why the sales of the Monastery sims parcels have been stopped, although there were new lands?
Arria Perreault: Jamie’s introduction shows also that this is a general problem: land sale. I continue to believe that we need a strong frame and some new ideas.
Jamie Palisades politely waits to see when and if an answer from th e government is desired
Arria Perreault: With the proposal whe have to discuss, I have two problems
how to make a random drawing?
It is important that the executive gives garanties about the random drawing process. There are suggestions. It is also important to determine which branch is responsible for the random drawing. In any case, the script that is used must be published and accepted by the SC. The drawing must be done in presence of SC members.
Arria Perreault: how people can announce their interest for a plot ?
As the principal expectation from citizen is the transparency, I think that inscriptions have to be transparent. I am in favour of an inscription on the forum or the blog, instead of a mail to any mail-adress..
timos random block: Moon Adamant cast dice and got 2.
Arria Perreault: Finally I have proposed to use the auction to sell this land. It is a very common system to sell items (even for a state). Linden Lab use it and eBay is very popular. It means that many people can use it. It is also the most transparent system and the easiest to manage. The result is clear and never subject to the critic. Everyone can see who is buying and what it to buy and can even show her/his intererest. Poeple can also negociate in the background as the auction will be for a certain period. As the competition is not very high, I don’t expect that prices will increase.
Arria Perreault: Done
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, would you like to respond to Arria?
Jamie Palisades grins
Rose Springvale: smiles
Jamie Palisades: lots of questions there
Jamie Palisades: about six
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Can we get a bingo machine ?
Arria Perreault: of course
Jamie Palisades: so let’s try a short answer
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I will do the calling
Jamie Palisades: 1. Arria asks about timing of this plan
Jamie Palisades: Rose an dI work for CDS, as volunteers, and often not as fast as some RA members might wish
Jamie Palisades: My three pr4edecessors as Chancellor showed up at RA meetings – and indeed in CDS — approximately
Jamie Palisades: bimonthly. never, and monthly
Jamie Palisades: so
Jamie Palisades: slow as we are
Jamie Palisades: I believe we are working with resaonble diligence
Jamie Palisades: and as we informed the RA
Jamie Palisades: this inmportant issue is the one we decided to focus on after Oktoberfest
Jamie Palisades: and here we are
Jamie Palisades: #2
Jamie Palisades: Arria mentions the SC
Jamie Palisades: it is my belief
Jamie Palisades: that the structure of our government
Jamie Palisades: expects the executive (including Sudane) to set up and execut4 fair systems
Jamie Palisades: for the RA to oversee and constrain them by legislation
Jamie Palisades: and for the SC to adjudicate if they are UNfair by breaking our laws
Jamie Palisades: i;m not sure giving this one to the SC would be either structurally sound, or sensible
Jamie Palisades: they, ah, meet even less than they did back when the SC was all Gywn
Gwyneth Llewelyn *coughs*
Jamie Palisades: THey’re3 better at appeals than administration in my voiew
Jamie Palisades: #3
Jamie Palisades: Arria proposes auction
Jamie Palisades: i believe that is NOT is use in SL land much at all
Jamie Palisades: and that the reason for that is twofold
Jamie Palisades: (q) we are in a significantly declining land sale market in SL
Jamie Palisades: most big estates, even well run, have much higher default vacxancy rates than CDS
Jamie Palisades: which means
Jamie Palisades: they lose rent
Jamie Palisades: they;re “in the red”negative cash flor
Jamie Palisades: *flow
Jamie Palisades: and they close sims
Jamie Palisades: nboty what I;d like to see
Jamie Palisades: (b) auctions maximize SALE price
Jamie Palisades: at the expense of LESS monthly rent
Jamie Palisades: that’s directly AGAINST our interest as CDDS
Jamie Palisades: which is to live off the monthly rent, and keep ourselves with a high occupancy
Jamie Palisades: I can see how persons
Jamie Palisades: ?me smiles at a few R$A members
Jamie Palisades: with their own land or projects to sell
Jamie Palisades: might want US to charge high prices
Jamie Palisades: but that’s not in OUR best interest.
Jamie Palisades: Finally
Jamie Palisades: \#4
Jamie Palisades: Arria asks
Jamie Palisades: whay we mostly stoppe dland sales for a few weeks
Jamie Palisades: qs previously discussed here
Jamie Palisades: two reasons again – given that we could sustain the cash flow problem without risk
Jamie Palisades: (a) we knew a new system is imminent, unless the RA stops it
Jamie Palisades: so better to have all land on a fair equal platform\
Jamie Palisades: and (b) Rowe an dI were criticiazed by Timo and Pip, so felt we shoud do nothing until the RA was fully briefed
Jamie Palisades: *rose and I
Jamie Palisades: now
Jamie Palisades: mnid you
Jamie Palisades: favoritism aboundewd in CDS at timres for uyears before I arrived, in my prsonal view
Jamie Palisades: but
Jamie Palisades: if peopel chgoose to speak up now, not then, that[‘s their choice
Jamie Palisades: our hjob is simply to MAKE it fair now
Jamie Palisades: so that’s our p0lan and motive. Let me finally, in fairness to Arria
Jamie Palisades: point out that she has a personal interest in being relieved of her company’s guareantee
Jamie Palisades: on the Monastery parcelos
Jamie Palisades: and so
Jamie Palisades: if our hold has disadvantaged her
Jamie Palisades: I suggest she ask the RA to relieve her of the continuing rent guarantee on the parcels not offered yet for sale
Jamie Palisades: that woud seem fair tyo me – but is for her to propose if she w3sihes.
Jamie Palisades: Thanks, done – did I catch all the questions?
Rose Springvale: transparency
Arria Perreault: one is remainng
Cindy Ecksol: arria, do you have a followup?
Jamie Palisades smiles, listens
Arria Perreault: you did not answer on transparency: any comment on the idea that people announced their intention on the forum ?
Gwyneth Llewelyn thanks Jamie for the very thorough explanation
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Jamie Palisades: Arria, ar eyou asking whether a queue for land sales woudl be published, so people see who is bidding?
Arria Perreault: instead to write a mail, people write their name on the forum with the code of the parcel(s). We did this with good results in the opning of AM and LA
Jamie Palisades: Interesting though. Let me defer to Rose – but it;ps worth disvcussing, surely. You get a different result, if people SHOW wh’;s interested, mayb, than if requests are anonymous
Rose Springvale: thanks
Jamie Palisades: Rose?
Rose Springvale: i’ve posted the list on the forum and asked for people to indicate interest by way of notecard to me, or email
Rose Springvale: the reason for that is two fold
Rose Springvale: one
Rose Springvale: some people are not eligible for one reason or another
Rose Springvale: out of respect for privacy, i’d rather discuss those issues personally
Rose Springvale: second
Rose Springvale: because the point of this excercise is fairness
Rose Springvale: it did not seem to be in the best interest of CDS for people to enter into the pool based on who else wanted land
Pip Torok: hear hear
Rose Springvale: we all have our people we like or don’t like so much
Rose Springvale: thanks pip, i’ll use you lol
Rose Springvale: if i don’t want pip for a neighbor, it might encourage me to compete for a parcel
Wasp Thor: hahahahaha
Rose Springvale: CDS is not a popularity contest, and our land sales shouldn’t be either
Rose Springvale: also, because many people who may want to buy our land are NOT citizens now
Rose Springvale: posting on forums eliminates their options
Jamie Palisades: Yeah, I’m going to buy all the rest of the land in AM as a member of the League Against English Poetry Read in Charming Voices
Rose Springvale: smiles
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Rose Springvale: done
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Pip Torok
Sudane Erato:
Moon Adamant:
Pip Torok: )
Cindy Ecksol: Pip, you have a question or comment?
Arria Perreault: Me frst?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: in the Q
Pip Torok: yes .. just to say tht the wghole principle of money in auctions is unequal unfair and pernicious to evrything CDS stans for … do we want money to rule?
Pip Torok: finished
Cindy Ecksol: thanks piip
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: StuiChicanne Darkstone
Cindy Ecksol: Stui?
Cindy Ecksol: and then Arria next if you still have a followup
Arria Perreault: Cindy, you did not let me answer …
Arria Perreault: ok
Cindy Ecksol thinks one folllowup at a time allows us to be fair to all who want to speak
Micael Khandr: (whistles to himself)
Cindy Ecksol waits for stui to finish typing
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think it a ridiculous notion to have an auction and more so for there to be published interest because people will just push up prices to be petty and well if you want land you will throw your hat in without caring who else wants land – why else would anyone propose a wish to know who is interested but to be sour grapes ?
Cindy Ecksol: thanks stui.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Arria could answer me perhaps ?
Cindy Ecksol: arria, you had another question?
Cindy Ecksol: (or comment or answer to stui)
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Arria Perreault: I will answer to Jamie and then to Stui
Arria Perreault: Jamie said “she ask the RA to relieve her of the continuing rent guarantee on the parcels not offered yet for sale”. I don’t have to do that, because it was the deal between CDS and I: 4 months
Arria Perreault: SC: for me, it is more a question of setting a rigourous process than any mistrust
Arria Perreault: Inscription on forum: we got no critic on the 2 experiences we did. It worked very well
Arria Perreault: Again, it seems to be important that some people can negociate if they have interesting projects. For example, Ulysse and I, we have a houe on 4 plots in LA. Imagine if one of the four parcel was given to someone else?
Sudane Erato: ??
Arria Perreault: In this case, I would have tryed to buy it again very expensive …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: “given”?
Rose Springvale is lost
Arria Perreault: Auction is still for me the more transparent and self-organised system
Cindy Ecksol looks at time….
Micael Khandr: 2minutes . . .
Cindy Ecksol: done arria?
Arria Perreault: Yes, our big villa in LA: we need 4 specific plots to built it
Jamie Palisades: Me looks at his place in queue, smiles
Arria Perreault: how to get get for a project with this system?
Arria Perreault: done
Cindy Ecksol: thx
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Moon Adamant is going to plump the sofa pillows at the School for the Guild meeting next. Waves see you later )
Jamie Palisades: thanks
Jamie Palisades: I can offline explain why I do not think ARri’s 1-of-4 case would occur
Jamie Palisades: but generaqlly
Jamie Palisades: two things
Arria Perreault: online, please
Jamie Palisades: 1. This is under our law the system we will implement
Jamie Palisades: unless the RA stops it. Just so you know
Jamie Palisades: RA action is not required
Jamie Palisades: and
Jamie Palisades: 2.
Jamie Palisades: I encourge your input about how to improve it
Jamie Palisades: If I may be candid among friends in a smjall town. Arria, my reading of your proposal is, basically, that someone who writes that might not trust us to do it fairly and right, and so wish to take away as much power as possible from the government Now, if that’s correct, then that’s a respectable position .. you could join our own US Republican Party happily, like Mr Reagan and Mr Bush. But: the question of trust is a fair one. Our current system puts a LOT of trust in a few individuals – like Sudane and Gwyn. It’s healthy to ask if that’s a good system. So let me ask: Arria, do you think that there is a way for us to MAKE the lottery-allocation system Rose has proposed MORE safe for fairness? Already, I think, the SC could appeal and overturn any land sale act. What more is needed? Or do some of you, ah, just LIKE the SC members better?
Jamie Palisades: suggestions for improvement ar ewelcome — now — or later — and I expect we will talk about PRICE at the next RA meeting
Jamie Palisades: now that all are on notice that there MIGHT be a radical change to price, smile
Jamie Palisades: that will have whatever market effects it will have
Jamie Palisades: thanksd done
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sonja Strom
Cindy Ecksol: sonja?
Cindy Ecksol: you have the floor
Sonja Strom: My main concern is transparency.
Sonja Strom: Here we are talking about:
Sonja Strom: people who want land would send an email one individual to say they would like a parcel for free.
Sonja Strom: The land would be given to them unless more than one person requested it, in which case the recipient would be chosen by a roll of dice?
Sonja Strom: I find this a questionable practice.
Sonja Strom: In my view an auction would be a more open and fair structure.
Jamie Palisades: and maximize cds prices nice for any compeititors
Sonja Strom: If only one person wanted a parcel, then the price of it would not go high in an auction.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if you are rich it’s fair
Sonja Strom: Thanks
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Wasp Thor
Cindy Ecksol: Wasp, you have the floor
Wasp Thor: LL is losing money due to the adult mandate from congress..and a lot of the large sims are closing…we have to have a simple way to to get the land to as many as possible and depend on the tier…anything else is a waste of time and not realistic to the falling market
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hear, hear!
Cindy Ecksol nods in agreement
Cindy Ecksol: done wasp?
Wasp Thor: yes
Cindy Ecksol: ok…
Pip Torok: is money vs money ever fair?
Cindy Ecksol: we do not need a motion to approve — as jamie points out, land admin is in the realm of the exec
Rose Springvale: i should be in queue madam lra
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: ok, rose?
Cindy Ecksol: go ahead…
Rose Springvale: two points. one, the proposal we will be implementing applies at present only
Rose Springvale: to land that is in inventory. Arria points to LA and AM as “successful” examples
Rose Springvale: i’d submit it was successful to the people who got what they wanted
Rose Springvale: there were people who were NOT happy
Rose Springvale: who wanted watefront
Rose Springvale: or a certain set of parcels
Rose Springvale: so you need to remember that this applies to people who aren’t sitting here with 4 contiguouse parcels as well
Rose Springvale: as for auctions
Rose Springvale: LL does hold auctions
Rose Springvale: i participated in one a few weeks ago
Rose Springvale: wanted a particular parcel along a road and a bigger one behind
Rose Springvale: i ended up winning.. the bigger oen
Rose Springvale: but losing the roadfront
Rose Springvale: so the project was ruind. Auctions let that happen
Rose Springvale: finally
Rose Springvale: with all due respect
Rose Springvale: the references to transparency imply that our predecessors were trustworthy
Rose Springvale: our SC is trustworthy, but “we” in the exec office suddenly can’t be trusted to flip a coin?
Arria Perreault: the principle “first ask, first served” was not good. but the transparency was good. And it is always possible to discuss.
Rose Springvale: makes me wonder why we are spending all our time here
Robert Galland: Nods
Rose Springvale: sure, and to gouge arria
Cindy Ecksol: ?
Rose Springvale: done
Cindy Ecksol: thx
Cindy Ecksol: ok, as jamie mentioned no RA approval is needed.
Cindy Ecksol: so if no other questions will close this item and go on to finish the meeting with IV and V
Micael Khandr: We are past two hours, Madame Chairperson.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks
Robert Galland: Tes, thank you, I have to get going myself
Robert Galland: tes=yes
Cindy Ecksol: ok, concerns of ra members?
Cindy Ecksol: and may as well queue concerns of citizens and announcements as well
Cindy Ecksol: ……
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Rose Springvale: yes, i want to encourage everyone to go see the haunted schloss, courtesy of miss Lilith
Rose Springvale: and the catacombs of course
Cindy Ecksol: lol! got lost there once….
Rose Springvale: and to submit notecards if you want to be in the Fall decorating contest
Rose Springvale: and wathc for announcement of a party next week.. haveing some scheduling issues
Robert Galland: Thanks everyone
Jamie Palisades smiles. Informally, please be advised, I will bring proposed action items next time and request agenda time for (a) land prices, and (b) possible covenant changes.
Lilith Ivory smiles
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I get lost everywhere
Cindy Ecksol: thanks rose…
Cindy Ecksol: motion to adjourn?
Jamie Palisades: The latter relating only to harmoinizing some of our rules across a few sims
Wasp Thor: second
Micael Khandr: Sorry, I must leave. Good day to all. Thanks, Cindy.
Rose Springvale: thanks everyone!
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Wasp Thor: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: oui
Sonja Strom: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: one needs a oui oui
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Lilith Ivory: bye All
Cindy Ecksol: thanks all for your patience and courtesy! tough topics today, great discussion
Lilith Ivory: RL is calling my name hehe
Cindy Ecksol: meeting adjourned
Jamie Palisades: Hear hear.
Rose Springvale: smiles
Lilith Ivory: see you
The meeting closed at 11:14 Linden tim

Permalink.

RA Meeting 8 Nov 2009: Transcript
by Cindy Ecksol » Sun Nov 08, 2009 1:05 pm
Cindy Ecksol: everyone please touch the recorder to consent to recording. and please take agenda and other notecards from the urn under the table
Cindy Ecksol: ok, we have a quorum, let’s get started
Jimmie McMahn: Good Morning Chancellor
Lilith Ivory: Hi Jamie
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie, if it is worse, they’re definitely not aware
Lilith Ivory: lol
Cindy Ecksol: any changes to the agenda?
Wasp Thor: Hello, Micael
Arria Perreault: Hi Jamie
Micael Khandr: Hi Wasp
Cindy Ecksol presses her coffee while everyone says hi
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Cindy Ecksol: can I get a motino to approve the agenda?
Carolyn Saarinen: Move to approve
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds
Wasp Thor: I second
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Micael Khandr: Aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Wasp Thor: Aye
Soro Dagostino: Discussion?
Arria Perreault: aye
Cindy Ecksol: Soro, do you have something to discuss?
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Soro Dagostino: Point of order — any proposals to be in the Agenda should be posted to Legislative Discussions.
Soro Dagostino: In the Forums.
Cindy Ecksol: good point
Jamie Palisades smiles
Soro Dagostino: done
Cindy Ecksol: we have not done that so far in this term, but I see no reason why we should not.
Cindy Ecksol: I will note that all of the proposals being discussed today have been discussed in the forums for at least two weeks
Cindy Ecksol: albeit not in “Legislative Discussion”
Cindy Ecksol: Soro, do you wish to amend today’s agenda on that basis?
Soro Dagostino: It was a Point of Order.
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thank you.
Soro Dagostino: I have made my comment.
Cindy Ecksol: motion on th efloor to approve the agenda: any opposed?
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thank you.
Cindy Ecksol: Next meeting November 22, 0900
Cindy Ecksol: today pip, naftali, and robert have requested 7 day vote
Cindy Ecksol: micael may need to leave, so he has requested 7 day if he misses anything
Sonja Strom: I will not be able to attend the next meeting on the 22nd, and request a 7 day vote for it.
Cindy Ecksol: moving on….
Micael Khandr: Thank you
Cindy Ecksol: reports….Jamie?
Cindy Ecksol notes sonja’s request
Jamie Palisades: Good morning all – ready?
Sonja Strom: yes
Jamie Palisades: OK. Report text here: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2606
Cindy Ecksol reminds RA members to use the question queue
Jamie Palisades: Some of the items we will hit in the agenda later today, so I will save those for later.
Jamie Palisades: I will mention a few high points, then ask Rose for her additions, then see if we have questions.
Jamie Palisades: From that linked report: item 1, land price — later in this meeting.
Jamie Palisades: item 2, land sales – they are going on and mosat due to Rose’s hard work we’ve already managed to add some new citizens
Jamie Palisades: More on that in a moment.
Jamie Palisades: Please note, we are using the notice-and-random drawing method disvcussed a few weeks ago. So far, it seems to work fine.,
Jamie Palisades: items 3 and 4, please also note — after the RA solves our price debate today we’ll put the rest on sale at whatever price y’all tell us we can use.
Micael Khandr: Y’all–you in Texas?
Jamie Palisades: Needless to say, there may be some adjustment issues — but that will come up in your agenda item later today.
Carolyn Saarinen: hanging around with Rose!
Jamie Palisades: At times, MIcael but I try to minimize it.
Jamie Palisades: item 5 – regional commissions – please see the post linked form my report.
Jamie Palisades: *frmo
Sonja Strom: Hi Yogeswari!
Jamie Palisades: Oh well, no one cliamed I can type Several of you are, as you know, being put to work during November
Jamie Palisades: this also comes up in the agenda today.
Jamie Palisades: item 6 – Linden “partnership” — we have applied. Per our chat.,
Jamie Palisades: But I still thkn it;s primarily about land moving and adjacent estates.
Jamie Palisades: Like the Blake Sea – SLNE deal.
Jamie Palisades: so we still ought to think about whether THAT is strategically attractive to us.
Jamie Palisades: there are some HUGE issues there
Jamie Palisades: .. attaching to the mainland?
Jamie Palisades: .. attaching to Caledon?
Jamie Palisades: etc etc
Jamie Palisades: so – big issue – but not this week’s. People should start to mull it over, though.
Jamie Palisades: finally
Jamie Palisades: item 7, please note, i just have listed the things that I expoect to bring to the RA between now and the end of term.
Jamie Palisades: (a) do we add a sim?
Jamie Palisades: (b) Do we get rid of the silly citizen-groups law that Gwyn and I have been sneering at for years?
Jamie Palisades: (c) we have another election to survive .. real soon.
Jamie Palisades: and apropos of that
Jamie Palisades: let me just mention for those who do not read group messages
Jamie Palisades: Congratulations to the new dean of the CDS SC, Aliasi Stonebender, selected this week.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ooh wow
Gwyneth Llewelyn: congrats indeed
Carolyn Saarinen: lawks1
Yogeswari Padar applauds
Cindy Ecksol grouses as she notes spilled coffee
Jamie Palisades: I’d like to suggest that the RA adopt a resolution thanking Claude, the outgoing dean, for his longtime service – both in that capacity and also as LRA.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (hear hear)
Jamie Palisades: Thanks. Let me defer to os who has somne other – good – details about land activity, and whatever else she might like to mention.
Jamie Palisades: *Rose
Jamie Palisades: sorry
Jamie Palisades: Then we can ask for questions.
Rose Springvale: oh
Rose Springvale: hey
Rose Springvale: i wasn’t prepared, but glad to speak
Rose Springvale: first welcoem to Jmmie, our newest CDS citizen.. nice to see you here Jimmie!
Cindy Ecksol:
Jimmie McMahn: :] Glad to be here
Gwyneth Llewelyn: welcome
Rose Springvale: We’ve added also Lostie86 Sharpshire in AA… who wants to translate our tour into Arabic for us
Cindy Ecksol: nice!
Delia Lake: excellent
Rose Springvale: And as most of you know, amgadsef Anton, who brought his coptic church to the Sacromonte sim
Joaquin Gustav: welcome al
Carolyn Saarinen: nope missed that
Rose Springvale: Thanks to Marino Nuvolari for working with us to move his project to the Almunecar Airspace
Rose Springvale: lol
Sonja Strom: me too
Rose Springvale: Keilia Forager is also finally a citizen of her own right…
Rose Springvale: have i forgotten anyone?
Rose Springvale: lots of movement of citizens within the sims.. which is great to see
Lilith Ivory: Hubby is a real citizen now also
Jamie Palisades grins – right – Cam bought
Rose Springvale: CAm Holiday too!
Rose Springvale: oh yes!
Rose Springvale: sorry chat lag
Rose Springvale: and we hae a few more we’ll close shortly we’lltell you about next time
Jamie Palisades: (Lilith keeps saying she will make an honest man of him .. guess that means citizen )
Lilith Ivory: hehe
Rose Springvale: i think that’s all i have on this issue
Arria Perreault: May I a question?
Cindy Ecksol: yes…ifi rose is finished
Rose Springvale looks at Cindy… idk!
Arria Perreault: thank you! I am a bit lost with numbers now. Would it be possible to have an approximation about the total amount of citizen for example at the end of october
Jamie Palisades: OK, Arria, may we huddle on that in IM and answer a bit later in the meeting please?
Cindy Ecksol: np
Cindy Ecksol: all right….
Cindy Ecksol: IIb is stui’s commerce commission report, but he is having trouble with tp
Cindy Ecksol: so Jamie, if you wouldn’t mind doing the regional commissions status update?
Cindy Ecksol fights with chat lag….
Jamie Palisades: OK. No prob.
Carolyn Saarinen: gravitiational flux between crown and slippers
Sonja Strom: lol
Jamie Palisades: Hah – so GFBCAS replaces PEBKAC?
Jamie Palisades: Ok, for the regional programming —
Cindy Ecksol looks confused….
Jamie Palisades: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2550&p=13930#p13930
Gwyneth Llewelyn *is* confused
Jamie Palisades: We have three themed regions
Carolyn Saarinen: don’t worry Cindy
Jamie Palisades: as yo knoew from the budget, we have money
Jamie Palisades: we have nice people ( mostly in this room) who have agreed to moderate the open chats
Rose Springvale: (tp’s are down for everyone i guess)
Jamie Palisades: so now what we need is meetings
Jamie Palisades: as ytou can see from the post, i would like each of the regiosn to meet during the current calendar month
Cindy Ecksol: wow, seems so ORGANIZED!!! And people assigned to moderate and everything!
Jamie Palisades: those of you — arria, micael, sonja, pip, caro — who have kindly agreed to moderate will call and chair those open meetings, which have loose groundruels as posted, and Rose & I will try to attend each one
Jamie Palisades: *ground rules. Holy moley, the l a a a a g
StuiChicanne Darkstone shouts: HELLO
Jamie Palisades: Wherever Stui is, I bet his tail is twitching in slow motion
Rose Springvale: i think the sim needs to be restarted… been bad for a while
Carolyn Saarinen: everybody be quiet
StuiChicanne Darkstone shouts: I’m in SYRUP !
Callipygian Christensen shouts: he’s in syrup with me!
Jamie Palisades: a are we all, buddy — you just LIKE it more OK, ahem.
Carolyn Saarinen: sssh! they’ll hear us!
Jamie Palisades: Cindy, membe sof the RA, the bottom line on the regional commissions is:
Jamie Palisades: meetings this month with your help.
Jamie Palisades: and I need one more co-moderator for SOnja for the Alpine region
Jamie Palisades: done
StuiChicanne Darkstone: the ghost of Christmas yet to come floats in silently
Cindy Ecksol: hey, that’s pretty bottom-line
Cindy Ecksol: thanks jamie! any questions for jamie on commissions?
Jamie Palisades: (silently my sculpted prim fanny)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ha always wondered about that Jamie
Jamie Palisades: a base rumo, not at all tre — Jamie sits down FAST
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Carolyn Saarinen drops soap at Jamies feet
Cindy Ecksol: ok, stui, no wthat you’re here, without objection why don’t you give us your report on Commerce Commission?
[color=Orange] Caribou Coffee whispers: Mmmmm … a nice hot cup of coffee.
**** Here the sim crashed and we resumed the meeting in Al Andalus ****
Connected
Teleport completed from http://slurl.com/secondlife/Al%20Andalu … /62/225/33
Callipygian Christensen shouts: the sea has recalimed it! who forgot to appease the gods???
Callipygian Christensen: morning Cindy
Cindy Ecksol: morning Calli!
Callipygian Christensen: not enough sacrifices made this week methinks
Cindy Ecksol: we”re headed for the library to continue the RA meeting — CN appears to have vanished -)
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: must be true…
Callipygian Christensen: ah..ok..Ill head there..CN was in bad shape when I got there before
Rose Springvale: should be room for the RA at the table
Lilith Ivory: I hate it to get moved somewhere else
Rose Springvale: and i’ll put up benches for spectators
Belladonna Serrta: hello
Belladonna Serrta: is this ur place?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: DAMN SL
Rose Springvale: RA should fit at the table, the rest of us will use benches
Rose Springvale: i can rez as many as we need
Cindy Ecksol: thanks, rose….
Joaquin Gustav: ty rose
Joaquin Gustav: do we need the record machine?
Rose Springvale: need more chairs
Rose Springvale: ?
Wasp Thor: Yay Rose
Rose Springvale: we can take a transcript
Cindy Ecksol: Joa, we’ll just have to make do with chat transcript
Cindy Ecksol: I am recording, would appreciate it someone else would too.
Cindy Ecksol: just in case…
Rose Springvale: i always have a record cindy
Soro Dagostino: Got chat running.
Soro Dagostino: Out of CDS
StuiChicanne Darkstone: anyone want a poppy while you wait ?
Rose Springvale: smiles
Can’t rez object ‘Question Queue V 1.1’ at { 214.628, 162.073, 50.9887 } on parcel ‘El Tesoro Libreria de la Alhambra’ in region Al Garnata because the owner of this land does not allow it. Use the land tool to see land ownership.
Carolyn Saarinen: got mine thanks
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ha I’m just about sitting on Joaquin’s head
StuiChicanne Darkstone: good job I’m a cat
Question Queue V 1.1: *** Question Queue, a Jim Gustafson Product ***
Question Queue V 1.1: If people click on the object, the name will appear in your chat
Question Queue V 1.1: you can get to the next user with /100 next
Question Queue V 1.1: you can reset the queue with /100 reset
Question Queue V 1.1: say /100 rotation on/off to enable/disable rotation
Question Queue V 1.1: say /100 blink on/off to enable/disable blinking
Wasp Thor: I was just about to get the poppy when we crashed
Arria Perreault: the poppy?
Rose Springvale: we are in the process of reconstruction and redesign of this building, for the benefit of anyone who is annoyed (as i am) by the texture flicker lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn was wondering about the insane texture flickering…
Wasp Thor: Stui poppy
Rose Springvale: yes, well
Lilith Ivory: lol I just wanted to mention it
Carolyn Saarinen: Looks good anyway frankly
Rose Springvale: its not MY work
Gwyneth Llewelyn complains about the frozen anims too, as always
Lilith Ivory: I thought I would be going to crash again lol
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Cindy Ecksol: let’s see….
Cindy Ecksol: can we come to order again? I think we have a quorum
Cindy Ecksol: (amazingly!)
Guardian Angel v2.0: Guardian Angel v2.0 [script:Detector] Script run-time error
Guardian Angel v2.0: Stack-Heap Collision
Guardian Angel v2.0: Guardian Angel v2.0 [script:Display] Script run-time error
Guardian Angel v2.0: Stack-Heap Collision
Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles
Rose Springvale: hi Sylvia!
Soro Dagostino: What else would we do on a Sunday Morning in November
Cindy Ecksol: ok, stui — I think you were about to tell us about the commerce commission
Cindy Ecksol: you have the floor — take it!
Cindy Ecksol: stui, you there??
Carolyn Saarinen hits a disco beat for stui
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m up here
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m floating
Cindy Ecksol: how about a commerce commssion report??
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if the floor disappears
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m ready for it
Cindy Ecksol: we’re all waiting with bated breath….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ok
StuiChicanne Darkstone: apologies for the broken up report
Cindy Ecksol waves at justice
StuiChicanne Darkstone: strangle a Linden
Carolyn Saarinen: words to live by
Cindy Ecksol: c’mon stui, we’ve got a lot of stuff still to talk about….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: ok meeting yesterday – attendance good – lots of discussion – transcript on the forums… I ask that everyone be patient with us at the next meeting which is scheduled for 2 weeks time
StuiChicanne Darkstone: unless I am still in paris (could be the week after)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’ll keep you posted
Cindy Ecksol: done stui?
Cindy Ecksol: any questinos for stui?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: unless you want to hear about my hair
Cindy Ecksol: *questions
Rose Springvale: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2604
Rose Springvale: that’s the transcript
StuiChicanne Darkstone: thankyou Rosy
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I was looking for the link *LOL*
Rose Springvale:
Cindy Ecksol: ok….next up is CDS-owned land pricing — jamie’s proposal
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks for doing the *resume* of the conclusions at the very stop Very useful
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry, Cindy)
Cindy Ecksol: everyone have the notecard?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *top
Gwyneth Llewelyn confirms she has the notecard
Cindy Ecksol: jamie is still not back online — rose can you fill in for him?
Rose Springvale: i’ll set out a notecard giver .. he’s back now
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Gwyneth Llewelyn has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, just a simple clarification, perhaps it’s a quite obvious one.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *request for clarification, that is.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Under this suggested Land Pricing Act,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: parcels are set for sale *immediately* (for L$0) as soon as the CDS repossesses it, right?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s the spirit of the law, i.e. what is intended by it? Am I corrrect?
StuiChicanne Darkstone gave you Poppy Lapel Pin.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (that’s it)
Jamie Palisades smiles, waves.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (wb Jamie, just in time!)
Cindy Ecksol: I just caught jamie up in im — let’s give him a sec to catch his breath
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, of course!!
Jamie Palisades: CN just restarted
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oh yay
Jamie Palisades: it took a bit of doing
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thanks, jamie!
Jamie Palisades: let’s stay here though
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and seconds that suggestion
Jamie Palisades: OK< sorry, I herad you are discussing the zero price proposal, but wasn't sure if I am getting questions about it Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, woul dyou like to start by talking about it first? Cindy Ecksol: them we'll take questions? Jamie Palisades: sure but only briefly Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah yes, thatmight clarify my single question about it. Cindy Ecksol: kk Jamie Palisades: 1. CDS has LOLNG had a statutory price Jamie Palisades: *long Jamie Palisades: we sell 'em at the beginning for $X Lindens Jamie Palisades: and then after that Jamie Palisades: the owners sell at whatever price they like Jamie Palisades: but Jamie Palisades: if CDS gets it back Jamie Palisades: WE sell it at the original price Jamie Palisades: and the original prices are, to use a colloquailism, wack Sylvia Tinkel: Jamie Palisades: CN was radically overpriced for exmaple Jamie Palisades: because THEN (years ago) there was pent up demand due to a full-up NFS Jamie Palisades: then the only other sim we had Jamie Palisades: AND the landmarket in SL wasn;t buggered Jamie Palisades: (as it is now) Jamie Palisades: AND other things were different Jamie Palisades: so Jamie Palisades: NOW Carolyn Saarinen: Lemme hear ya say "tahnk you Lindes" Jamie Palisades: large estates all over SL are selling for L$0 Jamie Palisades: Caro Jamie Palisades: because they know that what really matters to their budget Jamie Palisades: is the monthly rent Jamie Palisades: what WE are seeing Jamie Palisades: is more vacancies than usual Carolyn Saarinen: or even "Thank you Lindens" - funnier when one is coherent hmm? Jamie Palisades: and it;s my suggestion that this is because we are comparatively overpriced Jamie Palisades: and I proposed last meetign to solve the problem by an experiment Jamie Palisades: which is to drop purchase price to zero, and collect only tier Jamie Palisades: on repossessed lots Carolyn Saarinen: And what matters to US is also the monthly rent... Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************ Question Queue V 1.1: Sylvia Tinkel has a question Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************ Jamie Palisades: which is, as it happens, exactly what our budget projects. Exactly, Caro. Jamie Palisades: Vacancies could kill us Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************ Question Queue V 1.1: Arria Perreault has a question Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************ Jamie Palisades: even though so far we are doing far better than most Jamie Palisades: (and on that note, go look at how much is for sale in, for example, Azure Islands) Carolyn Saarinen: Cos our sims are gorgeous Jamie Palisades: (not going to mention any of our own citizens' projects ) Jamie Palisades: (but I could) Jamie Palisades: or look at Caledon Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************ Question Queue V 1.1: Gwyneth Llewelyn has a question Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************ Jamie Palisades: Des hides the vacancies Jamie Palisades: but they're all over Jamie Palisades: OK. link to the actual "bill" proposal here: Jamie Palisades: and please note, for the RA's convenience - it is important to say that this plan is NOT the same as Arria's auction idea Gwyneth Llewelyn: (it's theopposite!) Jamie Palisades: in fact, if you pass hers, mine doesn't work., and vice versa Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* Cindy Ecksol notes that we'll get to Arria's proposal next.... Soro Dagostino: Move approval Jamie Palisades: right,m just mentoiong that so people see everything on the tabnle Jamie Palisades: link to legislation draft here --> viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2592&start=0#p13927
Arria Perreault: I have also understood that yours, Jamie, is provisory, until the end of the term
Jamie Palisades: done, thanks
Cindy Ecksol notes that soro is out of order…questions in the queue
Rose Springvale: lol
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn, you first…..
Cindy Ecksol: since we asked you to wait earlier
StuiChicanne Darkstone: !
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok… right… well, two things then. I had ANOTHER comment, which I will only make when my time in the quaue comes next,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: the first question was simple: will the repossessed land be announced for sale L$0 *immediately* after it is repossessed? The proposed bill doesn’t suggest/propose a timeline for doing so
Gwyneth Llewelyn: My request for clarification was just that — will it be listed for L$0 *as soon as it is repossessd*?
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I’ll leave the rest of my comments after my turn comes again in the queue, thanks )
Jamie Palisades: ok. I could answre that but it was Rose’s plan so maybe I will let her speak first if she likes
Rose Springvale: smiles
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Please
Rose Springvale: first
Rose Springvale: remember how we get ‘reposessed land
Rose Springvale: generally its either a) been for sale privately
Rose Springvale: or b) been vacant a while
Rose Springvale: if we offer all cds land in inventory at the beginning of the month, that should handle any pent up desire for the land.. and i’d ask for direction on the price of the land then
Rose Springvale: but the point is to keep it productive, not get windfalls
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* ‚Äî ok, so I’d suggest that gets just slightly amended to include “At the beginning of each month, Any parcel of land that is re-sold by CDS, after CDS repossesses it, will be sold for a purchase price of $0.” (or words to that effect)
Soro Dagostino: Point of Order
Rose Springvale:
Cindy Ecksol: soro?
Cindy Ecksol: we will need a motion for this at the appropriate time…..
Soro Dagostino: Madame chair — there is nothing before the body — you need a motion
Cindy Ecksol: thank you.
Jamie Palisades: so, I wrote a motion as posted. anyone want to move it?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We surely don’t need a motion to discuss something that IS on the agenda to be discussed?…
Jamie Palisades: I;m just yer humble nonvoting servant
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We *did* approve teh agenda, didn’t we?
Cindy Ecksol: no, need a motion to approve and then to amend -)
Soro Dagostino: TY
Cindy Ecksol: would someone like to move jamie’s proposal as stated on the card ?
Arria Perreault: we are on questions and clarification now
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Point of order (two can play this game too ). We’re at the discussiong stage!!!!
Jamie Palisades sits back – hey if no one makes a motion thi scan be a much shorter meeting. It;’s a sunny day outside where I am
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn, we can move and then discuss in more detail, ok?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And while discussin, we can certainly make suggestions =)
Soro Dagostino: No discussion is in order — without a motion
Cindy Ecksol bangs gavel
Cindy Ecksol: soro, would you like to move jamie’s proposal?
Soro Dagostino: I did
Cindy Ecksol: ok, do we have a second?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Come on guys. III b. CDS-owned land pricing (0955-1015) . What’s that? Isn’t it a point to discuss on the agenda? Or just pretty words on a notecard for us to watch and drool?
Sylvia Tinkel: ??
Cindy Ecksol: (please)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I second !
Rose Springvale: yay!
Carolyn Saarinen: I’ll second if it moves us on
Cindy Ecksol: thank you stui
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sylvia Tinkel
Jamie Palisades smiles, patiently points to the text of the now seconded-motion here – viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2592&start=0#p13927
Cindy Ecksol: I believe sylvia has th efloor — a question sylvia?
Carolyn Saarinen: but don’t now nr=eed motion to amend?
Sylvia Tinkel: my question was about the motion you just moved on
Jamie Palisades: should I answer Gwyn’s question, or did we eradicate it?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ^^
Sylvia Tinkel: but i am only a guest
Sylvia Tinkel: I just wanted to point out the flaw which i think concerns Gwyn
Sylvia Tinkel: that to have the land available at zero price invites a problem
Carolyn Saarinen: guests can speak Sylvia
Sylvia Tinkel: anyone can just walk up and get it
Jamie Palisades: (IN short, yes, Gwyn, that’s a perfectly fine clariifcation, and consistent with Rose’s one-a-month-up-or-out sales plan)
Jamie Palisades smiles and pokes queue
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Jamie Palisades has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Sylvia Tinkel: you probably need a bit of social engineering there to stop someone taking over all the land
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Patroklus Murakami has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Sylvia Tinkel: that’s it
Sylvia Tinkel: done
Cindy Ecksol: thanks sylvia
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Arria Perreault
Cindy Ecksol: Arria?
Carolyn Saarinen: I thought Pat was going to take over all the land
Arria Perreault: I have a comment and a technical question
Cindy Ecksol: go ahead arria
Arria Perreault: my comment: I am not in favour of a price of 0 L$ because it means that what we get has no value. Poeple who get it can abandon it very easely. I think also that CDS offers more than land, but also services and a great environment
Cindy Ecksol: finished arria?
Arria Perreault: Finally we have a team who manages this land. So it cannot not be free. It can be cheap.
Arria Perreault: not yet finished
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Jimmie McMahn has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Arria Perreault: My question: what is repossed land. In the former list, I have seen parcels of the new sim Monastery and newly redesign parcels from the former parcel of the Monastery
Arria Perreault: The sales of all these parcels were dedicated to the financing of Monastery sim
Jamie Palisades raises hand – it’s a question, Ccindy, may I answer it?
Arria Perreault: will be the remainings of the New sim out of the next list?
Arria Perreault: if your proposal is accepted
Arria Perreault: done
Cindy Ecksol: yes, jamie, please….
Arria Perreault: same for AM
Jamie Palisades: To Arria: I think any land that we sell for the FIRST time is outside this bill. So when we set the 3 empty parcels on the monastery for sale, there’s already a price for us to use. (this evening.) If it does not sell for a while, we’ll come back & suggest a price drop and see my answer to Sylvia. … To Sylvia: Good question. We talked about that two weeks ago when this first came up. I have in the draft that’s posted suggested that we collect two months rent up front to mnake vapid speculation a little harder.d
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Jamie Palisades: … Arria, the Monastery sim land right NOW is exactly like when we opened LA — a new one-time sale
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn, you had another question or comment?
Jamie Palisades: done
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Arria Perreault has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Cindy Ecksol: (sorry jamie)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: For the record, I dislike this excessive bureaucracy with your infinite approvals and amendments. I know that some among us love Robert’s Rules. Unfortunately for you guys, we work under http://portal.slcds.info/index.php?id=281 . Please note 2. B. […] “Each item on the agenda shall be allocated a time for debate by the LRA. If the LRA believes that a proposed piece of legislation shall not be controversial, it shall be allocated not less than 10 minutes for debate. If the LRA believes that a proposed piece of legislation may be controversial, it shall be allocated not less than 15 minutes for debate. ” So. With due respect. Let’s drop this nonsense of approving an agenda, having a point on the agenda, and interrupting the discussion with silly motions to approve to discuss something which is under discussion anyway, with apparently the purpose of “moving things on”. The LRA, under OUR rules (and NOT Robert’s Rules which do NOT apply to the RA!), can stop the discussion anyway if the time limit has pass
Sylvia Tinkel: I would still argue you will eventually need a way of “picking” people but that answer satisfies me
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ed. And THEN, *after* the discussion, we CAN move to approve a point under discussion, under the provisions of 2. C, which *clearly* defines how we should proceed *after* the discussion period. Please. We happen to have a rather good set of rules for all of this, please don’t continue to invent new rules on the spur of the moment Or, well, propose a change of those rules if you dislike them
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And now to the point in question…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: As a matter of principle,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: the CSDF always stood for private property, a free market,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and the notion that citizens should have a right to consider their property valuable.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (e.g. remember the eminent domain issues of the past)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Now I perfectly understand that “ideology” sometimes suffers when confronted with the “reality”, e.g., it’s hard to sell land in SL these days.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Going from “valuable” to “zero” seems, to me, too drastical
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Specially because someone might wish to remain in the CDS,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and the parcel just next door gets “abandoned”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and suddenly everybody knows it’ll cost just L$0
Gwyneth Llewelyn: All of a sudden,
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Wasp Thor has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Gwyneth Llewelyn: your own parcel is worth little
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Now, I’m not saying that we ought to be a community working just for the benefit of enriching citizens with prospective profitable land sales
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Soro Dagostino has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (again, that would be going the other extreme )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And also, I’m definitely aware that it’s FAR worse to have a plot EMPTY to yours, which is unsaleable,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: than just having the notion that land has, ultimately, “no value” in the CDS
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Rose Springvale has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Still, I would like to consider this in more detail. We’re effectively abolishing the “value” of land in the CDS with this bill,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and this changes things — quite a lot
Gwyneth Llewelyn: even with a sunset clause
Jamie Palisades leans back, raises eyebrow, looking for an action item in there somewhere
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Cindy Ecksol: thanks gwyn
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, did you have another comment?
Jamie Palisades: heh heh
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No action, Jamie. Just a request that this be given a little more thought. Are we really wanting to enter a phase of the CDS where land has zero value? The RA can certainly vote on that, if they think this new model benefits the overall citizens more.
Jamie Palisades: me? shy lil me?
Carolyn Saarinen: Nothing on which you have to pay tier is of “no value”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thats all.
Jamie Palisades chuckles,. Election season started? Does the distinguished Senator from the I-am-the-SC-all-by-myself faction still have those “return to democracy” signs handy? … SUBSTANTIVELY, I didn’t hear any *legislative* proposals under all that politics, Gwyn .. except maybe “this is not my idea so let’s not do it”. .. as for me, I raised my hand in queue to answer Sylvia, so nothing further, Cindy
Cindy Ecksol: thanks, jamie
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Patroklus Murakami
Jamie Palisades: and Caro, yes, that’s what we figured from an accounting point of view too. A future rental stream = book value.
Cindy Ecksol: Pat, you had a comment?
Patroklus Murakami: thx cindy
Soro Dagostino: ??
Soro Dagostino: Where am I?
Jamie Palisades: Al Andalus
Soro Dagostino: On the Q?
Sylvia Tinkel: isn’t land essentially free in nature anyway?
Cindy Ecksol: (next I think soro)
Patroklus Murakami: first of all, can i say how disappointed i am by the political response from our esteemed chancellor
Carolyn Saarinen: I’m coming over as a real partisan here and I’m sort of in the middle actually;/
Jamie Palisades: Soro, there’s text floating by the big blue “?”
Patroklus Murakami: which failed to answer any of the key points of the question put
Patroklus Murakami: it’s funny to be on the left and defending the value of property but, hey ho, this is SL!
Patroklus Murakami: i understand how this makes sense from the Government’s perspective, but what of the citizens? if the govnt sells land for nothing it devalues all our land. now, my holdings are pretty modest, just a small lot in NFS. But when i had more I was able to get back some of my investment when i came to sell it. now that will be impossible because the govnt will be giving it away. so, will the govnt compensate current land owners for their loss?
Jamie Palisades: (I looked for questions, in there, I swear, Pat = can you restate them so I can find’ em?)
Patroklus Murakami: there is a problem with going from ‘expensive’ to ‘free’ all of a sudden and an impact on current landowners
Carolyn Saarinen: CDS policy doesn’t dictate land value, the market under LL policy does that.
Patroklus Murakami: so my questions are: have you thought about that? what is your response? will there be compensation. thank you
Cindy Ecksol: jamie? aersponse?
Cindy Ecksol: anyone home?
Rose Springvale: lol
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jimmie McMahn
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Cindy Ecksol: Yikes, I was reading the queue upside down…..
Carolyn Saarinen:
Rose Springvale: maybe take all the questions and then get a response
Cindy Ecksol: Jimmie….did you have a question?
Jimmie McMahn: For times sake I will keep my comment short..
Cindy Ecksol: (then arria, wasp, soro, rose
Jimmie McMahn: I understand why Jamie wants to set land price at 0L..but I fear that will open the door to an abundance of problems
Jimmie McMahn: I would reccomend lowering purchase prices..but I fear 0L would be to drastic
Cindy Ecksol: (please say “thank you” or “done” when ou are finished)
Jimmie McMahn: thank you
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Arria Perreault
Cindy Ecksol: arria?
Patroklus Murakami apologises for spamming the chat channel!
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Wasp Thor
Carolyn Saarinen throws a paper plane at Arrria
Cindy Ecksol: ok, running short on time….
Cindy Ecksol: wasp, you had a comment?
Wasp Thor: With all due respect to our feelings…..Linden Labs is printing millions on the money exchange to stay in business…the reality is that they can not sell land..How can we?…..Thank you
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (Arria is typing, please be patient)
Arria Perreault: first Jamie did not answer totally my question. The three remaining parcels were quickly blocked to the sale in JUly. I have paid the fees until october without the chance to see them sold. And a remark: we will become renters with this policy of 0 L$ price. Poeple will stay less time by us. It will be complicate to manage
Cindy Ecksol: ok, waiting for arria….
Carolyn Saarinen: sorry ;(
Arria Perreault: especially with our political agenda. We need long-term citizen.
Arria Perreault: done
Cindy Ecksol: than you.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Soro Dagostino
Cindy Ecksol: soro?
Cindy Ecksol: (worry to make you wait so long)
Soro Dagostino: Yield to Rose
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Rose Springvale: thanks
Rose Springvale: bear with me while i cut and paste
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Sylvia Tinkel has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Rose Springvale: i’ve said it many times… i’ll repeat it. The true value in CDS is in the community and while our land is beautiful, so are many other sims. In this proposal, we have not said that CDS land has 0 value, but we can all agree that some land is always going to be more desirable that other parcels.
Rose Springvale: There is no change to private sales. (If citizens fear that their neighbors land will end up in the 0L slush pile, they should work to find buyers and maintain the value.) We are talking about land that is in inventory, and has been in inventory, and that we’ve “shown” many many times. About 15 parcels. Without exception, we get told… espcially in Colonia nova… wow.. that is just too high.
Rose Springvale: And comparing even to our own sims, it is!
COST of sims in SL 1.55/m 6.67/p
Tier: .0197 .00454
CDS
Cost 6.96/m-17.68/m 38.49/p-77.78/p
tier .77/m–3.13/m 17.7/p-13.8/p
AA cost 9.67/m(original #’s, not used since) 42.31/p tier
Rose Springvale: take a moment to look at the numbers… and remember.. we have already been paid back for all land
Rose Springvale: done
Cindy Ecksol: thanks
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sylvia Tinkel
Rose Springvale: 2.33/m
10.18/p(AA tier numbers)
Soro Dagostino: Yield to Sylvia
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Sonja Strom has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Cindy Ecksol: sylvia? then sonja and then I’m going to ask for a motion to approve
Patroklus Murakami: what is /m and /p? per metre squared mainland and private?
Sylvia Tinkel: I just have a counter-point to Aria’s thing about the value being zero, becoming renters, and the political agenda
Rose Springvale: per meter and per prim
Sylvia Tinkel: (devil’s advocate)
Patroklus Murakami: ty rose
Rose Springvale: no. all in our sims
Sylvia Tinkel: the land being zero can be advertised as a *good* thing
Sylvia Tinkel: land is free in the CDS sort of thing
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Gwyneth Llewelyn has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Sylvia Tinkel: and I think it makes assumptions about commitment based on ownership that aren’t necessarily true
Sylvia Tinkel: lastly i think Pat is right about compensation for current owners
Sylvia Tinkel: done
Sylvia Tinkel: * the need for compensation
Cindy Ecksol: thanks
Sylvia Tinkel: done
Cindy Ecksol: sonja?
Sylvia Tinkel:
Sonja Strom: Several people have expressed to me that they don’t know exactly what land is for sale in the CDS,
Sonja Strom: and are not sure how to find out without asking other people.
Sonja Strom: Is all the land that is for sale showing up in one public place? Like for example as yellow areas on the SL map?
Sonja Strom: Thanks
Soro Dagostino: Call the Question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Arria Perreault has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Cindy Ecksol: one moment, soro…
Cindy Ecksol: jamie or rose, can you answer Sonja please?
Rose Springvale: yields to jamie
Rose Springvale: hmmm
Rose Springvale: well
Rose Springvale: okay
You decline Guthries Folk Club, Kissena Park (29, 189, 21) from A group member named Dottie Iceberg.
Rose Springvale: the previous RA approved a land sales act that would allow us to turn off the yellow map sales
Rose Springvale: we have spent many hours getting that put together.
Rose Springvale: in the meantime
Rose Springvale: all inquiries for land have been forwarded to the exec staff
Rose Springvale: and we have handled them
Rose Springvale: now
Rose Springvale: sonja, if you have not been forwarding inquiries, i can’t fix that
Rose Springvale: but
Rose Springvale: as you all recall
Rose Springvale: the summer brought our land process to a halt
Rose Springvale: because of conflict which accused us of favoritism
Rose Springvale: so we came up with this plan. No, all cds land is not set for yellow map sale
Rose Springvale: we were under the impression that the RA did not want to have our sims look like a “fire sale”
Rose Springvale: and that is why they appoved the change
Rose Springvale: but
Rose Springvale: as you can see
Rose Springvale: we have many new citizens in the term…
Rose Springvale: so hopefully we are meeting theire needs. And
Rose Springvale: there is always some land “yellow mapped”
Rose Springvale: also, we want to make sure that buyesr understand
Rose Springvale: that cds isn’t .. just prettier mainland
Rose Springvale: so we want to have a personal contact
Rose Springvale: done
Sonja Strom: I don’t want anybody to be left with the impression I have not forwarded inquiries. I have always done whatever I could to help anybody who asked me for help.
Sonja Strom: done
Cindy Ecksol: thanks, rose, sonja
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Cindy Ecksol: we have a motion on the floor — jamie’s original proposal.
Cindy Ecksol: and we are out of time.
Jamie Palisades listens, nods
Cindy Ecksol: and I think that there are many who are still not comfortable with voting “for” OR “against” the proposal.
Gwyneth Llewelyn moves to extend the meeting OR postpone
Rose Springvale: sighhh
Cindy Ecksol: what I’d like to suggest is that we table this discussion and resume nxt meeting
Jamie Palisades kof kofs Jamie Palisades:
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds that, if everybody is unwilling to continue discussing it now
StuiChicanne Darkstone: can’t we for once try something new ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Suggest it, Stui
Cindy Ecksol: well, I need SOME kind of a motion…and second
StuiChicanne Darkstone: are we incapable of taking risks ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: at this time
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it is the best time to try something new
Arria Perreault: we need time to think ….
Cindy Ecksol: either to approve the motion on the floor or to postpone or to extend todays’ meeting
Jamie Palisades: Stui: the executive? No. The RA – well, you tell me
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, let’s move to postpone
StuiChicanne Darkstone: when the economic slump is stagnating the SL economy
Rose Springvale: wasn’t the question called?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *let *ME
Soro Dagostino: Yes
Cindy Ecksol is totally confused….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we would be fools not to try something new and different
Arria Perreault: I second Gwyn’s proposition to postpone
Jamie Palisades: yah, can you guys vote on the postponement?
Cindy Ecksol bangs gavel……
Cindy Ecksol: thank you arria.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We have a motion and a second to postpone
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor to postpone?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Arria Perreault: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: nay
Soro Dagostino: If your asking for the nays?
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Cindy Ecksol: all opposed?
Soro Dagostino: Nay
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I don’t wish to postpone
Jamie Palisades: /so you got 4 to 2 and whoever didn’t vote
Cindy Ecksol: four in favor, two opposed, motion carries
Jamie Palisades: wasp, cindy don;t vote?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Wasp is typing
Jamie Palisades grins, shrugs, raises hand for when this is over
Wasp Thor: Aye if it helps
Cindy Ecksol: sorry…I vote Aye
Carolyn Saarinen: I’d like a decision too Stui but we ain’t gonna get one today
Rose Springvale: sigh
Cindy Ecksol: that makes 5.
Rose Springvale: okay. well.
Cindy Ecksol: two opposed….wasp?
Wasp Thor: I voted Aye a moment ago
Rose Springvale: to postponing?
Cindy Ecksol: thanks!
Cindy Ecksol: ok…..
Cindy Ecksol: meeting SUSPENDED….we will continue with same agenda next time.

Permalink.

RA Meeting 6 December 2009: Transcript
by Cindy Ecksol » Mon Dec 07, 2009 6:00 am
Micael Khandr: Hi Arria
Arria Perreault: Hi Justice
Cindy Ecksol: hi arria, justice
Justice Soothsayer: Hi all
Micael Khandr: Hi Justice
Cindy Ecksol: and gwyn too
Micael Khandr: Hi Gwyn
Arria Perreault: Hi Pat
Patroklus Murakami: howdy all
Arria Perreault: Hi Gwyn
Micael Khandr: Hi Pat
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hello all!
Cindy Ecksol: please touch the recorder to consent to recording. and the urn under the table contains agenda, etc.
Arria Perreault has indicated consent to be recorded.
Justice Soothsayer has indicated consent to be recorded.
Patroklus Murakami has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: “amphora”
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Lilith Ivory: Hi there
Cindy Ecksol: hey, lil!
Micael Khandr: Hi Lillith
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi ))
Pip Torok: back
Gwyneth Llewelyn: wb :9
Pip Torok: hi Gwyn, arria
Lilith Ivory: anybody want me to rez my “grid crash protection box”?
Jamie Palisades: haha
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Jamie Palisades: hullo all
Cindy Ecksol: is it guaranteed?
Soro Dagostino: Hello all.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ^^
Lilith Ivory: hm think it might be a Linden item, so….
Jamie Palisades: actually, when used as instructed, yes
Gwyneth Llewelyn wonderd how THAT works…
Cindy Ecksol: maybe we can get Gwyn to get it certified by the lindens….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol !
Arria Perreault: Hi Lilith
Lilith Ivory: Hi Arria
Lilith Ivory: Hi Jamie
Pip Torok: hi lilith, jamie, soro pat
Arria Perreault: Hi Jamie
Soro Dagostino has indicated consent to be recorded.
Lilith Ivory: cute hat Jamie
Jamie Palisades grins, waves
Jamie Palisades: well, not exactly a hat
Lilith Ivory: hehe
Cindy Ecksol: ok, recorder is on, so please touch to indicate consent to record
Arria Perreault: Hi Soro
Carolyn Saarinen has indicated consent to be recorded.
Patroklus Murakami: more of a ‘fascinator’
Lilith Ivory: do you know what wearing antlers means in Germany?
Cindy Ecksol: and agenda, etc. is in the amphora as usual
Cindy Ecksol wait to hear the answer to this one….
Pip Torok: no Lilith, tell us
Gwyneth Llewelyn *scratches head*
Lilith Ivory: it means you should watch careful what your wife is doing when you are not at home
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Lilith Ivory: she might be untrue
Cindy Ecksol: whoo hoo!!!!!
Lilith Ivory: hehe
Pip Torok: oh …
Cindy Ecksol: same here, actually — idomatic
Jamie Palisades smiles. “Wearing horns”, yes
Soro Dagostino: Hello Pip
Lilith Ivory: ah I see
Patroklus Murakami: o.k.
Jamie Palisades: but those do not have holiday lights
Carolyn Saarinen: Cuckold
Cindy Ecksol whistles the fiddle tune “Who’s been here since I’ve been gone?”
Lilith Ivory: lol no
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (in Portugal, we don’t have many antler-bearing animals, so we use horns too )
Jamie Palisades: .. well unles your spouse is sleeping with Santa
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Lilith Ivory: hehehe
Cindy Ecksol whistles “I saw Mommy kissing Santa Claus”
Lilith Ivory giggles
Pip Torok: must be sons/daughters of Santa around!
Arria Perreault: Hi Stui
Micael Khandr: Hi Stui
Pip Torok: hi Stui!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Evening All !
Cindy Ecksol: hey, stui!
StuiChicanne Darkstone has indicated consent to be recorded.
Lilith Ivory: hi Stui
Jamie Palisades: Isn’t that a club, pip?
Cindy Ecksol: find an interesting perch and indicate consent, please
Jamie Palisades: no wait
Pip Torok: hi Calli, Keila
Jamie Palisades: that’s the Illegitimate Daughters of ELVIS, never mind
Jamie Palisades: dd 16
Keila Forager: Hi Pip
Jamie Palisades: dd 0
Jamie Palisades: dd 24
Jamie Palisades: dd 16
Jamie Palisades: dd 32
Jamie Palisades: dd 64
Cindy Ecksol: ?
Jamie Palisades: dd 96
Jamie Palisades: dd 128
Jamie Palisades: dd 200
Jamie Palisades: dd 256
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie loves to spam us
Jamie Palisades: dd 300
Cindy Ecksol: yikes, jamie is counting!!!
Jamie Palisades: sorry
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ?
Micael Khandr: I didn’t know we had that many dds
Jamie Palisades: bad script setting
Callipygian Christensen: hi Pip, everyone
Cindy Ecksol: ok, I think we have a quorum, let’s get started.
Arria Perreault: Hi Keila
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I don’t even know what a dd is
Keila Forager: Hi Arria
Arria Perreault: Hi Callipygian
StuiChicanne Darkstone: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maNKmEjCFyU
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sorry, Ms LRA ? I’ll hush now if we’re in session
Cindy Ecksol: everyone have the agenda? any changes?
Pip Torok: not me …
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well I have a Christmas song for the agenda
StuiChicanne Darkstone: to set the mood
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: any opposed to Stui starting us off with a song?
Micael Khandr: Does it matter?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: definitely not
StuiChicanne Darkstone: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maNKmEjCFyU
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I mean, I’m definitely not opposed…
Cindy Ecksol: aw, I thought YOU were going to sing, stui!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi Santa! (I mean Justice!)
Justice Soothsayer: Ho.
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: my voice wouldn’t be very jolly
Cindy Ecksol: all right, can I get a motion to approve the agenda?
Gwyneth Llewelyn moves to approve the agenda.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I found Cindy a Song too
Carolyn Saarinen: seconded
Cindy Ecksol: thanks.
Pip Torok: copy of agenda someone?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: to play on her autoharp
StuiChicanne Darkstone: in the urn
Cindy Ecksol: in the amphora pip…
Pip Torok: tks
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: with the ashes of Scrooge
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m in favour
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Pip Torok: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye
Arria Perreault: aye
Micael Khandr: aye
Cindy Ecksol: ok, great.
Cindy Ecksol: next meeting: 20 december
Cindy Ecksol: question is what time we should plan
Cindy Ecksol: we changed this meeting because ther eare some who can never make the 9am time
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well I might be en route to my stable by then
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Let’s her suggestions! I’m very likely able to be around from 6 AM SLT upwards
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *hear
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am sure I’m working next sunday
Cindy Ecksol: no, that’s two sundays from now stui
Pip Torok: noon SLT suits me fine
StuiChicanne Darkstone: removing the dust attractions
Soro Dagostino: Not a good time for me.
Cindy Ecksol: I am available either at 9 or noon
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I know I’m working some sunday to take down garlands and sequins and baubles
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye, me too.
Micael Khandr: Me too–9 or noon
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and to hide Christmas trees
Lilith Ivory giggles
Cindy Ecksol: that would be maybe after christmas, stui?
Cindy Ecksol: unless you’re planning to be scrooge?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: no
StuiChicanne Darkstone: before
StuiChicanne Darkstone: once they have made their money
Micael Khandr: anal-compulsive?
Arria Perreault: 9 PM is ok
StuiChicanne Darkstone: they want the trees and the rest to go away
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Cindy Ecksol: no, arria…9am…not pm
Cindy Ecksol: 9am or 12pm
Cindy Ecksol: or something in between
Soro Dagostino: 9am is my preference.
Micael Khandr: 10:30?
Arria Perreault: 9 am or 12pm are both ok for me
Cindy Ecksol: soro, does that work for you?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m ok with 10:30 AM SLT too.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and apparently the kids nativity costume market in England is now worth up to £150 per costume *LOL*
Soro Dagostino: (am please
Pip Torok: either works for me
Soro Dagostino: 9*
Micael Khandr: Go for 9
Jamie Palisades: (for a bedsheet and sandals, Stui? I am in the wrong business then)
Cindy Ecksol: ok, sounds like 9am.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’ll try to be at the meeting
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but I may be at ye olde hole of poop
Micael Khandr: poop?
Cindy Ecksol: I believe Rob has problems with that time which is why he hasn’t been here much, but seems like the rest of us are ok with that.
Cindy Ecksol: so next meeting 20 Dec at 9am
Soro Dagostino: Yay!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok
Lilith Ivory: Hi Rose
Cindy Ecksol: 7 day votes today: naftali and sonja
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it’s not polite to say the hit and miss at RA
Pip Torok: hi Rose
Rose Springvale: hi all
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Rosy !
Keila Forager: Hi Rose
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Don’t forget to tap my seat
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Pip Torok: 7-day vote Naftali
Cindy Ecksol: moving on….jamie, you have a report for us?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: agendas are in the urn with scrooge
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and the Christmas Spirit
notetaker 2.0.1: Jamie Palisades has not indicated consent yet.
notetaker 2.0.1: Lilith Ivory has not indicated consent yet.
notetaker 2.0.1: Micael Khandr has not indicated consent yet.
notetaker 2.0.1: Pip Torok has not indicated consent yet.
notetaker 2.0.1: Keila Forager has not indicated consent yet.
Jamie Palisades: I do, smile
notetaker 2.0.1: Tor Karlsvalt has not indicated consent yet.
Cindy Ecksol: (and please touch the recorder if you have not yet)
notetaker 2.0.1: Callipygian Christensen has not indicated consent yet.
notetaker 2.0.1: Check completed.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: (my seat)
notetaker 2.0.1: notetaker 2.0.1 [script:notetaker 2.0.1] Script run-time error
notetaker 2.0.1: Stack-Heap Collision
Jamie Palisades: ok
Jamie Palisades: right, chancellor’s report
Jamie Palisades: 1. Fun events today – please stick arouind after RA, for the DJ on the Neuifreistadt Platz and the kickoff of ski season. See “Eose’s group announcement, and generally, the DS Calendar (see kiosks) and Events Forum board here: viewforum.php?f=5 More planned for the winter holidays.
Jamie Palisades: 2. It’s snowing Please fix your trees. There is a more complex weather plan for Al Andalus sims. I will ask Rose to talk about that in a moment.
Jamie Palisades: 3. I had this idea about a constitutional amendment We’ll possibly talk about that later today.
Jamie Palisades chuckles
Jamie Palisades: 4. We should have an update on implementations, or feasibility, on the various recommendation sof the regional cultural commissions, within the next week. Also on the “Events” board.
Jamie Palisades: 5. The four chief open commercial parcels of land in Colonia Nova have been listed for bid, per our laws. See viewtopic.php?f=20&t=2634 I will keep you posted on the outcomes.
Jamie Palisades: .. There’s a two week period for bidders to make themselves known for the 6-months-of-half-price-rent deal.
Jamie Palisades: 6. Also on land, most other open parcels in CDS owned by the government are open for claiming at L$0, but at full-price rent, as posted and group-notified by Rose. As the cooks say, come ‘n get it.
Jamie Palisades: …
Jamie Palisades: I have a few other “consultation” items
Jamie Palisades: which are in the forum of open questions to the group
Jamie Palisades: but that’s it for declaratie stuff. so lety me let ose add anything she has — including but maybe not only on the AA weather concept
Rose Springvale: Thanks Jamie
Jamie Palisades: *rose, sorry typo as always
Rose Springvale: I’m sorry that things are not farther along than they are for the holidays…
Rose Springvale: Al Andalus has not had snow yet, as there was some disagreement on whether it SHOULD snow
Rose Springvale: we’ve done some research and determined that in RL granada, indeed there is snow, albeit brief
Micael Khandr: I moved there for the warmth . . .
Rose Springvale: so we will try to follow the rl model and have a shortened period of winter weather, closer to the christmans/new year holidays
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Marino said today
Rose Springvale: he’s in barcelona though
Micael Khandr: [Does Palm Springs exist in SL?] Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Question Queue V 1.1: Arria Perreault has a question
Question Queue V 1.1: ************************************************
Rose Springvale: If the roman sims cultural commission meets, it would be nice to have some help bringing them into the spirit…
Rose Springvale: specifically we’ve turned in a saturnalia event to Winter fair, would love help making it happen
Rose Springvale: other than that, i think its in the notices?
Arria Perreault: I have got already some inputs. We try to meet soon.
Jamie Palisades: i think so
Rose Springvale: remember you need to notice it out 1 week Arria
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Arria Perreault
Jamie Palisades: Arria (and Pip), if we can help, let us know please.
Pip Torok: thanks Jamie
Arria Perreault: yes
Jamie Palisades: (and I will have a few more short items after Qs)
Cindy Ecksol: questions for jamie?
Arria Perreault: I have
Cindy Ecksol: arria, you have the floor
Arria Perreault: about land sale action
Arria Perreault: first, I have noticed that the last available parcel of the Monastery sim is in the list. This is new land. Should it be out of the list?
Rose Springvale: arria
Rose Springvale: it is listed as such, no discount
Jamie Palisades: hmmmm – i think it;s for sale at the old price, not the zero price, no?
Rose Springvale: if you read the text
Jamie Palisades: which is as we all disvcused a few meetings ago
Arria Perreault: Second, will this action have an interference with the citizen census of the 12 december?
Jamie Palisades: still, a good thing for advertising to mention it.
Jamie Palisades: Sorry, on that second one? How so?
Arria Perreault: yes, new land should be sold at normal price
Jamie Palisades: ok, we agree on #1 then. On #2 ..
Jamie Palisades: are you asking how new landowners will be counted as voters?
Arria Perreault: Nobody can get one of this land before the 12 december?
Jamie Palisades: :/ well
Rose Springvale: what is december 12?
Jamie Palisades: let’s see is that the 28-days-before-the election datye?
Arria Perreault: the date of the census
Jamie Palisades: (the day by which one must be a citizen to vote)
Jamie Palisades: Arria, assuming that it is (which sounds right but I have not checked the calendar) …
Jamie Palisades: (and that’s for the SC to tell us)
Jamie Palisades: .. then not really. For 3 reasons
Arria Perreault: it has influence on the number of the seats at the RA and the eligible factions, if the Constitution is not modified until that date
Jamie Palisades: (a) COMMERC IAL land is only available after the 19th
Jamie Palisades: (b) any PRIVATE sales can hapen at any time, and our PUBLIC sales are constaineed by our rules, which require some notice period
Jamie Palisades: and most importantly
Jamie Palisades: (c) Our rule on voting allows a thousanbd rediculous loopholes for group membership
Jamie Palisades: so anyone who tried to sneka in woudl easier do so, land or no land
Jamie Palisades: done Rose, did I miss anything?
Jamie Palisades: *sneak
Rose Springvale: i don’t think so
Arria Perreault: (c) Our rule on voting allows a thousanbd rediculous loopholes for group membership: can you explane better?
Jamie Palisades smiles
Jamie Palisades: The law lets people become CDS citizens by joining a group when the group owns CDS land
Jamie Palisades: I think that is a bad law
Jamie Palisades: too easy to abuse
Jamie Palisades: but it is out law, and like most of them, predates me ask an oldtimer
Arria Perreault: I though it was not paossible
Arria Perreault: possible*
Jamie Palisades: anyone else? CIndy, I may not be up to the task of justifying an ancient and absurd rule
Arria Perreault: does it means that all members of the coptic church are citizen and not only the landowner?
Jamie Palisades smiles. Ask the SC
Arria Perreault: (just ann example)
Jamie Palisades: But i *thikn* they woudl need to CLAIM to be, and tell us, at a minimum, and be in the same group
Jamie Palisades smiles
Jamie Palisades: Maybe I should mention our friend Kamiliah?
Rose Springvale: maybe
Rose Springvale:
Patroklus Murakami: i could explain some of the motivation for that law and it’s implications if you like. (i hate it myself btw)
Jamie Palisades: Let me wait for Pat
Jamie Palisades: Suffice to say
Cindy Ecksol: go ahead pat
Jamie Palisades: Caledon’s thousand-member group also has a member who owns CDS land
Rose Springvale: in the group name
Patroklus Murakami: well, it was well meaning the idea was to provide a way for couples and groups to own land and still have citizenship
Patroklus Murakami: some thought it was unfair that couples had to each own land separately to be citizens
Jamie Palisades: I suppose I should make a disclosure
Cindy Ecksol smiles when thinking how Des wold love to know that he’s just conquered CDS once and for all
Jamie Palisades: I’ll wait my turn though
StuiChicanne Darkstone: then it could in theory be limited to couples
StuiChicanne Darkstone: surely
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Patroklus Murakami: so the law says you can be a citizen by owning land as a member of a group *but only if you owned land as an individual first*
Arria Perreault: about what is based the census?
Micael Khandr: Don’t call me shirley . . .
Patroklus Murakami: so the members of a group don’t all get a vote
Patroklus Murakami: they need to have been individual land owners first
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but Micael it suits you
Cindy Ecksol: finished pat?
Cindy Ecksol: thx
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn? I think you’re next
Jamie Palisades waits for queue
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, Pat pretty much clarified the important point: people have to be citizens first, *then* join a group which owns land, and *afterwards* sell the land that allowed them to become citizens in the first place.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, no, sorry, but Caledon doesn’t own us yet
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Rose Springvale: they bought from the beginning
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Gwyneth Llewelyn is not quite finoshed
Cindy Ecksol: whoops, sorry!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok… so perhaps iot is NOT clear, Rose
Gwyneth Llewelyn: All 1000 citizens of Caledon,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: would have to buy an individual plot *each*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, we don’t have so many plots
Gwyneth Llewelyn: so they would have to queue
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and since it takes 28 days before you’re a voting citizen,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: you can do some maths to see how long it would take for them all to keep citizen status, even after leaving the original land they’d boughht
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I agree there is a loophole there
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and that the law is a bit naive
Jamie Palisades smiles –
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But it’s not THAT bad as you make it
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s all… thanks.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks gwyn
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Jamie Palisades: My little disclosure
Jamie Palisades: It’s relevant now, was not earlier
Jamie Palisades: when AA and CDS merged
Jamie Palisades: I did in fact in my official capacity
Jamie Palisades: get asked
Jamie Palisades: well, requested really
Jamie Palisades: that all 1321 residents of caledon
Jamie Palisades: that is, the grouop membership
Jamie Palisades: be added to our rolls
Jamie Palisades: by a then resident
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol
Jamie Palisades: i, ah, declined.
Patroklus Murakami: LOL!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Arria Perreault:
Jamie Palisades smiles. That’s it, for that item. I have a few more shorter ones.
Cindy Ecksol: rose, are you on this item still?
Rose Springvale: yes
Cindy Ecksol: ok, jamie….let’s get rose first then you can finish
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Rose Springvale: just to point out that 1) there is a sq m requirement of 128 m per voting citizen
Rose Springvale: and 2
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Rose Springvale: that the law has been used by selling citizens who are no longer in volved in CDS to stay “in” the voting roles.
Rose Springvale: it operates to inflate CDS as much as anyplace else
Rose Springvale: and finally, as the party today was scheduled before this meeting, i’m sorry but i’m going to have to go
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Rose Springvale: so if you need anything more from me…
Jamie Palisades: Rose refers to our 1 pm Plats snow party
Jamie Palisades: and thanks vm, Rose
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you Rose
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks rose.
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Arria Perreault: is there any role of this citizen who don’t have land anymore?
Jamie Palisades: back to the consultation items then
Jamie Palisades: Four items I wish to pose to you that really are aesthetic in character. Let me ask you, and the community, now, and we’ll see what kind of opinions roll in, There probably are no “right” answers in matters of decoration & taste.
Jamie Palisades: On all of them, NOT asking for an answer this minute, but could people think it over?
Pip Torok: back
Arria Perreault: Our aim is to get new citizen. It means that we have to make a difference between sales to citizen and to non-citizen.
Arria Perreault: Potential citizen can buy at any time. Citizen have special moments. In my proposal, it is every 6 months. This can be discussed.
Arria Perreault: In order to get new citizen, we have to improve advertising and marketing. In SL, but also outside SL.
Arria Perreault: Internet is also an important place to advertise
Arria Perreault: SL itself has some tools too for advertising and sales
Arria Perreault: As method, I have proposed auction. I don’t think that we will win a lot of money. But it is easy and transparent.
Arria Perreault: In my proposal, it is possible to take in account development projects.
Arria Perreault: I think that it is important to have some thoughts about urbanism in our land management.
Arria Perreault: This can evolve. See what happened in Colonia Nova, where we have redesigned the parcels.
Arria Perreault: I am done with my introduction.
Arria Perreault: (the text is in the amphore)
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Cindy Ecksol: whoops….befor jamie….
Jamie Palisades: right
Cindy Ecksol: I believe we need a second to Arria’s motion to discuss
Jamie Palisades: I think i’d said this a few meetings ago, so will try to summarize very tightly. It’s unforuntate that this proposal came to the RA tabnle right after another inconsistent one (te :L$0 plan), but it did, and you passed that one. As a several-month exdperiment.
Cindy Ecksol: (sorry jamie)
Jamie Palisades: oop, OK. on hold
Cindy Ecksol: do I hear a second for Arria’s proposal?
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds it.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks gwyn.
Cindy Ecksol: ok, jamie, you have the floor
Jamie Palisades: Anyway,I’d suggest you let experiment #1 run before trying experiment #2. and:
Jamie Palisades: on its merits:
Jamie Palisades: We also spoke briefly in November about the feasibility and policy problems with auctions that I see — and here i must respectfully disagree with Arria —
Jamie Palisades: those of us who do the work believe that they are more effort to run;
Jamie Palisades: and they make maximixing the cost of land our goal — which does not sound like CDS to me. Done, thanks.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Pip Torok
Cindy Ecksol: pip?
Pip Torok: how crucial is the question of auction/non-auction to your proposal, Arria?
Arria Perreault: it is not totally crucial. I consider that we have to think about the method
Pip Torok: thank you Arria
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: StuiChicanne Darkstone
Cindy Ecksol: stui?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Auctions are good for the rich but limit opportunity for new poorer prospective citizens, I voted in favour of the $0L sale as I feel it promotes growth and opportunity to become landed, I don’t see how the auction would support these principles
Arria Perreault: well … auction can bring high prices only when the competition is big
Arria Perreault: it is not our case currently
Arria Perreault: LL uses auction
Cindy Ecksol: anyone else? comments? questions?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (it would actually be very fortunate if two plots, which fail to sell for “next to nothing”, would suddenly come up in an auction that would have tons of eager bidders ) If I understand the situation right now, this is hardly going to happen all the time)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: then what benefit can there be in it ? if it doesn’t deliver a high price then it seems rather redundant to have an auction that delivers little revenue
Arria Perreault: in rl too, states sell abandonned land wit the auction method
Pip Torok agrees with Stui
Arria Perreault: and people can usually get with a small price
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It’s more the principle of replacing “random pick” by “auction”, Stui. So that in the very rare eventuality that two or three people want the same plot to grow their existing parcels aren’t left to random chance…
Micael Khandr: Doesn’t Jamie’s point about the experiment we already supported mean we need to wait to look at Arria’s proposal until after that?
Arria Perreault: the method is easy and transparent
Jamie Palisades: (It might to the majority who voted for it. MK)
Pip Torok: … and divisive imho …
Cindy Ecksol: well, arria, sometimes municipalities essentially give land away to a “good purpose” too. so wht we are doing is not unprecedented.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I take the position that the poorer citizen can be more productive to the life of the sim than the richer
Arria Perreault: Jamie, do you have a report about the first sale? how many sold parcels? how drawings?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and so the real auction would be in their involvement not their payments
Micael Khandr: I agree with Stui
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but then there is no way to give credit for involvement
Jamie Palisades: NO, wasn;t asked for it ARria. AS IO recall informally there were little or no cases where two people wanted one
Soro Dagostino: I do too.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: so are we to become a snobbish organisation that allows only the rich to join in
Jamie Palisades: (remember, this is not the choice land – this is the abandoned land)
Pip Torok: but it cd always happen one day Jamie
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and for the poor to be on the periphery
StuiChicanne Darkstone: or should be lean towards a meritocracy
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and assist people to join our ranks as much as we can in our limited capacity ?
Cindy Ecksol wonders whether a meritocracy is less “snobbish” than an “aristocracy”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Let’s not get too excited about the “poor people” in the CDS who have, after all, a computer able to run SL and broadband access
Arria Perreault: yes
StuiChicanne Darkstone: a computer once bought is not an ongoing cost
Jamie Palisades: I’m sure LL agrees Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I know they do, Jamie
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and broadband is a requirement of modern life
StuiChicanne Darkstone: having Linden $ is not
StuiChicanne Darkstone: that is a luxury
Micael Khandr: Again, strongly agree with Stui on this.
Jamie Palisades chuckles. Eat the Poor, yes – and freebies too
Arria Perreault: I can only imagine competition for some special parcels
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and one not afforded to all
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I for one am not exactly untouched by the crisis
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye, Stui, your argument still stands ? of course people that have an insane amount of money free to spend would have a huge advantage on an auction where, by chance, two citizens want the same plot
Arria Perreault: I think it is possible to make projects in CDS without money
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if it was not apparent
Pip Torok tends to get “excited” about the poor FWIW …
StuiChicanne Darkstone: the cost of living rises rather more than the basic wage of the average worker
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and at Christmas
Arria Perreault: auction is only one of the posible methods and I think we should evaluate them, maybe on the basis of a report about the current experiment
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think it is within our scope to appreciate the poor rather more than we do
Arria Perreault: for me, the question of the difference between citizen and non-citizen as potential owner is much more important
Arria Perreault: as well as advertising and marketing
StuiChicanne Darkstone: as we may progress past them with our shopping bags and ignore the homeless man because he ruins our dream of prosperous aquisitive and materialistic heaven
Cindy Ecksol: ***TWO MINUTES LEFT IN DISCUSSION TIME ***
Arria Perreault: look our portal: http://portal.slcds.info/
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Greed is rather the enemy of society
Countdown Timer V3.0: Time is up!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: not it’s creator
Arria Perreault: the new sim doesnt have a page
Micael Khandr: Amen, brother Stui!
Arria Perreault: this is an improtant point
Arria Perreault: not only auction
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I for one would never support an auction
Jamie Palisades smiles. Happy to discuss when that’s what’s on the agenda. Sorry, but what is that timer for?
Cindy Ecksol bangs gavel
Soro Dagostino: Call the Question
Cindy Ecksol: ok, we’re out of the 20 minutes allocate d for this.
Arria Perreault: Stui, there are other points in this text
Cindy Ecksol: soro has moved to vote on the question
Cindy Ecksol: is there a second?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well then I may consider them
Cindy Ecksol: (to close discussion)
Micael Khandr: second
Cindy Ecksol: thank you micael
StuiChicanne Darkstone: when rearranged to a more suitable format
Cindy Ecksol: discussion is now closed
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but when coupled with auction it’s never gonna work for me
Cindy Ecksol waves to get stui’s attention!
Arria Perreault: can I propose an alternative?
Cindy Ecksol: wait, arria…need to vote on this first.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: sorry Cindy
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor of arria’s proposal?
Gwyneth Llewelyn just points out one point on Arria’s proposal: “If no one is interested by the same parcel, the citizen can purchase it.” And sorry for being out of order. So, the auction is just to replace the “random picking” when TWO or more citizens wish the same plot.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I get rather passionate when someone oversimplifies poverty for want of understanding the issue
Patroklus Murakami: LOL!
Arria Perreault: aye
Jamie Palisades: (ahem, voting)
Micael Khandr: Nay
StuiChicanne Darkstone: NAY
Cindy Ecksol waits for other “Ayes”
Carolyn Saarinen: nay
Soro Dagostino: Nay
Cindy Ecksol: ok, nays too
Cindy Ecksol: I say nay
Pip Torok: nay
Soro Dagostino: [Just to be safe] Nay
Gwyneth Llewelyn whistles the “International”
Micael Khandr: nay
Cindy Ecksol: thank you, soro
StuiChicanne Darkstone: NAY NAY THRICE NAY !
Cindy Ecksol: I see 7 nays, two Ayes…the proposition is defeated.
Cindy Ecksol: next (and last) on the agenda today:
Cindy Ecksol: Caro, I believe you have a motion?
Carolyn Saarinen: Well, Jamie does.
Arria Perreault: I asked before if I can make an alternative proposal?
Jamie Palisades: Caro, I cannot make a motion at RA.
Cindy Ecksol: arria, yes…but next time.
Carolyn Saarinen: It’s the matter of amending our laws regarding factions. Jamie, please explain.
Cindy Ecksol: agenda is packed today, no new items
Jamie Palisades waits for Cindy
Arria Perreault: May I a remark though?
Soro Dagostino: We are missing a party . . .
Cindy Ecksol: I’ll take that as a motion to introduce the proposal noted on the agenda
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie, you have the floor
Carolyn Saarinen: Yes
Soro Dagostino: Second.
Soro Dagostino: Move to table.
Jamie Palisades: well, ok, but only to say that this is the proposal i suggested some time ago to make factions an optional part of CDS politics, not its center and utter ruler.
Cindy Ecksol: a second for Soro’s motion?
Jamie Palisades shuts up, waiting on the tabling motion
Cindy Ecksol: (tabling means we will take this up next time)
Carolyn Saarinen: I thought Soro was seconding my motion
Jamie Palisades: he did
Gwyneth Llewelyn thought so, too
Soro Dagostino: I did
Cindy Ecksol: he did…and now has moved to wait until next time
Cindy Ecksol: any second?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ah! lol
Soro Dagostino: Then I moved to table.
Cindy Ecksol: if not, we move to discussion…
Cindy Ecksol: 10 minutes today in light of the party
Gwyneth Llewelyn would definitely like the discussion to *start* today so I won’t second the motion to table
Cindy Ecksol: ok, motion to table fails for want of a second
Cindy Ecksol: jamie, you have the floor.
Soro Dagostino: Thanks the body.
Cindy Ecksol: 10 minutes, then a motion
Jamie Palisades: I doubt i need to say much that has not already been typed. I got some help in parsing out the policy issues from my neighbor here, Patroklus, and between the two of us, we are getting some of the opinions aired on the Forum pages Done for now
Arria Perreault: (for Constitutional change: 10 minutes: )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (the irony, Arria )
Arria Perreault: (expeditive democracy)
Cindy Ecksol: relax, ladies!
Jamie Palisades: (until the RA moves to change that, Arria .. ask Gywn, she knows rules)
Cindy Ecksol: we are just BEGINNING discussion today, ok?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye, Tovarich, I mean, Ms LRA… we’ll relax
Jamie Palisades: Ah I always knew you were a fellow Red at heart, Red
Cindy Ecksol:
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I thought that was mandatory today?
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Arria Perreault: I did not even had the time to make alternative to my proposal
Arria Perreault: so
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn, you have the floor
Patroklus Murakami: well, apparently *everyone* in the CDS is a communist today
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Apparently, yes.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Anyway…
Jamie Palisades: see/ don;t NEED factions
Cindy Ecksol checks her red hat
Pip Torok: ????? …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: After some thoughts and discussion,
Patroklus Murakami: no, the soviets never did!
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn, comments, rebuttal, etc?
Cindy Ecksol: time’s a wastin’
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, just a commenty
Gwyneth Llewelyn: In principle, at least the CSDF doesn’t oppose Jamie’s suggestion of a “faction-less” constitution
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (yes, this might come as a surprise to you, Jamie )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: There is just a point that we feel that might require a bit of clarification
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We’d go for the method of having STV as opposed to “first past the post”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And we’d like to see some discussion about “replacements”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The current proposal is not SO clear. I mean, you could get a completely different person on the RA,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: if the original person that was voted for leaves
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And having by-elections *all the time* would be a pain
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sooo barring those two points,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I think that we would definitely go for the change
Gwyneth Llewelyn: After all, there is a plain, simple fact that no faction today can deny: most of us won’t meet the criteria for continuing to be around on the next elections ))
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So let’s be practical!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s all, thanks.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks gwyn
Cindy Ecksol: anyone else? discussion? comments?
Cindy Ecksol: jamie?
Jamie Palisades: On one minor point
Jamie Palisades: STV
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Jamie Palisades: single transferable vote
Jamie Palisades: just so people know
Jamie Palisades: it;ls a way to count cumulative votes that SORT OF
Jamie Palisades: works like our current system
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* quite right.
Jamie Palisades: in the sense that it gives some rank to secondplace preferences
Jamie Palisades: and so is a little more forgiving to minority candidates
Jamie Palisades: . done, just thought it was worth mentioning.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks jamie
Cindy Ecksol: anyone else?
Pip Torok: yes
Cindy Ecksol: pip?
Pip Torok: imo the great pinch has been the 10% rule …
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Pip Torok: we should recognise that ppl in CDS can and should be allowed to be indifferent to politics
Pip Torok: done
Cindy Ecksol: thanks puo
Cindy Ecksol: pip
Cindy Ecksol: sorry….
Jamie Palisades nods
Cindy Ecksol: can we entertain a motion to table so that we can adjourn and go party?
Micael Khandr: Comrades, I move that membership in a faction not be a qualifier for running for office or voting.
Soro Dagostino: I second.
Cindy Ecksol: micael, we already have a similar motion on the table….
Cindy Ecksol: or related, anyway — your proposal requires constitutional amendment
Countdown Timer V3.0: Time is up!
Micael Khandr: What motion are you calling for, Cindy?
Micael Khandr: Motion to adjourn?
Cindy Ecksol: Caro’s motion is currently on the table for discussion (Jamie’s proposal)
Cindy Ecksol: I need a motion to table
Micael Khandr: I see
Cindy Ecksol: (discuss at next meeting)
Pip Torok: so moved
Micael Khandr: Sorry
Cindy Ecksol: second?
Soro Dagostino: second.
Arria Perreault: we can also discuss longer
Cindy Ecksol: thansk
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Pip Torok: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye
Soro Dagostino: Aye
Micael Khandr: Aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Party TIME !
Cindy Ecksol: aye
Cindy Ecksol: ok, motion tabled.
Arria Perreault: abstain
Gwyneth Llewelyn abstains
Soro Dagostino: Move adjournment.
Cindy Ecksol: any concerns of council or citizens?
Cindy Ecksol: if not, is there a second for soro’s move to adjourn?
Micael Khandr: second
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Micael Khandr: aye
Soro Dagostino: Aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Patroklus Murakami: cheerio
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye !
Arria Perreault: abstains
Gwyneth Llewelyn abstains again (with due respect to the ones who wish to party, of course; Rose put a lot of effort into it and we shouldn’t remain here talking, but, alas, sometimes we also discuss important things )
Cindy Ecksol: aye
Jamie Palisades: Folks, please do join us over in the Marktplatz, even if only briefly. Thanks
Cindy Ecksol: we are adjourned and thank you.

Permalink.

RA Meeting 20 December 2009: Transcript
by Cindy Ecksol » Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:28 pm
In attendance: Cindy Ecksol, Soro Dagostino, Gwyneth Llewelyn, Sonja Strom, Pip Torok, Naftali Torok, Micael Khandr
Seven day votes: Joaquin Gustav, Arria Perrault, Carolyn Saarinen, Robert Galland

Cindy Ecksol: ok, recorder is running…
Cindy Ecksol: please click on it now (even if you did before) to indicate consent
Soro Dagostino has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn says hi and quickly touches teh recorder!
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Sonja Strom has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino: Hello Gwyn . . .
Gwyneth Llewelyn: wow I love that skirt, Cindy ? I love all assymetric designs )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oops … forgot about the recorder!!!
Cindy Ecksol: yes, it’s nice isn’t it?
Cindy Ecksol: went shopping a couple of weeks ago
Sonja Strom: yes, it is
Sonja Strom: Hi Pip
Pip Torok: hi sonja, gwyn
Soro Dagostino: Hello Pip
Pip Torok: soro, cindy
Gwyneth Llewelyn notices that she’s the only one not dressed in the Christmas spirit…
Cindy Ecksol: do you recognize the top, gwyn? you should!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh yes, that looks familiar, Cindy )
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ooo and the tiny gif tied to the end of the Santa hat… haha
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and a tinklebell!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: … these designers are too much ))
Pip Torok: ha … santa’s coming
Cindy Ecksol: yeah, that was pretty cute
Cindy Ecksol: touch the hat and it rings
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ooooh
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hahahahahahaha
Pip Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: so sweet
Pip Torok: nafs doing encores at cedar island … “she may be some time”
Cindy Ecksol: hee hee!
Cindy Ecksol: those fans, just wont’ let her go
Pip Torok: they cling so …
Gwyneth Llewelyn apologieses but had to get some coffee, brr
Cindy Ecksol:
Cindy Ecksol: have already been out for three hours this morning.
Pip Torok: i’ll dare ask it … how’s the weather?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So did I… to cross the street only though
Cindy Ecksol: it’s well below freezing here, but I’ve finally adjusted…..
Cindy Ecksol: we only got about six inches in my backyard
Gwyneth Llewelyn: “only”, she says…
Cindy Ecksol: big crowds shopping in the strip district (market district)
Pip Torok: shallow by USA standards …
Sonja Strom:
Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles @ Pip
Cindy Ecksol: yes — they had two feet not to far south of me
Gwyneth Llewelyn: wow ….
Naftali Torok: present!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, hi, Naf We all heard you have been a *huge* success ))
Cindy Ecksol: good job, naf!
Naftali Torok: finally can make it one time here
Cindy Ecksol: we’re still waiting for a quorum though…
Naftali Torok: just came from music island
Soro Dagostino: Hello Naf
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Slowly getting there, Cindy, very slowly….
Naftali Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: arria said she is coming….
Gwyneth Llewelyn *counts*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: mmmh
Gwyneth Llewelyn: we need 7, right?
Cindy Ecksol: at least on the doodle she did…
Cindy Ecksol: yes…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok…
Gwyneth Llewelyn *slaps her forehead*
Naftali Torok: hi gwyn, hi sonja hi sorro wnks at cindy
Gwyneth Llewelyn: … I forgot about the doodle thingy!
Cindy Ecksol raises eyebrows at gwyn
Naftali Torok: looks at pip (thinks : he did change quick!!!) lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn: sorry, sorry ! …. but I’m here nevertheless
Pip Torok: quite!
Naftali Torok: sorro your xmas hat is too small i think….or yoyur intellect too much…
Cindy Ecksol: lol!!!
Soro Dagostino: Fat head
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Naf
Cindy Ecksol: this hat I’m wearing is adjustable.
Gwyneth Llewelyn looks for a SL fur coat
Pip Torok: (find an accommodating SL Polar Bear?)
Cindy Ecksol: well, what do you think folks?
Naftali Torok: hey Good job Soro….fantastique now
Cindy Ecksol: shall we wait or give it up?
Gwyneth Llewelyn is fine with waiting
Soro Dagostino: Reading Jamie post, and the argument.
Soro Dagostino: If we ever get to it.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I guess I ought to read it too….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *sigh*
Cindy Ecksol: good idea….agenda in the amphora as usual
Pip Torok: in the Forum?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Micael is arriving! We might be saved!
Pip Torok:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay Micael ) thanks for coming ))
Sonja Strom: Hi Micael
Cindy Ecksol: micael!
Soro Dagostino: hello Micael
Cindy Ecksol: you made a quorum!
Micael Khandr: Greetings–sorry I’m late.
Soro Dagostino: Good to see you.
Cindy Ecksol: you’re just in the nick of time…we were considering adjourning for lack of a quorum
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Excellent timing )
Cindy Ecksol: ok, click the recorder if you have not, and let’s get started
Micael Khandr: I did
Cindy Ecksol: any additions to the agenda?
Soro Dagostino: Wish there were, now that we have a quorum
Cindy Ecksol:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Soro )
Gwyneth Llewelyn *shakes head*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and smiles
Cindy Ecksol: ok, no changes….?
Cindy Ecksol: can I get a motion to approve the agenda
Soro Dagostino: So move
Pip Torok: so move
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor aye, all opposed nay
Micael Khandr: Aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Pip Torok: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Cindy Ecksol: aye
Cindy Ecksol: excellent…
Pip Torok: pokes naf
Cindy Ecksol: ok, next meeting (last of the term) is scheduled for Jan 3
Cindy Ecksol: I will probably not make it…..
Cindy Ecksol: soro, will you be here? can you chair?
Soro Dagostino: It looks ok at this time.
Cindy Ecksol: great.
Cindy Ecksol: everyone ok with 9am on 3 jan?
Micael Khandr: OK
Soro Dagostino: Holiday weekend.
Pip Torok: i am
Sonja Strom: I am
Soro Dagostino: I am
Cindy Ecksol: yes…that’s why I’m asking.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m fine too.
Cindy Ecksol: if we don’t do it on the 3rd, we’d have to do it next weekend
Cindy Ecksol: not sure that’s any better
Pip Torok: !
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Cindy Ecksol: by the 10th we’ll be into the election…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh-huh
Cindy Ecksol: so 3 jan at 0900
Cindy Ecksol: ?
Soro Dagostino: Agreed
Gwyneth Llewelyn is fine with that
Pip Torok: so move
Micael Khandr: OK
Cindy Ecksol: great.
Micael Khandr: OK second
Pip Torok: ok
Micael Khandr: third too
Cindy Ecksol: some 7 day votes today….joa, arria, caro, robert
Soro Dagostino: Fourth and a fifth — of brandy for Cindy
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Cindy Ecksol smiles and sips coffee…
Cindy Ecksol: I deserve it, don’t i??
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh most definitely, yes !
Cindy Ecksol: jamie is not here, so I guess no chancellor’s report.
Micael Khandr: Then we are on time
Cindy Ecksol: what I’m most concerned about right now is that we have not heard the census report yet…
Cindy Ecksol: anyone else know anything?
Gwyneth Llewelyn *scratches head*
Pip Torok: not a thing and the DPU is anxious too
Gwyneth Llewelyn doesn’t know anything either….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (well, I usually don’t! hehe )(
Cindy Ecksol: all right, I will follow up with jamie. he must be busy in RL — have hardly seen him at all in world
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mm hmm
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn, I forget — does SC have to certify that census?
Soro Dagostino: I was told his RL schedule was really bad.
Soro Dagostino: And, I think SC has to certify.
Cindy Ecksol: I think I remember that too soro — gwyn, do you know?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *sigh*
Cindy Ecksol: all right needs to be done — faction cert and candidate declarations are due on the 25th
Gwyneth Llewelyn is brain dead
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, those two certainly have to be certified by the SC
Cindy Ecksol jingles bell to wake gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m not sure about the census though
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sudane was online a couple of hours ago…
Soro Dagostino: In Section 2 . . . .
Cindy Ecksol: well, it’s jamie’s prerogative to announce, so I’ll work with him on that.
Soro Dagostino: SC does have to certify.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: If she logs back in, we can ask her directly about the census …. but yes, it’s up to Jamie
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Cindy Ecksol: moving on, stui is not here, so I guess no commerce commission report either….unless there’s a member present who wishes to comment?
Sonja Strom: I went to three meetings, but do not know what the commission is doing really.
Cindy Ecksol:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hmm
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That *is* a bad sign…!
Cindy Ecksol: ok then….I guess we move on
Cindy Ecksol: old business.
Cindy Ecksol: constitutional revision
Cindy Ecksol: discussion was tabled last tme, so we are still in “discussion time”
Soro Dagostino: Move to table
Cindy Ecksol: second?
Gwyneth Llewelyn rubs hands and does an evil cat grin
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Table again??? Oh my
Pip Torok: what does m 2 t mean?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *sigh*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It means postponing it…
Cindy Ecksol: pip, would mean that we will postpone until next meeting
Cindy Ecksol: again
Micael Khandr: second
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Micael Khandr: Aye
Pip Torok: well we do need to discuss it and we have the time here and now
Soro Dagostino: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn agrees with Pip so votes “nay”
Pip Torok: nay
Sonja Strom: nay
Micael Khandr: But not everyone is here, so the discussion will be limited
Pip Torok: cant be laid to the subject-matter imo
Soro Dagostino: Difficult without the proponent here.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Since we can’t foresee if “everybody will be here” next time, it’s better to discuss with whomever is around than to endlessly wait and hope for a fuller RA
Pip Torok: well imo it wd be a good time to take initial reactions
Micael Khandr: Hmm, not sure I wanted to wait endlessly
Gwyneth Llewelyn: imo too
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: ok….so are you changing your vote, micael?
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Micael Khandr: Nope, still Ayen to postponement
Sonja Strom: Hi Lysander, this is a public meeting, you are welcome to join us and listen.
Micael Khandr: Aye
Cindy Ecksol: ok…
Cindy Ecksol: need naf to vote …..
Cindy Ecksol: someone poke her please
Lysander Kaestner: Thank you very much. I believe I will observe for just a bit.
Naftali Torok: me
Naftali Torok: lol
Cindy Ecksol: yes, you!
Sonja Strom: yes
Naftali Torok: grins
Naftali Torok: sorry
Cindy Ecksol: motion is to postpone discussion of the amendment to abolish factions
Cindy Ecksol: aye if you would likke to postpone, nay if not
Pip Torok: the vote is whether or not to postpone talk of constitution
Micael Khandr: because not everyone is here
Soro Dagostino: [we could go home] Naftali Torok: postpone
Micael Khandr: [yes] Cindy Ecksol: and also vote aye
Naftali Torok: aye
Naftali Torok: postpone =better
Cindy Ecksol: discussino postponed until next time
Naftali Torok: great
Micael Khandr: perfect
Cindy Ecksol: I think this is difficult without the proponent…..
Naftali Torok: lol
Pip Torok: reluctantly agrees
Cindy Ecksol: no new business…
Cindy Ecksol: concerns of RA members?
Micael Khandr: I did want to mention something.
Gwyneth Llewelyn bites her tongue.
Cindy Ecksol: yes, micael?
Countdown Timer V3.0: only the owner can use this object
Micael Khandr: Just a FYI–
Cindy Ecksol: yes?
Micael Khandr: I plan to hold a series of open interviews starting mid-January at the Convivencia Institute
Gwyneth Llewelyn: … interviews?
Micael Khandr: that would be with those here and not here that have worked in CDS for many or few years
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh!
Micael Khandr: Just to gather experiences
Cindy Ecksol:
Micael Khandr: what and why and who
Pip Torok: I’m ready when you are, Micael
Cindy Ecksol: hee hee!
Micael Khandr: Cool
Soro Dagostino: Your going to make us think?
Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles
Soro Dagostino: HAHAHAHAH
Micael Khandr: I will set up specfic dates and times with each of you, and hope the RA would be willing to start the ball rolling
Naftali Torok: lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Soro Dagostino: Seriously, that sounds like a great idea.
Micael Khandr: I will eventually try to collect the info for an article I will write on SL and democracy.
Micael Khandr:
Micael Khandr: just a FYI
Micael Khandr: more to come
Pip Torok: any idea of when youll publish, Micael?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oh wow wow wow
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Micael Khandr: for a conference (in Europe) next year–probably will have to complete it by May
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Now that’s amazing, Micael!
Pip Torok: good (will have momentum then)
Micael Khandr: Yes
Cindy Ecksol: oooh, fun!
Naftali Torok: nods, great idea
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Lots of fun
Cindy Ecksol: when and where is th e conference
Micael Khandr: So, you’ll each and all hear from me after the first of the year
Cindy Ecksol: maybe we could have a CDS “meet up” at the same time/place?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: You know, Micael, LL used to do lots of presentations using the CDS as an example…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good idea, Cindy!!
Micael Khandr: November in Hungary
Pip Torok: (dont anyone say C*p*nh*g*n)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And get streamed live into Micael’s presentation!
Cindy Ecksol: oooh, now THAT sounds like fun!!!!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: roflPip
Micael Khandr: Thahnks for your positive response!
Micael Khandr: thanks
Cindy Ecksol: I have a friend in Czech REpublic I’ve been meaning to visit (
Micael Khandr:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, that’s awesome really, Micael
Micael Khandr: Yes–that would be great to have any of you attend with me!
Gwyneth Llewelyn would just go incognito
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Micael Khandr: Perhaps on SL
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s always fine
Cindy Ecksol: well, will be happy to be interviewed, and will be even more interested to read the article
Cindy Ecksol: what’s the conference, micael?
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Cindy on both comments
Micael Khandr: One on teaching democracy
Lysander Kaestner: Thank you all, interesting stuff. Take care.
Pip Torok:
Micael Khandr: So this is a perfect example/case study!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Uh… depending on the word “perfect” :=)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hahahaha
Micael Khandr: True . . .
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Let’s say mmmh
Soro Dagostino: groan . . .
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: an *interesting* case study
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Soro !
Cindy Ecksol: well, it IS interesting…..
Soro Dagostino: We all have to wear gloves.
Cindy Ecksol: I’ve said before that in virtual worlds “code is law”….and CDS is the only experiment I know of that attempts to transcend that.
Pip Torok: and bow-ties?
Micael Khandr: I’ll have questions prepared and get some feedback at the next meeting, with your permission
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Specially for two reasons, IMHO… democracy is hard and not so obvious; we just take it for granted. And secondly, strangely enough, nobody really *cares* about democracy (just look at the whole of SL!), and that is more surprising… even fearful!
Cindy Ecksol: there are a LOT of analogies to RL republics….Israel, former soviet republics, etc.
Cindy Ecksol: afghanistan, Iraq….all of that.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh-huh
Pip Torok: quite …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The “benelovent dictatorship” model is the prevalent one in SL
Gwyneth Llewelyn: … since that’s what LL also applies
Micael Khandr: landed gentry?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I prefer to call it “enlightened absolutism” )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And yes, I mean that too, Micael!
Pip Torok: even worse since LL dictates the SL equivalents of the laws of Physics
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Two oooooooold articles of mine: http://gwynethllewelyn.net/2004/09/24/t … cond-life/
Micael Khandr: beyond quantum
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and http://gwynethllewelyn.net/2004/12/03/w … s-so-hard/
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The “landed gentry” model is actually VERY good for SL!
Pip Torok: thanls Gwyn
Cindy Ecksol agrees with gwyn
Cindy Ecksol: look how successful Caledon has been!
Cindy Ecksol: ok…..
Cindy Ecksol: just realized we’re off into another world — let’s finish the meeting and continue this discussion after
Pip Torok: but then how democratic is Caledon?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and on a side-note: http://gwynethllewelyn.net/2008/12/26/d … companies/)
Cindy Ecksol: any other annoucements?
Micael Khandr: move to adjourn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sorry for so much self-promotion
Pip Torok: so move
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Micael
Cindy Ecksol: thank you micael and pip and gwyn
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Cindy Ecksol: ?
Micael Khandr: Aye
Pip Torok: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Cindy Ecksol: excellent — we are adjourned

Permalink.

RA Meeting 10 January 2010: Transcript
Meeting on 2010-01-10
Soro Dagostino: Hello Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi Soro
Gwyneth Llewelyn: … and hi everybody really lol
Sonja Strom: Hi Gwyn and Pip
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Sonja Strom: Hi Jamie
Jamie Palisades smiles, waves, Good morning – virtually anyway
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And here comes Jamie… hi Mr Chancellor!
Micael Khandr: Good day, all!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi Arria
Jamie Palisades smiles. So, if we have not started official yet, has anyone seen a final candidated list or something. from the SC?
Arria Perreault: Hi Gwyn
Jamie Palisades: I’ve not
Arria Perreault: Hi everybody
Gwyneth Llewelyn mumbles that she hasn’t seen anything.
Jamie Palisades: Arria, the new exhibit’s lovely, I finally got there to look
Arria Perreault: Thank you, Jamie
Sonja Strom: Hi Arria
Arria Perreault: Hi SOnja
Sonja Strom:
Jamie Palisades looks at his friends list stuff – now, was this the day we weren’t sure if Cindy was able to attend?
Arria Perreault: who is the LRA pro tempore ?
Jamie Palisades: Soro
Gwyneth Llewelyn counts
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hmm 6
Jamie Palisades: of 11? well, that’s 50%+1
Soro Dagostino: Has anyone heard from Cindy?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So, yes, we’ve got a quorum, if Soro is so kind to do the honours….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I haven’t… let me check email
Jamie Palisades: I have a faint memory that Cindy expresssed doubt, at the end of the last mtg, about being here on time, this week, for RL reasons
Soro Dagostino: If I recall, this meeting is being held regarding the two matters athat were tabled — or, mor specifically, specially set.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The last mail I had from Cindy was:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: “Please let me know if you have any additional items for the final RA meeting of the term. Right now it looks like I will probably be able to attend the meeting, but if not, Soro will be there to chair.”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah
Gwyneth Llewelyn: but that was for Jan 3
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well…
Soro Dagostino: Hmmmm, the agenda for the 3rd is in the amphora
Gwyneth Llewelyn: since we *do* have a quorum
Pip Torok: asa far as i understand .. this meeting is an overflow to Jan 3rd
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Exactly,
Jamie Palisades: don’t think a new agenda was offered anyway
Gwyneth Llewelyn: namely on the issue of changing the elections
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and agrees
Micael Khandr: Yes
Soro Dagostino: [Groan] Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: poor Soro
Pip Torok: hi Stui!
Sonja Strom: hello Stui
Jamie Palisades: Morning STui
Soro Dagostino has indicated consent to be recorded.
Arria Perreault: I have seen there is a new faction, SEED
Arria Perreault: Hi Stui
StuiChicanne Darkstone: never Fear
StuiChicanne Darkstone: **’`*`’** Stui **’`*`’**
StuiChicanne Darkstone: is here
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, hi Stui
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and lol
Pip Torok: a sort of “antifaction-faction ….
Soro Dagostino: As the Deputy LRA — I call the meeting to order.
Arria Perreault: Carolyn is candidate
Jamie Palisades smiles. As opposed to pro faction factions?
Soro Dagostino: Please note your consent to recordation.
Jamie Palisades has indicated consent to be recorded.
Arria Perreault has indicated consent to be recorded.
StuiChicanne Darkstone has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn consents to being recorded.
Jamie Palisades touches black box, which seems to do it still
Pip Torok: (the recorders on i think)
Gwyneth Llewelyn did that too hehe
Jamie Palisades: yup
Arria Perreault: it works
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *kicks the recorder*
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: it does… I wonder if it’s on since last week?!
Sonja Strom: Hi Rose
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m here too
Rose Springvale: hello everyone.
Pip Torok: hi Rose
Arria Perreault: Hi Rose
Gwyneth Llewelyn: good morning, Rose
Micael Khandr: G’day
Rose Springvale: shall i send a notice?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sure, flower girl
Gwyneth Llewelyn *giggles*
Jamie Palisades: please
Pip Torok: weve got a quorum thanks Rose!:)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: yes we need a notice
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, citizens are welcome to know we’re in session and come too
Soro Dagostino: Welcome
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I didn’t realise that the meeting was happening
StuiChicanne Darkstone: therefore
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and agrees with Stui
StuiChicanne Darkstone: there may be others that would have attended had they known
Pip Torok: (oh yes, theyre who we’re here fo!:)
Soro Dagostino: The Agenda is as published for the 3rd.
Soro Dagostino: Any additions or corrections.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: after all I arrived on account of speaking to Mr Khandr
Jamie Palisades: Soro?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m one for Soro !
Soro Dagostino: Jamie?
Jamie Palisades: We might add any announcements, to the end, as we hadthat for the 3rd but there may be a few more now
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, aye, good point.
Soro Dagostino: Yes.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: YAY
StuiChicanne Darkstone: announcements
Gwyneth Llewelyn moves to add announcements for the agenda for today
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Stui
Pip Torok: seconds
StuiChicanne Darkstone: who’s getting married ?
Rose Springvale: ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’ll be priest
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Joaquin Gustav: hello
StuiChicanne Darkstone: JO !
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hi, Joaquin!
Joaquin Gustav: hello friends
Pip Torok: hi joaquin
Rose Springvale: Hi Joaquin
Micael Khandr: G’day!
Sonja Strom: Hi Joaquin
Rose Springvale: hey Tor!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: JO !
Pip Torok: ah micael … hi
Tor Karlsvalt: hi rose
Rose Springvale smiles at my next potential vic..er citizen…
Sonja Strom: welcome Tor
Tor Karlsvalt: thanks Sonja
StuiChicanne Darkstone: oh and thankyou all for your attendance on Wednesday
StuiChicanne Darkstone: STH is building an audience
Soro Dagostino: Sorry, some lag
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Rose Springvale: Stui, did you want me to post that transcript or no?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: yea
Micael Khandr: Hi, Pip
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (a pity I have an overlapping thing on Wednesday, Stui, I’d love to be around too… )
StuiChicanne Darkstone: the people need to know what the people are thinking
Rose Springvale: okay, sorry, will do so today
Soro Dagostino: This is the last meeting of the term?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Technically, I think so…
Jamie Palisades: Last scheduled one, I think
StuiChicanne Darkstone: STH is making the grid grind to a halt
Pip Torok: i think so, Soro
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Stui!
Soro Dagostino: Who knows when we meet again
Rose Springvale: technically time for one more
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: We’ll meet again don’t know where
StuiChicanne Darkstone: don’t know when…
Rose Springvale: just lame duck sessions though, and traditionally RA has not met for those
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but I know we’ll meet again some sunny day !
Pip Torok: (sounds like the 3 witches, Soro!)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I missed my calling
Soro Dagostino: I have had no notice to any 7 day votes — for the record.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I was about 40 years too late to be Vera Lynn
Jamie Palisades: Well I hope I do know where. The Thermae.
Soro Dagostino: Mr. Chancellor — do you have a report?
Pip Torok: hear hear, Jamie
Jamie Palisades: Certainly, and thanks
Jamie Palisades: a few items then let me yield to Rose for any other announcements
Soro Dagostino: Yes
Soro Dagostino: brb
Jamie Palisades: First, be aware, we have a fair amount of land, particularly in Locus Ameonus, open now
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh-huh
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Jamie Palisades smiles. I may write a few words for the benefit of the next RA’s planning on how , in my view, it got that way
Jamie Palisades: but for now, suffice to say, Rose and I still are in office this monht, and working to fill it up
Sonja Strom: Welcome Sterling, Jeroma
Jamie Palisades: And all help is appreciated, so send prospects out way please – or show them yourself
Pip Torok: hi Sterling!
Jamie Palisades: thhat was item 1
Jamie Palisades: item 2
Jamie Palisades: I have a few pending land actions that I must take, basefd on requests or complaints, and I;ve been *very* slow in SL the last month.
Pip Torok: Hi Jeroma
Jeroma Wycliffe: Pip
Jamie Palisades: My apologies – RL just gets busy at times – but be aware there will be a few actions and zoning items
Jamie Palisades: item 3
Jamie Palisades: i have usually, from the executive branch, taken the following roles in the RA election
Jamie Palisades: – bugging the SC to make sure the poll devices and such are in place, and announced
Jamie Palisades: heh
Jamie Palisades: – dealing with election signs/zoing, plaza placement
Jamie Palisades: *zoning
Jamie Palisades: so, FWIW, I am still doing that this time
Sonja Strom has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades: I expect I also will be unofficially agitated for a return of our Thermae hang out, if a results time for the polls can be coaxed out of the SC
Jamie Palisades:
Jamie Palisades: For newer people, that’s an old CDS election tradition
Jamie Palisades: .. OK, let me yield to Rose
Rose Springvale: (Thanks Jamie
Rose Springvale: I don’t have much to add… New land available cards are out now
Rose Springvale: you can get them from me, or from group notices. I will put them in such of the info signs as i have perms to as well
Rose Springvale: I’d like to reiterate one thing Jamie said… and that is i’d really appreciate others helping us sell our land…
Rose Springvale: you all have contacts that might be interested, just takes a little time to explain:)
Rose Springvale: As for the election, we will be scheduling two events
Rose Springvale: one an informal meet & greet, which i expect to happen this week
Rose Springvale: and two, formal debates, which i’ve asked Aliasi to designate a moderator for.
Rose Springvale: Jamie or i are happy to moderate, and have in the past, but also SC members have successfully handled this,
Rose Springvale: i’m hoping that debate can happen next weekend, to give voters as much information early in the election as possible
Rose Springvale: The informal election result party …well we only have a day between polls closing and the new term starting, so hopefully the sc can count quickly
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Rose Springvale: and then we’ll have an inaugural ball early in the new term.
Rose Springvale: Anything else i should speak to Jamie?
Rose Springvale: questions?
Jamie Palisades smiles,
Jamie Palisades: I don;t think so Rose
Soro Dagostino: Any questions?
Jamie Palisades: FWIW, my first inclination was to see if Delia is available for the debate again
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah, that would be nice…
Jamie Palisades: she did well and is quite neutral, I though
Gwyneth Llewelyn agrees.
Jamie Palisades: I was neutral once
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
Soro Dagostino: Jamie do you have more.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ?
Jamie Palisades: But hey, now that my own view is that the factions should not own the RA
Jamie Palisades: heh heh
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I like Delia
Jamie Palisades: Good, she was generally acceptable before, I will inquire
Jamie Palisades: OK
Soro Dagostino: Jamie are you through?
Jamie Palisades: – my last item, then let me ask for questions. Rose mentione dnot being able to get perms for some of the info gadgets. We’ve not done as well as I hoped, making them GENERALLY usable. One thing that she and I are doing with this last few weeks of the term is looking into some device changes. Among other things, as Gwyneth noted 2 months ago, the main wwww.slcds.infoportal is weak for our needs. I suggest that members go look at http://winterfell.ning.com as an instance of something much easier — and much less top-down-techie-controlled. I am experimenting with it now, and may have some more to offer as a beta.
Arria Perreault: I have chacked my access to the portal
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmmh yes. I think that the only thread I read (not commented) on the forums recently was Rose pretty much suggesting a move to Ning…
Arria Perreault: it works. So it is not a problem to useit
Gwyneth Llewelyn wonders if we could upload all the forum posts to it
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Possibly, yes
Arria Perreault: a lot of work has been invested in this portal and there are a lot of informations already there
Rose Springvale: smiles, hate to start too fresh…
Jamie Palisades: hmmmm – genericalluy those systems tend to be friendly to imports and hostile to exports, Gwyn, but phpBB has CSV export I think
Gwyneth Llewelyn: If not, I think I might be able to force it to do that
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, it would be worth a test, right?…
Rose Springvale: may i say something?
Soro Dagostino: Cindy will soon be here.
Arria Perreault: is it only for the portal or for all information, including portal?
Soro Dagostino: Yes Rose
Arria Perreault: portal is our visiting card
Jamie Palisades: Arria, our experience has been that while the system is very pretty, non-CMS /non-web professionals do not find it an easy place to contribute. Of course, this will be a question for next term’s leaders and RA
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It’s mostly an executive decision… unless a new budget needs to be approved…
Soro Dagostino: Rose has the floor\
Arria Perreault: yes, too early to decide now
Gwyneth Llewelyn: oops, sorry Soro ? and sorry Rose
Soro Dagostino: Hello Cindy
Rose Springvale: The portal has not been updated, as far as i can see, for over six months.
Cindy Ecksol wavew hello and sorry to be late
Arria Perreault: I am willing to work on the portal
Arria Perreault: just ask
Rose Springvale: we have 7 sims with no evidence of existence at all
Arria Perreault: I will add pages for the news sims
Keila Forager: I’ll bet for longer…
Rose Springvale: So when i show a new or potentially new citizen our portal… they get very confused
Rose Springvale: also
Arria Perreault: I thought Brian was member of the PIO team
Rose Springvale: when new people DO join us
Keila Forager: hard to navigate and quite a bit of info not accessable
Rose Springvale: the registration process.. no offense to anyone… generally takes tow or three tries
Rose Springvale: two*
Keila Forager: or incorrect
Cindy Ecksol has indicated consent to be recorded.
Rose Springvale: so there is a chilling effect on new people to come back
Arria Perreault: there are two systems, forums and portal
Rose Springvale: please Arria
Arria Perreault: please don’t make a confusion betwenn these two systems
Rose Springvale: i’m not arguing.. i’m reporting observations.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: nothing more annoying than things that don’t work
Arria Perreault: I am willing to update
Rose Springvale: the portal is TOTALLY un interactive
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *kicks the recorder*
Rose Springvale: its just a nice tombstone
Arria Perreault: the portal give informations
Pip Torok: does the “question” system work?
Arria Perreault: like laws, lands, citizen lists
Rose Springvale: we need places where people can post land for sale, events, information
Soro Dagostino: While the chair is willing to allow a certain amout of discussion.
Arria Perreault: forums is the place to discuss
Rose Springvale: sigh
Keila Forager: Not good information Arria…I tried to read it when I became a citizen
Soro Dagostino: Its time to get in order.
Rose Springvale: thanks for giving me time soro.
Arria Perreault: we have a google calender already
Jamie Palisades: Thank you for that, all of you. As Arria said, this will not be finally decided until next term. Soro, colleagues, for now my only interest was to raise the issue for informal views and an eye to a test — (of NING), in which these good folks will be important test subjects
Jamie Palisades: and we’re done with our report
Pip Torok: may i make a suggestion, Mr LRA?
Soro Dagostino: Pip?
Arria Perreault: I have made an advice in he forum too
Soro Dagostino: Pip you have the floor
Pip Torok: i suggest that the person concernwed give someone (me?) a list of new citizens … and i run a party every month for them
Soro Dagostino:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay Pip
Soro Dagostino: woot!
Sonja Strom:
Pip Torok: but i wd NEED a list of current new citizens!!
Cindy Ecksol smiles
Soro Dagostino: Now, back to the order of things.
Pip Torok: without it it just wdnt work
Jamie Palisades grins — more on that in the forums. We are trying to get our new widgets to do exactly that
Arria Perreault: anyway the forum has to be independant from Exec (for the record)
Jamie Palisades: even though severa; stakeholders hgavce strong (and differenmt) opinions about whose software ought to run everything
Jamie Palisades: Arria? Forum is run by SC
StuiChicanne Darkstone: one for Soro
StuiChicanne Darkstone: can I say something ?
Soro Dagostino: Stui — you may
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well I have been a CDS member since the merger and or the benefit of pointing out the importance of the issue – I dunno what the hell the portal is
StuiChicanne Darkstone: therefore it can’t be doing it’s job can it ?
Pip Torok: 9and i’d point them at the portal in the party, Stui!)
Jamie Palisades chuckles. Proof that no orientation, even when repeated, will make all citizens pay attention to the stuff we point them to
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *sits on the book again*
Soro Dagostino: Can this be taken to a working party?
Rose Springvale: stui, you have been given the information
StuiChicanne Darkstone: oh
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *LOL*
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but what’s the portal ?
Rose Springvale: website for cds
Jamie Palisades: ooo good one, Pip< maybe we can have an open invite meeting about this party/info idea, sometime soon? Not really something that has to wait for election StuiChicanne Darkstone: ah Keila Forager: It's not doing it's job Stui.. StuiChicanne Darkstone: *LOL* Pip Torok: its a sort of "help for new citizens" Stui... Soro Dagostino: Are we done with this folk? StuiChicanne Darkstone: like a cheat sheet ? Joaquin Gustav: brb Sonja Strom: Just to make it clear, this is the portal: http://portal.slcds.info Keila Forager: But it doesn't Pip, I'm a new resident and it sucks! Pip Torok: a bit more elaborate , but yes Jamie Palisades: psst - take it to a brainstorming session Pip Torok: lets have your crits keila! Gwyneth Llewelyn: Keila Forager: Give me some time and I can give you specifics...not enough time here.. Arria Perreault: http://portal.slcds.info/ Pip Torok: kk Arria Perreault: http://portal.slcds.info/ Soro Dagostino: Thank you. Rose Springvale: yes i agree, there are others who want to weigh in on this.. . maybe a committee? Keila Forager: I write them out in a notecard for you this week.. Keila Forager: not opinion, but facts Pip Torok: tks ;-] Jamie Palisades: koff koff - agenda Keila Forager: unless you change it by then Soro Dagostino: Working party . . . Rose, Pip, Keila, and Arria? Pip Torok: fine by me Rose Springvale: just name a RA liasion, and we can work together Jamie Palisades: Can Pip just convene a meeting? And add me, please Arria Perreault: The executive was in charge to update this website Soro Dagostino: So appointed. Keila is the chair, Jamie too. Pip Torok: ok ... Arria Perreault: Brian Livingstone has done this job for months Jamie Palisades: if they can Arria, which was the point Soro Dagostino: Gavel time. Arria Perreault: I don't know what happen then Soro Dagostino: Bang Bang! Arria Perreault: maybe, Jamie, you can tell us Soro Dagostino: Take it to the working party Rose Springvale: hey Kami! Kamilah Hauptmann: *mew* Arria Perreault: it is under your responsibilty after all Jamie Palisades waves at Kami, mutters - nice hat. Arria, let's do it in the breakout session Arria Perreault: which breakout session? Soro Dagostino: Next item -- Commerce Commission -- Stui Arria Perreault: It was a too important work that we can stop it in one second Jamie Palisades: ("working party" Arria) Arria Perreault: the portal can be improved Soro Dagostino: Arria -- we are moving on. Arria Perreault: the CMS that is behind is very flexible StuiChicanne Darkstone: ha I didn't plan for this eventuality I didn't realise that there was a meeting so there has been no progress StuiChicanne Darkstone: thinking it's gonna be going into the next RA Soro Dagostino: Questions for Stui? StuiChicanne Darkstone: unless anyone has objections Arria Perreault: as you always mention volunteering in the exec, this work was also volunteering of 3 people Ariel Feden: sorry Pip Pip Torok: ?? Ariel Feden: I was sitting on your lap StuiChicanne Darkstone: Ariel sat on you Pippet Pip Torok: oh! Gwyneth Llewelyn has no objections ? I'm just curious to see what kind of recommendations the committee might be bringing up for the next RA Arria Perreault: I will update this portal Rose Springvale: At this point, i think the committee should take over Gwyneth Llewelyn: shh Rose lol Arria Perreault: who is in this comittee? Jamie Palisades: aim your shushes where they will help, dear Gwyn Soro Dagostino: Look at the appointments. Soro Dagostino: Up the chat log. Rose Springvale: i don't think it makes sense to try to update now... lets get feedback and work with our citizens Arria Perreault: I will update Jamie Palisades: ** may i ask the chair on what agenda item the meeting currently sits? Rose Springvale welcomes ariel Soro Dagostino: Any more Stui? StuiChicanne Darkstone: Sorry I have hydrogen peroxide itch StuiChicanne Darkstone: finding it hard to type Keila Forager: lol Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Stui!!!!! Soro Dagostino: Are you done Stui? StuiChicanne Darkstone: no I dont think so but I hope you like my new hair StuiChicanne Darkstone: and say hello to Ariel Arria Perreault: it is too easy to decide its death because it is not updated StuiChicanne Darkstone: he's new Soro Dagostino: Stlui? Jamie Palisades hits the side of his head gently, to see if his eyes will uncross StuiChicanne Darkstone: Gwyneth Llewelyn: hi Ariel Arria Perreault: I want to be in this committee StuiChicanne Darkstone: yes one for Soro Rose Springvale: sigh, you were appointed Arria. StuiChicanne Darkstone: StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro have you said hello to Ariel ? Soro Dagostino: Ok, now that Stui is finsihed -- Constitutional revision concerning factions. Soro Dagostino: Who is the proponenet? Cindy Ecksol: carolyn introduced the original proposal StuiChicanne Darkstone: who isn't ? Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* StuiChicanne Darkstone: *LOL* Micael Khandr: I think Caro was the original proponent Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Stui StuiChicanne Darkstone: Caro would have been here StuiChicanne Darkstone: but she didn't know about the meeting Rose Springvale: smiles, its been introduced Soro Dagostino: Who is to take her place as proponent. Soro Dagostino: To speak to the issue. Micael Khandr: I'm not sure I can speak to it . . . Micael Khandr: but, the general idea is to eliminate requirements for factions in elections. Soro Dagostino: Micael -- you have the floor. Micael Khandr: Gee, thasnks . . . StuiChicanne Darkstone: it was at discussion last week StuiChicanne Darkstone: Go Khandr ! Micael Khandr: I think we discussed this last week, and the reason we are meeting today is to see if the idea of not requiring faction membership for running would be applied to this election Gwyneth Llewelyn: Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Micael Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well Rose Springvale raises hand StuiChicanne Darkstone: that's correct ! Soro Dagostino: Rose Gwyneth Llewelyn *raises hand* after Rose Soro Dagostino: Gwyn next Rose Springvale: At my last count, there were 12 people standing for election this term.. though candidates are not all posted or availble Soro Dagostino: Rose? Rose Springvale: which is highly likely Soro Dagostino: sry, slow keyboard Rose Springvale: the system we have now, unless i can't do math Micael Khandr: Rose, are all membes of a faction? Rose Springvale: says we will elect 11 reps Rose Springvale: but because of the faction system Rose Springvale: we will most likely have reps elected who have not "run"... and some good people who have volunteered to serve CDS will not be elected Rose Springvale: without a faction system, i believe that would be avoided. Rose Springvale: done Cindy Ecksol raises hand Soro Dagostino: Thank you Soro Dagostino: Gwyn? Micael Khandr: And hat is why we want to overturn the requirement for faction membership in order to run . . .thank you. Soro Dagostino: Cindy next in order. Jamie Palisades raises hand and pokes giant question mark thing Jamie Palisades: what about Gwyn? Cindy Ecksol: thanks soro. Pip Torok raises hand Soro Dagostino: Mic next Micael Khandr: You poked me in the head, Jamie . . . Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol Cindy Ecksol: are we using the question mark? Jamie Palisades: oooooops Cindy Ecksol: if so can reset Gwyneth Llewelyn: Please do, Cindy Cindy Ecksol: but that wasn't my question...or comment Micael Khandr: My head . . ? Soro Dagostino: I am sorry, I can't read that divice. Gwyneth Llewelyn: ah perfect Jamie Palisades: well, Micael, it was even riskier when Stui was sitting on it .. Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you Cindy Cindy Ecksol: ok, it's reset.... Soro Dagostino: Please raise hands. Cindy Ecksol: my comment.... Micael Khandr: True . . . Rose Springvale: gwyns turn yes? Cindy Ecksol: I am not opposed to the idea of revising factions Soro Dagostino: Yes Cindy Ecksol: rules Cindy Ecksol: sheesh, I thought I had th efloor? no? Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok hmm... the only thing I really had against the proposed (and detailed) amendment changes last week, Gwyneth Llewelyn: was about the replacements Cindy Ecksol: soro? Soro Dagostino: Cindy, your next Cindy Ecksol: ok, thx. Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie suggested that we do by-elections for them Gwyneth Llewelyn: I totally agree. Gwyneth Llewelyn: So... to recap... I'd be ready to vote on Jamie's proposed amendment, Gwyneth Llewelyn: with the suggestion that replacements are handled (for now at least) with by-elections Soro Dagostino: Gwyn -- are you making a motion to call the question? Gwyneth Llewelyn: and with that, I think we'd have a full proposal which could be a motion Gwyneth Llewelyn: oh ? sorry Sory Gwyneth Llewelyn: *Soro Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes... Arria Perreault: I second Soro Dagostino: Who can state the question? Gwyneth Llewelyn: I would like (with Jamie's permission) to propose Jamie's amendments with the by-election as replacements for the vote Gwyneth Llewelyn: (let me just get the URL for the records...) Cindy Ecksol wonders if we can have full text tplease..... Jamie Palisades: no problem. Are we looking at a motion now to pass it, or a motion now to close debate? Soro Dagostino: We should. Cindy Ecksol and also wonders why we're proposing to close debate with a full queue? Sterling Troughton has indicated consent to be recorded. Soro Dagostino: I have no raised hands. Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe I'll give you your turn, Cindy, because I'll take a bit to copy & paste Cindy Ecksol: you have a full queue soro Rose Springvale: jamie and cindy soro Cindy Ecksol: including me....do I have th efloor? Soro Dagostino: Gwyn do you yield to Cindy Jamie Palisades smiles, keeps hand raises, but after Cin and Pip Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sure, Soro ? I'll take ttime assembkling bits and pieces Gwyneth Llewelyn: (no need to wait for me) Soro Dagostino: Cindy? Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks gwyn Soro Dagostino: Pip next Cindy Ecksol: as I started to say, I'm not opposed to the idea of revising the way that factions are used in CDS. Cindy Ecksol: however, I do not think that we are ready to pass this bill to apply to THIS election. Pip Torok: i suggest the time is past to make any change to the coming elections, but to debate it throughout next term and get it right for the followiuing term Cindy Ecksol: the details are not bullet-proofed, not even close. Pip Torok: done Cindy Ecksol: (not done yet) Cindy Ecksol: so I would like to amend the proposed bill to apply to NEXT election. StuiChicanne Darkstone: *picks up gavel and bangs it a few times* Cindy Ecksol: which will need a second of course. Pip Torok: second Rose Springvale raises hand Cindy Ecksol: that will give us time to work out the details properly so there are no unintended consequences. Soro Dagostino: Motion is seconded. Micael Khandr: Point of clarification: to vote to change the faction rule, but have it take place next election? Is that it, Cindy? Cindy Ecksol: thank you pip. and I am finished. Soro Dagostino: Jamie has the floor Jamie Palisades: thanks Jamie Palisades: If I may, to address Cindy's full text question, i *believe* Gwyn's proposal is to enact the constitutional amendment at http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2630&p=14029#p14029, posted 4 December 2009 - but with "Alternative 2" chosen in Article 1 Section 2 (for STV), and, for clarity, with the following new additional sentence at the end of that same section: Cindy Ecksol: well, truthfully I think tha twe should defer the entire thing to next term. but there seems to be a majority to do it this term, so I would likek to see it apply NEXZT term Jamie Palisades: oops : ) you, ah, not done, Cindy? Cindy Ecksol: I was responding to Micael. Cindy Ecksol: done now, thanks. Micael Khandr: TY Jamie Palisades smiles Jamie Palisades: two things then Soro Dagostino: Discussion on the delay? Gwyneth Llewelyn: (hehe Jamie ? thanks ? yes, that's pretty much it, Alt 2 and the additional text" Jamie Palisades: ,.. um, Soro, CIndy notwithstanding, do I have the floor? Soro Dagostino: Yes. Jamie Palisades: OK then Jamie Palisades: two things Jamie Palisades: first Jamie Palisades: motion clarification Jamie Palisades: see Gwyn & me above Jamie Palisades: but ARt 1 sec 2 needs onbe mnore setence at the end, to be clear that its FIRST sentence Jamie Palisades: also would apply to by-elections Jamie Palisades: thus, to get that done: Jamie Palisades: add: "Vacancies in RA positions will be filled by by-election administered on a schedule set by the Scientific Council consistent with other applicable CDS law. Jamie Palisades: now Jamie Palisades: second point Jamie Palisades: which is (a) do it now? Jamie Palisades: (b) do it now, but to apply starting next term (in 6 months)? Jamie Palisades: (c) leave it for next RA Soro Dagostino: Point of Order. Jamie Palisades: Personally I rather like (a), and it's utterly legal for you to do so. Done thx Jamie Palisades: mm? for me, Soro? Soro Dagostino: I believe Cindy's Motion to by to delay approval to the next term Soro Dagostino: That is the motion before the body. Rose Springvale: so are we discussing that now? Jamie Palisades: .. so we have motion Gwyn seconded Arria, amendment Cindy? OK, who seconded it? And I was just speaking against it Soro Dagostino: That is before us. Rose Springvale reiterates raised hand Cindy Ecksol: actually my motion was to dealy IMPLEMANTTION of whatever we pass to next term, Pip Torok: I seconded Cindy's StuiChicanne Darkstone: shouldn't we be discussing the point more before voting on a motion to defer ? Cindy Ecksol: so an amendment to....whatever it is that jamie said Soro Dagostino: Not how I saw it. Cindy Ecksol: (the actual proposal) Cindy Ecksol: that is what I meant soro Cindy Ecksol: consider this clarification StuiChicanne Darkstone: how do people know what they are deferringif they have not fully discussed it ? Cindy Ecksol: I am proposing to amend the proposal on the table to implement next term Cindy Ecksol: Cindy Ecksol: whatever we decide to pass, stui Pip Torok: the idea is that we discuss it thoroughout the next term Stui ... Micael Khandr: In other words, vote for it, if approved, defer it to next election. Rose Springvale: sigh Keila Forager pinches herself Soro Dagostino: Rose? Jamie Palisades: Soro? ruling? what's the motion to amend? Rose Springvale: waiting for ruling on motion... Soro Dagostino: The chair takes the motion to be one to table. Jamie Palisades flinches - that wasn't YOUR leg Keila. Rose Springvale: okay.... StuiChicanne Darkstone: can I ask soemthing ? Rose Springvale: so do i have the floor? StuiChicanne Darkstone: *something ? Keila Forager: Sorry Soro Dagostino: Rose Keila Forager: hehe Soro Dagostino: That motion is non-debateble. Rose Springvale: thank you. This RA has had some major issues presented to it this term Rose Springvale: and each time, your decision has been well discussed, and often delayed in implementation Rose Springvale: i'll point to the election calendar as an example Rose Springvale: i'm concerned that the new RA will again want to discuss and discuss. Jamie Palisades: hee hee he just told you that you can't speak - but the tabel motion will lose, likely Rose Springvale: i'm concerned that in this experiment, we are so afraid to Try anything Soro Dagostino: Thank you rose. Jamie Palisades: soro? sorry but - are we debating the nondebatable? Rose Springvale: he recognized me twice before i began speaking Soro Dagostino: You are now out of order. Rose Springvale: wonderful, always wanted to be Soro Dagostino: The question is to table. Soro Dagostino: StuiChicanne Darkstone: I want to say something Soro Dagostino: All in favor? StuiChicanne Darkstone: and I'll say it either way Cindy Ecksol: table to next term soro? Micael Khandr: Nay StuiChicanne Darkstone: out of order or not I can still type StuiChicanne Darkstone: Cindy Ecksol: I vote "aye" to that Pip Torok: abstain Rose Springvale: sigh Soro Dagostino: BAngs gavel on Stue's head Cindy Ecksol: (but not sure we really have a motion and second) StuiChicanne Darkstone: I will say that it'd be really stupid to vote now StuiChicanne Darkstone: on account that this meeting was called Jamie Palisades: Try for something less solid, Soro Pip Torok agrees StuiChicanne Darkstone: and I myself said I had no notion of it StuiChicanne Darkstone: and nor did the proponent of this StuiChicanne Darkstone: therefore you are not getting an accurate vote Soro Dagostino: Please -- the motion to table has precedent. Soro Dagostino: We need to get back to the discussion. StuiChicanne Darkstone: I don't care about the precedent StuiChicanne Darkstone: I speak about logic Ariel Feden: can you repeat the motion under vote? Soro Dagostino: Vote please on the motion to table. Gwyneth Llewelyn: nay! StuiChicanne Darkstone: and common sense Micael Khandr: nay Pip Torok: abstain StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think everyone knows my vote StuiChicanne Darkstone: I would like to know Caro's tho StuiChicanne Darkstone: if it's ok with everyone StuiChicanne Darkstone: seeing as she is the proponent StuiChicanne Darkstone: and isn't h Jamie Palisades: ((Arria - vote yes to table = no action. Vote no = maybe action on this item at this meeting)) StuiChicanne Darkstone: here StuiChicanne Darkstone: I wonder how that happened ? Soro Dagostino: Two aye, two nay Jamie Palisades: Think about that next time you pick an LRA, Stui Soro Dagostino: Anyone else Arria Perreault: I can vote StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro Soro Dagostino: Yes. StuiChicanne Darkstone: where is Caro ? Keila Forager: I don't have a vote, but seems like there is way to much procrastination Cindy Ecksol: jamie, that was uncalled for! Caro was the one who volunteered to introduce. I had nothing to do with it. Soro Dagostino: Order please. StuiChicanne Darkstone: can I ask something before I vote ? Rose Springvale: caro may not be a rep next term Rose Springvale: not fair to continue to delay with excuses, you all know she supports it Soro Dagostino: Arria -- your vote? Arria Perreault: nay Soro Dagostino: Stui? StuiChicanne Darkstone: well is caro assumed as a supporter of factionless RA ? Rose Springvale: she is the leader of SEED Soro Dagostino: I would think so. StuiChicanne Darkstone: therefore even in absence her vote can stand ? Rose Springvale: that is their only agenda StuiChicanne Darkstone: as we know how she would vote on this Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe voting by proxy is not allowed in the RA... Gwyneth Llewelyn: not yet at least! StuiChicanne Darkstone: and as she couldn't attend I would pass a motion to have her vote added StuiChicanne Darkstone: we all know what it would be Jamie Palisades: um, sir, aren't we in the middle of finishing a failing (2-3) vote to table? Stui, we can't count her vote if she's not here Gwyneth Llewelyn: I don't think that's constitutional... the SC might have an issue with that, deem the vote irregular, and revert the decision Jamie Palisades: yup Pip Torok agrees with Gwyn StuiChicanne Darkstone: ok Cindy Ecksol notes that this is a procedural vote that would not be subject to 7 day voting anyway Jamie Palisades: Gwyn you and I are agreeing entierly too much. It might affect the weather StuiChicanne Darkstone: I vote NAY ! Jamie Palisades: 2-4 Soro Dagostino: Chair votes nay. Soro Dagostino: Motion carried. StuiChicanne Darkstone: and I'll be the spirit of CAro ! Jamie Palisades: eh? Soro Dagostino: Back to the main motion as amended Rose Springvale: faild i think Micael Khandr: not carried Sonja Strom votes nay Pip Torok: nay Soro Dagostino: Sorry, yes -- Motion to table failed. Ariel Feden: lol - phew Micael Khandr: I suggest two motions: The first, all the things Jamie and Gwyn wrote earlier, and for this election. If that passes, we are off and running. If not, I propose the same thing, but deferred until next election. Rose Springvale: please restate what you are voting on Countdown Timer V3.0: only the owner can use this object Countdown Timer V3.0: only the owner can use this object Gwyneth Llewelyn: clever, Micael hehe Soro Dagostino: The proposal was logged above. Soro Dagostino: Jamie would you restate? Jamie Palisades: sure Jamie Palisades: four points Jamie Palisades: 1. main body of text here: Gwyneth Llewelyn does apologise, but copying "orange" and "bold" from the forums into a notecard is not fast! Jamie Palisades: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2630&p=14029#p14029 Jamie Palisades: with the orange text being DELETED Jamie Palisades: and the NEW text - the amendment itself - being BOLD Jamie Palisades: as the post shows the WHOLE constitution Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* Jamie Palisades: but the proposed action is on the amends and deletes Jamie Palisades: 2. One selection of an alternative Jamie Palisades: in art 1 sec 2 Jamie Palisades: "Alt 2" Jamie Palisades: which uses STV, a system a bit more friendly to minority voters Jamie Palisades: 3. One added setence Jamie Palisades: at end of art 1 sec 2 Jamie Palisades: "Vacancies in RA positions will be filled by by-election administered on a schedule set by the Scientific Council consistent with other applicable CDS law." Jamie Palisades: 4. I note that, at present, this would take effect immediately. Jamie Palisades: done thanks Rose Springvale: for people who are new here, we usually have this on notecard... apologies Soro Dagostino: Point of Order . . . Jamie Palisades raises eyebrow? Soro Dagostino: The amendment is to have it take effect next term. Rose Springvale: that was voted down Soro Dagostino: Or to be immediate? Soro Dagostino: Not to my recall. The motion to table was voted down. Cindy Ecksol raises hand because cannot get to ? Soro Dagostino: There was a friendly amendment to vote now, take effect the next following term. Rose Springvale sits on hands ... Soro Dagostino: Cindy Gwyneth Llewelyn: To my recall, we haven't voted on the amendment to have this enter in effect in 6 months ? but we can do that Jamie Palisades: is it? Sorry, did not hear that raised. Resctfully disagree with th chair. Gwyn moved mmediate. You turned Cindy's amendment into a tabling motion. No other amendments offerede. Main motion is up now. It was Micael's suggestion that you proceed to a vote. Gwyneth Llewelyn: I moved immediate, yes. We can vote to amend it not to be immediate. Cindy Ecksol: ah, gwyn said what I was going to say: I made a motioj (seconded by pip) that we amend the proposal to take effect next term Rose Springvale agrees with jamie and gwyn Micael Khandr: Yes Rose Springvale and blames them for the ice on my palm trees Cindy Ecksol: believe that is still on the table Jamie Palisades: Maybe Cindy should offer her *second* delay proposal now, afresh, as an amendment? Unless someone moves to close debate Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl Rose Arria Perreault: I hope it s too Soro Dagostino: Is there such a Motion? StuiChicanne Darkstone: YAY for factionless RA ! Cindy Ecksol: ok, for the record I propose that we amend the current bill to take effect immediately followiing the election Micael Khandr: I think it would serve our decision making better if we voted to see if we wanted to do it now, rather than pre-empt that vote by saying next term first. Micael Khandr: So our motion is to do it now? Soro Dagostino: Yes Rose Springvale: yay!! Micael Khandr: for this election? Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes. Jamie Palisades: (not if cindy gets a second) Soro Dagostino: Yes StuiChicanne Darkstone: do it now Soro Dagostino: True Micael Khandr: Call the vote Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, like Jamie said. Cindy Ecksol: wait! Cindy Ecksol: out of order, soro! Gwyneth Llewelyn: Cindy GOT a second btw. Cindy Ecksol: my amendment was seconded by pip! Gwyneth Llewelyn: It was. Pip Torok: right Cindy Ecksol: need to vote on it before voting on the whold thing Jamie Palisades: the table one, or the next term one? OK, then vote on it Gwyneth Llewelyn: So we have to vote on Cindys amendment Cindy Ecksol: either we will amend...and then pass for next term Micael Khandr: Would you withdraw your second, Pip? Rose Springvale: she could withdraw StuiChicanne Darkstone: *talks to pippet quietly* Cindy Ecksol: or amendment will fail, and we will vote for this term Pip Torok: no Micael Khandr: OK Soro Dagostino: Order please. StuiChicanne Darkstone: *bats eyelids* Pip Torok: ah ... then i withdraw second Soro Dagostino: The amendment dies? Cindy Ecksol: then I withdraw my amendment Micael Khandr: Whew . . thanks Cindy Ecksol: for lack of a second Soro Dagostino: Now to the main motion. Cindy Ecksol: (you will not thank me six months from now micael ) Micael Khandr: call the vote Jeroma Wycliffe practices batting his eyelids Soro Dagostino: The question has been called. StuiChicanne Darkstone: yay for batting eyelids Rose Springvale will hold lessons after meeting. its 'fluttering" you southern belles Soro Dagostino: The vote is to adopt for immediate effect. Cindy Ecksol: (voting to do this NOW will violate existing constitution) Rose Springvale: it amends, not violates. Cindy Ecksol: both Pip Torok agrees that micael will not thank Cindy in 6 monthe Cindy Ecksol: you can't interrupt a process that is already in process.... Rose Springvale: discussion over, question called Jamie Palisades: all changes to a constitution violate the old one, by definition Soro Dagostino: Call the vote . . Cindy Ecksol: and change the rules of the game Micael Khandr: I tend to give thanks liberally . . . Soro Dagostino: All in favor? Micael Khandr: Aye Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles @ Jamie. We've been there before... Cindy Ecksol: nay Gwyneth Llewelyn: and aye Pip Torok: nay StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE AYE CAPT SORO Sonja Strom: nay Cindy Ecksol notes that we need a supermajority.... Micael Khandr: We are all super, Cindy . . . StuiChicanne Darkstone: *holds up a caro puppet* Micael Khandr: Ha! Jamie Palisades: no need, STui, we have rules for absent members StuiChicanne Darkstone: I miss Caro StuiChicanne Darkstone: she's like me Jamie Palisades: I miss orderly meeting Soro Dagostino: Chair votes aye. Arria Perreault: nay Soro Dagostino: the motion fails. Micael Khandr: I move that Jamie and Gwyn?s previous motion go into effect for the next election. StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soro Dagostino: Is there a second? Pip Torok: "next election"? Micael Khandr: The one after the one coming up Pip Torok: motion is unclear! Gwyneth Llewelyn: well, I second that, Micael... I thought that motion was on the table already. Yes, let's amend it to "into effect in 6 months" Arria Perreault: in JUly Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, July Micael Khandr: TY Micael Khandr: July it is! Soro Dagostino: Do I have a Second? Gwyneth Llewelyn points to her own words Gwyneth Llewelyn: Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, you do, Mr Pro Tem LRA Micael Khandr: Gwyn has seconded Jamie Palisades: If you want to go there, suggest that the effective date be one day before the census date of the second general election in 2010. Soro Dagostino: Oh, Gwyn did . . . Soro Dagostino: Is that amendment accepted? Gwyneth Llewelyn proposes to add Jamie's suggestion to the motion as a friendly amendment Micael Khandr: Yes Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good Soro Dagostino: Ready for the question? Micael Khandr: Yes Soro Dagostino: All in favor? Micael Khandr: aye Cindy Ecksol: nay Sonja Strom: nay Pip Torok: nay StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE AYE AYE AYE Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye Arria Perreault: do we vote on the motion now? Soro Dagostino: Yes Jamie Palisades: eh? I thought that was the second Khandr motion Arria Perreault: nay Soro Dagostino: Jamie? Jamie Palisades: which, with four votes, would fail as Constl Amdts require 8. Am I on wrong page here? Soro Dagostino: My understanding -- is that this vote is to change the constitution effective now, and setting the time for operation at the day before the next census? Micael Khandr: Correct Jamie Palisades: Yes - and would require less than 4 nay votes to pass Cindy Ecksol: what??? Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye, well, unless amended... 6 months is a lot of time. And I believe Jamie is correct Pip Torok doesnt agree with Jamie Cindy Ecksol is now not sure what she voted on... Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Rose Springvale: because now we have true faction action. i'm sure the people represented by those nay votes will be happy, i just dont' know who they are Soro Dagostino: Ok, Chair rules a revote is in order. Gwyneth Llewelyn: 1) We voted on the constitution amendment to remove factions. No "time limit" has been set, so it becomes law as soon as the SC ratifies it (e.g. "immediately") Gwyneth Llewelyn: Then 2) We voted on the same constitutional amendment, but entering into effect on the July 2010 elections. Gwyneth Llewelyn: That also failed. Gwyneth Llewelyn: Is that right? Soro Dagostino: I don't believe all knew what the question before the body was. Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oops Micael Khandr: and the firendly amendment was to have it go into effect after the current election, correct? Sonja Strom: Gwyneth, that is my understanding. Soro Dagostino: Yes. Micael Khandr: friendly . . Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, the constitution itself would have been changed immediately (after teh SC ratifies it). It would only affect the July 2010 elections though. Micael Khandr: That is it, then! Micael Khandr: Perhaps a re-vote, just to clarify what it is? Arria Perreault: yesss Arria Perreault: please tell clearly about what we vote Soro Dagostino: That is what the Chiar has ruled. Rose Springvale: smiles. remember that the factions here represent, if anyone, less than 1/3 of the CDS population when you vote Arria Perreault: write the texte Arria Perreault: yes, thank you Soro Arria Perreault: it's so in RL, Rose Micael Khandr: Does Jamie or Gwyn have a cut-and-pasted version? Arria Perreault: and nobody sais it is undemocratic Rose Springvale: not wher i live, and we are supposed to be doing better here Soro Dagostino: The text is as was posted by Jamie -- with the amendment to have the new law take effect the day before the July election Census. Gwyneth Llewelyn: I wish I did, Micael ? but it's not easy to change the bold/orange text into curly braces and bracketed braces to have it on a notecard Sonja Strom thinks "members" and "represented" are two different things. Micael Khandr: Yes, sorry . . . Jamie Palisades: I do say it is undemocratic, Arria Just for the record. Many timers Cindy Ecksol: sorry, soro, I idid not understand that.... Cindy Ecksol: thought we were still voting on "this term" Rose Springvale: i think it is self preservation and manipulation, but Rose wouldn't say anything so strong Soro Dagostino: No. Micael Khandr: OK, so I call for (another) vote. Cindy Ecksol: *sigh* Gwyneth Llewelyn notices that Sonja is quite right hehe ? but we digress, we could discuss if the RA also represents people that haven't voted on the previous elections (e.g. abstentions) or not... nice philosophical discussion Jamie Palisades: Soro - you just ruled *something*? Like Cindy, I missed it Kamilah Hauptmann prefers the Star Chamber approach to governance. Cindy Ecksol: OOOOOKKKKKKKK..... Gwyneth Llewelyn grins @ Kamilah Soro Dagostino: Order please Cindy Ecksol: can we have the vote called clearly please? and vote clearly? Arria Perreault: I propose that we vote about the proposal of Jamie, that would comes in force in July 2010 for the next election and with a replacement of leaving RA members with by-election Micael Khandr: "this term" failed, Cindy Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, I second Arria's motion. I believe there is no problem in calling the same motion twice Arria Perreault: ty Soro Dagostino: Not per my ruling. Jamie Palisades: hm. Arria, maybe Gwyneth can check that, but I believe that IS the same motion in substance as the one that Michael was proposing, now that we are clear. not a problem, just a clarification Micael Khandr: Yes Arria Perreault: Soro has said we revote Soro Dagostino: Are you ready to vote? Cindy Ecksol: call the vote soro Soro Dagostino: Everyone have it in mind? Arria Perreault: I am proposing something clear to vote Jamie Palisades nods Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, Jamie,it's pretty much the same motion. But, as said, I don't think there is anything forbidding that Micael Khandr: Ouch Sonja Strom: So, to clarify, an "aye" vote woud be in favour of changing the constitution... (?) Jamie Palisades: yes, but effective next term Soro Dagostino: Yes. Cindy Ecksol: specifically day before census. Arria Perreault: and by-election? Jamie Palisades: yes Cindy Ecksol: what's this about "by election"? Soro Dagostino: That is my understanding. Jamie Palisades: (the sentence i added, CIn, earlier this meeting) Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah, CIndy ? it's how members are replaced Arria Perreault: Gwyn's first motion Soro Dagostino: She wasn't here then. Arria Perreault: that passed Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, see my mumbling and grumbling last session. With a faction-less system, how do you make sure that the citizen's votes are preserved when a member leaves? Soro Dagostino: As an amendment -- friendly Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie proposed, quite simply, that we get by-elections Gwyneth Llewelyn: just for that single chair Gwyneth Llewelyn: it worked well in the past, so, well, why not Jamie Palisades: all clear? Y'all gonna vote? Gwyneth Llewelyn is clear and happy to vote Soro Dagostino: Call for votes Micael Khandr: clear! Soro Dagostino: All in favor. Micael Khandr: AYE! Keila Forager will start singing soon ...lalallalalalallalalalala Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye Sonja Strom: nay StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE ! Arria Perreault: aye StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE ! StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE ! Rose Springvale: stui lol Jamie Palisades: dd 16 Jamie Palisades: dd 0 Jamie Palisades: dd 24 Jamie Palisades: dd 16 Jamie Palisades: dd 32 Arria Perreault: your vote counts only once Jamie Palisades: dd 24 Cindy Ecksol: aye Pip Torok: aye Keila Forager: Spamming Jamie...lol Soro Dagostino: Chair votes aye Gwyneth Llewelyn: he's interfering with the vote )))) Gwyneth Llewelyn *chuckles* Micael Khandr: 6-1? Soro Dagostino: 7 ayes, 2 nays Micael Khandr: 7-2! Micael Khandr: StuiChicanne Darkstone: YAY ! Soro Dagostino: Motion carries. Rose Springvale: wait Rose Springvale: do we need 8? Cindy Ecksol: is 7 enough for constituional amendment? Keila Forager: LOL Cindy Ecksol: think we need 8 Pip Torok: 2 nays? i saw only 1 Gwyneth Llewelyn: We do need 2/3 of 11 Gwyneth Llewelyn: and I just say one nay too Jamie Palisades: That's why there are 7 day votes, ladies and gentlemen Micael Khandr: I think only 1 nay Keila Forager: I say aye Keila Forager: hehe Pip Torok: soro ... its one nay imho Jamie Palisades: May I rise to a point of order? StuiChicanne Darkstone: *pokes people for Aye's* Soro Dagostino: The Chair will first say that he was in error -- there was only one nay. Soro Dagostino: Jamie? Jamie Palisades: Soro, to know the next steps here, it would be helpful to have a ruling or statement on two things Arria Perreault: I think we have tried enough on this topic Jamie Palisades: 1. Do 7 day votes not apply? (I assume so and thus that Caro can get her vote in) Rose Springvale: joaquin at least as he started the meeting Micael Khandr: appl or not apply? StuiChicanne Darkstone: CARO ! CARO ! Arria Perreault: has someone asked for a 7-day vote? Jamie Palisades: 2. Does the 2/3rds rule in the constitution count all membrs, or just present members? ( I read it as the latter for textual reasons I could discuss.) Soro Dagostino: The Chair is will to allow those as 7 day votes -- we did fail to issue notice. Arria Perreault: this is the question Jamie Palisades: OK, that's one ruling, thanks. Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie, yes, they do, but we have to ask first which members have indeed requested for 7-day votes. StuiChicanne Darkstone: Caro didn't know about the meeting therefore she couldn't ask for 7 day vote Pip Torok agrees with Stu Gwyneth Llewelyn: And jamie, the 2/3 is of ALL members. Constitutional changes are important StuiChicanne Darkstone: likewise I didn't know about the meeting until I IM'd Micael Micael Khandr: I affirm Soro's call. Gwyneth Llewelyn: How didn't she know about the meeting? Jamie Palisades: Gwyn, my take on that is that the chair is within his power - as I would if I were LRA - to let NONNOTICED members register their vote. RA can overrule him of course Gwyneth Llewelyn: Wait StuiChicanne Darkstone: because it wasn't communicated as per usual Gwyneth Llewelyn: aaah Pip Torok: there was no notice of this meeting gwyn Gwyneth Llewelyn: So this is an irregular meeting? hehe StuiChicanne Darkstone: oui Micael Khandr: Very much . . . Jamie Palisades: If LRA post meeting notices and agendas , well, OK so I'd say, let Soro;s ruling stand Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh my. StuiChicanne Darkstone: had it been communicated I would have been here on time Jamie Palisades: but hey, move to overrule him if you disagree StuiChicanne Darkstone: I was late Rose Springvale: ijoaquin; is in concert and has said he wants 7 day Gwyneth Llewelyn: I thought we had agreed on the date on the last meeting... StuiChicanne Darkstone: because I wondered why so many RA members were online Micael Khandr: Joaquin was here at the beginning of the meeting . . . StuiChicanne Darkstone: ah but Gwyneth the last meetnig was such an uproar that no one knew what was going on at the end Gwyneth Llewelyn: Rose, I'm afraid that either a) people who wish to have a 7-day vote will need to inform the LRA as per the usual procedures; or b) we'll have to vote on allowing those since allegedly this meeting is irregular Keila Forager: I didn't know about it either Pip Torok: we had agreed gwyn but it still wasnt notified and the transcript hadnt been published Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe Stui ? like all meetings ,) Arria Perreault: are we trying all looking how to get the missing votes to get the aye? Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok Gwyneth Llewelyn: This should make the next SC meeting very fun Rose Springvale: we are trying to make sure the constitution is amended or not based on the will of the people. Soro Dagostino: Joaquin has just made his request for a 7 day vote -- granted. Micael Khandr: Yes Kamilah Hauptmann: Meeting appears to be planned to keep key people from voting. *laughing behind hand* Jamie Palisades: Personally I can't say strionbgly enough that notices and postings are essential in a democratic system, not to mention a virtual one, but maybe that's just me Gwyn, to stay on the topic of my point of order, Soro has ruled that they may have 7 days votes. Move to overturn him - or - live with it Gwyneth Llewelyn: Nah, Arria. I'll suggest that we go by the book. We ask Cindy if she had any requests for 7-day votes. If so, they will be allowed to vote. If not, we'll let the SC sort it out. And yes, that's a motion to stop discussing this, let teh SC do their work, and move on to the next point (if at all) Soro Dagostino: That is the chair's ruling. Cindy Ecksol: ok, kids...mea culpa on this one. I was thinking it was next week, that's whI didny Cindy Ecksol: didn't send notices, etc as usual Rose Springvale: also transcript was posted mid week StuiChicanne Darkstone: if you want I could pretend I'm not here Cindy Ecksol: I did not have any requests for 7 day. Cindy Ecksol: yes...again because I was thinking meeting was next week... Gwyneth Llewelyn: I'm sorry, Jamie, but I don't recognise the Pro Tem LRA's ability to overrule the constitution on this Jamie Palisades: i asked for a second ruling, if no one's going to try to overrule the first one. Soro Dagostino: I just did. Cindy Ecksol: StuiChicanne Darkstone: because had I not been online and wondering why so many RA members were on StuiChicanne Darkstone: I wouldn't be here either Cindy Ecksol: and we can all second if we like.... Gwyneth Llewelyn: So it's the other way round, the LRA has to move a motion to change the law Jamie Palisades chuckles. Gwyn! MOVE to overrule him then ") Gwyneth Llewelyn: No, Jamie, Micael Khandr: Does Joquin's request for 7-day stand, as he had to leave for a scheduled cioncert? Gwyneth Llewelyn: HE has to move to change the law Micael Khandr: concert Cindy Ecksol: move that we allow 7 day votes from all memebers fo rthis meeting Micael Khandr: second Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, thanks Cindy StuiChicanne Darkstone: YAY FOR CARO ! Micael Khandr: I said second--clearly . . . Keila Forager: that is only fair Soro Dagostino: The motion is in order. Micael Khandr: Did I mentioned that I seconded that . . . Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles @ Micael Jamie Palisades sits on his other point of order, waitingfor the first to resolve Keila Forager: or it seems you are more concerned with rules than the citizens StuiChicanne Darkstone: it's only fair that if a meeting is called and it is not communicated by the usual method that those not present be asked if they would like 7 day votes Soro Dagostino: Those who seek to speak, please raise your hand. Soro Dagostino: There is a motion pending/ StuiChicanne Darkstone: otherwise they are not able to represent the people Micael Khandr: Raises hand Soro Dagostino: Mic you have the floor. StuiChicanne Darkstone: *raises both hands* Soro Dagostino: Micael? Micael Khandr: TY, Soro--simple point: lots of confusion here about whether or not there was a meeting--some people were absent. This seems like a good reason for an exception to the way 7-day votes are usually done. Thank you Cindy for the motion, I support it. Micael Khandr: Done Gwyneth Llewelyn *raises hand* Soro Dagostino: Stui? Soro Dagostino: You have the floor. Soro Dagostino: Gwyn next Soro Dagostino: Stui? StuiChicanne Darkstone: [9:11] StuiChicanne Darkstone: Micael Khandr ! [9:11] Khandr: Stui! Are you coming to the RA? [9:11] Darkstone: oh when is it ? [9:11] Khandr: Now . . . [9:11] Darkstone: *LOL* [9:11] Darkstone: no one told me [9:12] Khandr: It si the one we decided we wanted last week as an extra one to talk factions--but Cindy isn't here, and I don't think there was an announcement. [9:12] Darkstone: ah ha StuiChicanne Darkstone: just to clarify my lack of knowledge with documentary evidence Pip Torok: Arria Perreault: Stui, you asked for this meeting StuiChicanne Darkstone: thankyou Mr One for Soro StuiChicanne Darkstone: I did Sonja Strom: lol StuiChicanne Darkstone: but I did not realise we agreed to it Gwyneth Llewelyn: LOL Rose Springvale: we often plan meetings and change the times when peole have gone to look at calendars. NO one put it on the calendar StuiChicanne Darkstone: owing to the rather chaotic nature of the end of the meeting Jamie Palisades: any chance of a vote on the 7 day motion? Arria Perreault: we have set it at the last meeting and you did insist a lot Micael Khandr: call the question StuiChicanne Darkstone: plus I never said I was not human and capable of a mistake or oversight Arria Perreault: A LOT StuiChicanne Darkstone: of which this is one Arria Perreault: I am sure everyone can read this in the transcript Micael Khandr: You are not human? Rose Springvale: loves this ... you are afraid of the rest of the RA? StuiChicanne Darkstone: I did insist Soro Dagostino: Bangs Gavel StuiChicanne Darkstone: Rose Springvale: its a constitutional question you voted in favor of! Micael Khandr: Sorry . . . StuiChicanne Darkstone: admittedly Arria Perreault: yes, you did and we gave you reason Soro Dagostino: There has been a call of the question. Pip Torok: move to vote (please/:) Soro Dagostino: All in favor? Micael Khandr: second Micael Khandr: Aye Pip Torok: aye StuiChicanne Darkstone: I don't debate that I insisted - I say that I was not sure that the meeting was effectively upheld Gwyneth Llewelyn didn't have a chance to talk, but ok, I'll vote "aye" StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye ! Micael Khandr: Oh, sorry Gwyn . . . Arria Perreault: abstains Gwyneth Llewelyn: (it was just a technicality anyway, Micael) Soro Dagostino: Sonja? Cindy Ecksol: aye Soro Dagostino: Chair votes aye. Soro Dagostino: Any opposed? Sonja Strom: I'm sorry, I am not sure what the question is. Soro Dagostino: To permit 7 day votes Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sonja: [11:15] Cindy Ecksol: move that we allow 7 day votes from all memebers fo rthis meeting Sonja Strom: for this one meeting? Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, for this one. Sonja Strom: I vote aye Soro Dagostino: Motion carries. Micael Khandr: Thank you, Soro Soro Dagostino: Is there a motion to adjourn? Pip Torok: so move Gwyneth Llewelyn: seconds Micael Khandr: By any chance, is this the last RA meeting of this term . . ? Pip Torok: it is mic Jamie Palisades: unless one is called Soro Dagostino: I think so. Jamie Palisades shudders Micael Khandr: aye Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe Gwyneth Llewelyn: and hopefully, *properly* called Soro Dagostino: All in favor of adournment? Gwyneth Llewelyn will love to see what the SC will make out of this Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye on adjournment Pip Torok: aye Micael Khandr: aye yi yae Arria Perreault: aye Soro Dagostino: Chair votes aye. Soro Dagostino: Meeting adjourned. Sonja Strom: aye Rose Springvale: Thank you to the RA Sonja Strom: Thanks everybody! Rose Springvale: it has been a strange term, but your service is appreciated! Gwyneth Llewelyn grins Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Rose! Jamie Palisades smiles. Thank you to all for your service this term. I request notice of any appeals to the SC of today's actions. Just so we're all clear. The next RA can do whatever it likes. And I will post to the forums, on whatever I find out about election admin issues, if the SC doesn't. Rose Springvale: i'm serious! Gwyneth Llewelyn: Do you mean, stranger than usual? StuiChicanne Darkstone: Strange is me Micael Khandr: Thanks to Soro and to Cindy Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers* Cindy Ecksol: don't you mean "no thanks to soro and cindy?" Cindy Ecksol: lol! Gwyneth Llewelyn: pfft StuiChicanne Darkstone: *bangs gavel StuiChicanne Darkstone: *bangs gavel* Rose Springvale: see you all at the meet and greet next week, if you have time constraints .. please let me know, i'll schedule something as friendly as we can get otherwise Arria Perreault: Thank you for the Executive Team for the work that has been done, even it was strange Jamie Palisades: No, CIndy, we try to be grateful for everyone's contributions in a volunteer organization. Keila Forager: What meet and greet?? Arria Perreault: sometimes Sonja Strom: Rose, when will that be? Jamie Palisades chuckles Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl Arria ? yes, indeed, we should have voted on official thanks to the Exec this year! Gwyneth Llewelyn: *ter, Gwyneth Llewelyn: *term Micael Khandr: Adios, all--I want to see what RL looks like today . . . Keila Forager: Anyone who volunteers get my thanks )) Gwyneth Llewelyn: Cold, I bet, Micael StuiChicanne Darkstone: cold in Britain Keila Forager: And in Texas Gwyneth Llewelyn is freezing more inside her home than outside Gwyneth Llewelyn: StuiChicanne Darkstone: we are disappearing under snow Arria Perreault: Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol at the toilet paper!!!!! Gwyneth Llewelyn: that is soooo cool! Gwyneth Llewelyn just has a tomato launcher Tor Karlsvalt: -12c in chicago Gwyneth Llewelyn: brrr Tor Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you Kamilah ))) Rose Springvale: kami lol please come to all our meetings! Arria Perreault: so SEED will exists only 6 months ? Rose Springvale: no Rose Springvale: seed is a faction now Gwyneth Llewelyn: No no Arria ? factions were not abolished! Arria Perreault: I Know StuiChicanne Darkstone: SEED * ! Gwyneth Llewelyn: Rose Springvale: seed self abolishes when it s mission is accomplishe Arria Perreault: it was presented as a faction against factions Gwyneth Llewelyn: Heh. Rose Springvale: it has 7 candidates for this term Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well, that's popular on all serious democracies.... e.g. Anarchist Parties and the like Rose Springvale: all who should be elected. Rose Springvale: because they are all GREAT candidates Jamie Palisades: Good luck with your Arosa project, Sonja. Those posters are gorgeous. Keila Forager: You're biased rose, but right Arria Perreault: we wait for the list Gwyneth Llewelyn: and have good fashion sense too Rose Springvale: list has been delivered to the SC Keila Forager: Arosa is right next door to me too Jamie Jamie Palisades: Rose and I have not has as good luck with promotional art contributions as Arosa has Jamie Palisades: It's good to have creative volunteers .. Soro Dagostino: See you all, RL calls. Jamie Palisades chuckles Rose Springvale: but they are Stui, Caro, Joaquin,Soro, Keila, Lilith, Sterling Jamie Palisades: Thanks again Soro Keila Forager: Bye Soro Arria Perreault: bye Soro Gwyneth Llewelyn: thanks for chairing today, Soro Soro Dagostino: Now to extract all the arrows. Soro Dagostino: Soro Dagostino: Bye all! Gwyneth Llewelyn: ah well Gwyneth Llewelyn: Perhaps what most people don't realise, Gwyneth Llewelyn: is that we all at the CDS disagree a lot with each other, Gwyneth Llewelyn: which is GOOD in a democracy Gwyneth Llewelyn: ... and we're still here to tell the story Keila Forager: Yes, but so is change ) Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes! Kamilah Hauptmann: Still favorable to a dictatorship, speaking as a dictator. Jamie Palisades: still here - people forget what a rarity in SL a 5 year institution is Gwyneth Llewelyn: Kamilah Gwyneth Llewelyn: You're right, Jamie! Gwyneth Llewelyn: We do have something special and precious, even if it's small.... Keila Forager: Very true Jamie Palisades: Kami, we will never know, until the day Des retires or goes Ulrika on us Gwyneth Llewelyn: In fact, the interesting thing is that popular bloggers have stopped to announce the premature death of the CDS Jamie Palisades: or packs up for Blue Moon, of course Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha Jamie Gwyneth Llewelyn: Riiight Jamie Palisades: heh heh Gwyneth Llewelyn: that's more likely to happen The meeting closed at 11:39 Linden time.

Permalink.

RA Meeting 3 January 2010: Transcript
by Cindy Ecksol » Wed Jan 06, 2010 1:07 pm
Meeting on 2010-01-03
Those present:
Cindy Ecksol is in the chair.
Cindy Ecksol: agenda is in the amphora as usual….with an extra item as a result of yesterday’s SC meeting
Cindy Ecksol: so take a look while we have time
Pip Torok:
Joaquin Gustav: happy new year all
Cindy Ecksol: happy new year joa!
Micael Khandr: Happy New Year!
Pip Torok: and to you Micael!
Rose Springvale: HI everyone. sorry, finishing ims here
Pip Torok: and to you Joaquin
Pip Torok: hi Rose
Micael Khandr has indicated consent to be recorded.
Pip Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Micael Khandr: Just me
Micael Khandr: TY
Pip Torok: hi Soro /… Happy New Year
Rose Springvale: in im micael lol
Rose Springvale: brb
Micael Khandr: Thanks for the IM–I didn’t want to feel left out . . .
Pip Torok: brb
Soro Dagostino: Hello all — Happy New Year.
Cindy Ecksol: hello!
Cindy Ecksol: and happy new year.
Cindy Ecksol: please touch the recorder to indicate consent
Soro Dagostino has indicated consent to be recorded.
Joaquin Gustav has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: and agenda is in the amphora
Arria Perreault: Hi everybody
Soro Dagostino: brb — warming my coffeee
Cindy Ecksol checks to make sure her coffee is hot
Sonja Strom: hello everybody
Pip Torok: hi Sonja
Micael Khandr: brb . . looking for black tar heroin . . .
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Cindy Ecksol: still waiting for a few….
Cindy Ecksol: please take a look at the agenda while we are waiting — new item there and a link to the relevant posting from the SC meeting yesterday
Cindy Ecksol: gwyn and caro are on their way so we’ll wait for them and then get started
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hi all :=
Cindy Ecksol: hi gwyn, caro…
Joaquin Gustav: hello
Cindy Ecksol: agenda in the amphora, please touch the recorder and we’ll get started
Carolyn Saarinen: Salaam aleikum
Carolyn Saarinen has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn waits patiently for the recorcer to rez
Cindy Ecksol:
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah… found it
Cindy Ecksol: not too bad this morning thank goodness….
Pip Torok: hi Gwyn, caro
Cindy Ecksol: all right…agenda….
Rose Springvale: morning Sterling
Sterling Troughton: morning
Cindy Ecksol: you’ll notice that I’ve added an item under “new business” at the request of SC
Cindy Ecksol: not sure it’s necessary for RA to vote, but they’ve asked us to do so anyway.
Cindy Ecksol: if no objections I’d like to take that one on right after reports
Cindy Ecksol: or maybe before reports if Jamie and Stui are late
Cindy Ecksol waits to hear objectsion or any other modifications to agenda
Soro Dagostino: Move approval
Cindy Ecksol: second?
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds.
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor?
Pip Torok: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Micael Khandr: aye
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Cindy Ecksol: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn goes to get some hot coffee, give me just a second (and apologies in advance hehe )
Cindy Ecksol: any opposed?
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Cindy Ecksol: ok, great…
Cindy Ecksol: moment….checking for 7 day votes
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and back, I’m very sorry !)
Cindy Ecksol: ok, no requested 7 day votes.
Cindy Ecksol: I see that jamie is not here, nor stui, so with your permission….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (permission granted! haha )
Cindy Ecksol: would like to discuss new bsiness
Cindy Ecksol:
Cindy Ecksol: has everyone lhad a chance to check the link?
Pip Torok: not yet
Rose Springvale: hi stui
Cindy Ecksol: ok, please do so now…..
Cindy Ecksol: ah, stui!
Carolyn Saarinen: which link Cindy?
Cindy Ecksol: on the agenda notecard Caro….under new businesss
Pip Torok: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2630#p14029 )
Cindy Ecksol: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2579#p14087
Cindy Ecksol: there we go…
Micael Khandr: Question, Cindy. How is this new business related to the old business of changing the faction rule?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: There’s no need to stand up the Queen has arrived !
Cindy Ecksol: it’s not Micael….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: evening !
Carolyn Saarinen: thanks
Cindy Ecksol: Stui, we temporarily skipped your Commerce Commission report, but will come backk to it after this item
Micael Khandr: So we could affirm what SC wants, and still change the faction rule?
Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles and waves at Stui
StuiChicanne Darkstone has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol: whoops…lost Soro
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I think so, Micael…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (or rather, I actually hope so!)
Micael Khandr: For this comig election?
Micael Khandr: coming
Pip Torok: have we a total number of voting citizens?
Cindy Ecksol: ah….well, that would be controversial.
Micael Khandr: Really? Sounds attractive . .
Carolyn Saarinen: We must have if Faction size has been set
Cindy Ecksol: wel,m let’s do this first…then discuss the faction amendment, ok?
Micael Khandr: OK
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds our LRA on the correct order of discussing things
StuiChicanne Darkstone: don’t anyone light the torches or the christmas brussel sprouts will sent me into orbit
Pip Torok: lol
Micael Khandr: Anyone have a match?
Cindy Ecksol: ok, so the essence is that SC has proposed to move the faction cert and candidate cert deadlines to next week, leaving the campaign at the same lenght and election date unchanged
Cindy Ecksol: any discussion?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hmm
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: technically, it’s always the RA that sets dates, and the SC validates them…
Gwyneth Llewelyn shuts up and hears Rose first
Soro Dagostino: Sorry, SL decided to toss me.
Rose Springvale: no, you have priority, i’m just in line for after RA
Cindy Ecksol: ok, gwyn, you have the floor
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh, it’s just a trifle really. For all the reasons that we know and them so, I actually welcome the suggestion to move the elections to the suggested date,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and I definitely move a motion to approve the new dates (after discussion)
Pip Torok notes that the SC made it a _suggestion_ …
Cindy Ecksol: thanks.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And yes, I’m aware that this in no way will interfere with the rest of discussion thanks. And sorry Rose! (Happy new Year btw lol )
StuiChicanne Darkstone: HAPPY STU YEAR !
Cindy Ecksol: we’ll need asecond to Gwyn’s motion too…anyone?
Pip Torok: second
Cindy Ecksol: thanks
Cindy Ecksol: any other thoughts/comments before I recognize rose?
Cindy Ecksol: ok, rose you have the floor
Rose Springvale: Thank you. Despite the language in the post regarding proper census information, i’d just like to point out that the citizen census is determined with respect to the election date
Rose Springvale: so that my reading changes the census to the people owning land in CDS as of i believe, december 27
Cindy Ecksol: hmmmm…..
Cindy Ecksol: good point.
Rose Springvale: so that while i don’t think it will make a significant difference, the numbers will change somewhat
Rose Springvale: perhaps 3 or 4 more citizens.
Cindy Ecksol: SC certified the census at 121.
Cindy Ecksol: 3 or 4 more would not change faction size…
Cindy Ecksol: but would change who can vote potentially.
Cindy Ecksol: oh…wait….
Gwyneth Llewelyn wonders if we ought to have an emergency census…
Rose Springvale: unfortunately, no transcript was posted so it’s impossible for those of us not able to attend meetings on such short notice, or any of the AA peopel who got no notice, to see what the rationale was
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Cindy Ecksol: well, transcript was taken….not sure why not posted.
Cindy Ecksol: I was there, but this particular issue was not brought up.
Pip Torok didnt know the time of the SC meeting
Rose Springvale: just saying, if you are going to change constitutional requirements, adequate notice and reporting would seem appropriate
Cindy Ecksol: I believe the thought was that all dates were relative to the start of the new term, so since the new term date had not changed, no need to change any other dates
Soro Dagostino: I didn’t either — but it was in the header of the note.
Rose Springvale: again, only posted to CDS.
Carolyn Saarinen: propose we execute the SC for counter-revolutionary thouight!
Cindy Ecksol: yes!
Cindy Ecksol: uh…no….
Cindy Ecksol: never mind….
Carolyn Saarinen: too late!
Rose Springvale: i have a guillotine…
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Micael Khandr: requires a second . .
Cindy Ecksol: are you seconding, micael?
Micael Khandr: No, I’m non-violent
Carolyn Saarinen: c’mon you know you want to
Cindy Ecksol: oh, good….
Cindy Ecksol: all right, back to business….
Gwyneth Llewelyn is so sorry to have missed that
Cindy Ecksol: I’m thinking that we can approve change of faction cert and candidate cert and then go back to SC and ask for clarification on residency status
Carolyn Saarinen mutters never get anything useful passed here
Cindy Ecksol: any other thoughts?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: well if it makes everyone feel better… I was supervising making soup in RL… and only just averted disaster of the most crisped up turkey I have ever seen in my life… I didn’t know you could make turkey look like bacon
Gwyneth Llewelyn: LOL
Micael Khandr: Thanks for sharing, Stui . . .
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Pip Torok: HA!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Anyway, I personally second Cindy’s thoughts.
Cindy Ecksol: AND….back to business….are we ready to vote on this?
Cindy Ecksol: I need a motion to conclude discussion…..hint hint
Micael Khandr: Call the vote
Cindy Ecksol: second?
Carolyn Saarinen: so moved
Soro Dagostino: Stiu, sprinkle it wiith garlic and spread it on toast.
Cindy Ecksol: thank you .
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor of moving cert dates for factions and candidates to Jan 8 and election start to Jan 23 say “aye”
Carolyn Saarinen: Or, Stui, put it in a pot with tomatoes, that renders anything edible
Cindy Ecksol: opposed say “nay”
Pip Torok: aye
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Micael Khandr: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Cindy Ecksol: aye
Cindy Ecksol: and arria?
Arria Perreault: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: There
Cindy Ecksol: ok, motion carries unanimously.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: woot
Cindy Ecksol: I will bring the question of voter eligiblity back to Aliasi
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Okies.
Cindy Ecksol: hopefully we can clear that up before next Friday
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hopefully
Cindy Ecksol: moving on….stui, do you have a report on Commerce Commission?
Cindy Ecksol pokes stui with a turkey drumstick
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am afraid due to holiday scheduling and putting stuffing into once living hand puppets we have not had progress but this is 2010 and Rosy and I shall be having a tete a tete for a schedule to be confirmed
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’m super efficient now
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks….
Cindy Ecksol: ok, old business.
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Pip Torok says hello to the new up-to-date model!
Cindy Ecksol: we had tabled discussion of the faction eleimination amendment last time….
Cindy Ecksol: so we’re in “discussion” phase.
Micael Khandr: If I may . . .
Cindy Ecksol: sure, micael….
Micael Khandr: The fact that there has been trouble getting enrollment to qualify more than two factions is an indication that the “people” do not want factions as presently organized.
Micael Khandr: I think we should eliminate them now–for this coming election.
Micael Khandr: Done
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Pip Torok
Cindy Ecksol: Pip, you have the floor
Cindy Ecksol: Pip?
Pip Torok: i believe the the apathy is just that … apathey and has no connection to the existence of factions … those who care have always known that we are faction-based and not “mp” based
Pip Torok: done
Cindy Ecksol: thanks.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Patroklus Murakami
Cindy Ecksol: Pat, you have a comment?
Micael Khandr: I care . .
Micael Khandr:
Patroklus Murakami: my comment is similar to pip’s. i think that it indicates the lack of interest in being on the RA rather than a faction problem per se
Patroklus Murakami: i think the question of whehter ppl wnat factions or not should be tested by the ballot box
Carolyn Saarinen sniggers
Patroklus Murakami: let an ‘anti-faction faction’ stand and see if that’s what ppl want
Patroklus Murakami: that’s all
Cindy Ecksol: thanks….
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *sigh*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I sort of did a few comments on this subject…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: And well, I’ve promised a certain member at teh RA, who shall remain unnamed,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: that I would give some thoughts about it ? about not only the incoming elections,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: but what Pip so correctly alluded: a certain “apathy” coming from a few of the citizens,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: which makes them less engaging in teh CDS ? in its community; in its political live
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So… you know that I’ve been a keen defender of the faction system
Gwyneth Llewelyn: For one practical reason,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I still think that people ought to vote on ideas, projects
Gwyneth Llewelyn: … because people come and go
Pip Torok: one way out wd be to notecard each factionless citizen inviting them to join _some_ faction
Gwyneth Llewelyn: it’s very rare, for instance, that we get a full quorum on the RA,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: in spite of being less than a dozen!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The faction system was created,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: taking this into account,
Carolyn Saarinen: quorum oOR full? not the same thing?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and assuming that if you vote for an idea,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (full)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: the idea is carried along, even if a “person” that you happen to like on the faction is not there,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: this has been what I’ve been defending… since 2004.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: BUT…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Things change
Pip Torok wonders in what way it has changed
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie has commented (perhaps rightfully so) that citizens see the “factions” as a way to “power struggle”
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I might claim otherwise; factions struggle to *exist* these days hehe )
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But what the citizens perceive can also be important ? remember Caeser’s wife
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The proposed change,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: would not “eliminate” factions,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: in the sense of making them illegal or something
Gwyneth Llewelyn: we will still have the right to assemble
Micael Khandr: True
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The CSDF, for instance, will still meet
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and publish a manifesto
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and list their candidaes
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and hold open sessions and so on
Gwyneth Llewelyn: but…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: others, who now feel threatened by the faction system,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: or plainly dislike it
Gwyneth Llewelyn: would be allowed to become candidates on their own.
Carolyn Saarinen puts on ThinkPol titile
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Micael Khandr: Cough
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So… this is teh positive aspect of the change.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It will allow whoever prefers to vote/be elected by a “faction” ? to continue to do so.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: It will at the same time,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: allow those that dislike factions,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: to both be elected and vote on individuals as well.
Micael Khandr: Well spoken.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Now I just ahve ONE problem…
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and then I promise to shut up!)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What happens if the person we voted for,
Cindy Ecksol extends the clock for gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: after, say, a month,
Pip Torok wonders how many actively dislike the idea of factions
Gwyneth Llewelyn: is forced to leave?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: if we can answer that question, I’ll be happy to let this proposed change pass.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks gwyn
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Micael Khandr
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Right now, we do have a question: “the next in place in the faction list will replace; if there aren’t any left, new elections”
Micael Khandr: How do you mean “forced”?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We need an easy, obvioous method to do the same
Gwyneth Llewelyn: for single candidates
Cindy Ecksol: finished, gwyn?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: without giving teh citizens this idea that their vote is “lost” or placed on someone else they dislike.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, I’m finoshed, and I do apologise.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks….
Cindy Ecksol: micael, you have the floor
Micael Khandr: Actually, my comments were already articulated by Gwyen.
Micael Khandr: So I’m OK
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks….
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: StuiChicanne Darkstone
Cindy Ecksol: stui?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Factions lead to a gang mentality and are surely a source of restriction of individual independent thought and opinion and I am sure there are none of us here present that are incapable of holding our own opinions surely ? We can work together without specifying a division or a collective view, I rather believe that this is a more progressive thought (think of Blake and his attitude towards collective worship and think of the value of your own personal thought) I for one could not be accused of towing a party line. why would anyone else care to ?
Cindy Ecksol: whew!!
Cindy Ecksol: that was quick…
Micael Khandr: Tell us how you really feel, Stui . . .
StuiChicanne Darkstone:
Gwyneth Llewelyn feels embarassed after Stui’s condensed answer…
Cindy Ecksol: finished stui?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am not often accused of being shy
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am Cindy and I take a bow
Cindy Ecksol: thanks….
Carolyn Saarinen: Hey preparation is good
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Pip Torok finds that food for thought
StuiChicanne Darkstone: (no sneaking a look at my posterior plz_
Rose Springvale: thanks, can you skip me for a moment, dealing with rl.
Cindy Ecksol: ok…
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Keila Forager
Cindy Ecksol: keila?
Keila Forager: Hi, thanks
Keila Forager: As a relatively new citizen, I don’t really think that it’s as much apathy for not having more citizens join factions as it is lack of information..
Keila Forager: I had one person approach me when I became a citizen..
Keila Forager: about factions
Keila Forager: and to find the information on my own was a struggle and I only perserved because I wan’ted to know what was going on in CDS..
Carolyn Saarinen: sounds familiar
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sounds scary!)
Keila Forager: As for factions, just what I was reading, I’m inclined to not join one as they pretty much all say the same thing and if I have to vote for a faction as opposed to a person , I probably won’t..
Keila Forager: I don’t vote parties in RL and would be opposed to it here..
Carolyn Saarinen: again, deja vu
Micael Khandr: Clap, clap
Keila Forager: how many citizens really come to meetings and understand??
Cindy Ecksol smiles
Cindy Ecksol: I could ask the same question in RL
Keila Forager: and notice for all meetings events , isn’t really enough time to make plans…
Keila Forager: done..or we will be here until next meeting…I seem to have lots to say
Keila Forager smiles
Micael Khandr: TY Keila
Cindy Ecksol: thanks keila
Cindy Ecksol: rose are you back with us?
Rose Springvale: yes
Rose Springvale: one sec
Rose Springvale: ok
Carolyn Saarinen: just hit the kid!
Rose Springvale: First i take issue that 2/3 of our citizens as apathetic? i don’t think so. our citizens are passionate and involved.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol !
Micael Khandr: Or put in tomato sauce . . .
Cindy Ecksol raises her eyebrows
Rose Springvale: Factions are fractious. My experiences is that they are ineffective.. representatives don’t necessarily follow the philosophy, nor do they ‘represent’
So it becomes a system that maintains the status quo. RA is hard to learn, people don’t understand
Rose Springvale: philosophy and projects ARE a good basis for organizing into voting blocks, but the faction system actually discourages this… i may agree with the CSDF on one issue, and DPU on another, if i’m a rep, i should be following the wishes of my faction! not my philosophy
Pip Torok wonders whether nonfactions are less fractious
Rose Springvale: as for replacements.. the next in line in the list.. eliminate faction and you have your replacement policy…. the lost vote/placed on someone they dislike issue is what we have now!
Micael Khandr: Well spoken, Rose
Rose Springvale: i dont’ think having an election to elect an unfaction makes sense
Rose Springvale: just more division
Rose Springvale: and does what we have our biggest problem with… stalls a decision
Rose Springvale: I encourage you to be bold
Rose Springvale: done
Rose Springvale: give ALL our citizens a voice.
Micael Khandr: clap, clap
Keila Forager: Yes
Cindy Ecksol: thanks, rose.
Cindy Ecksol: ./100 next
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Cindy Ecksol
Cindy Ecksol: ah…that’s me
Gwyneth Llewelyn *chuckles*
Cindy Ecksol: and I DO have some things to say about this even though I’ve said little to this pointe
Cindy Ecksol: first, I agree with those who have pointed out that we are in the midst of an apathetic revolution, not a disklike of factions
Cindy Ecksol: Kelia pointed out that we do not encourage faction membership…
Cindy Ecksol: that we do not publish meetings inadvance….
Cindy Ecksol: and that most people dont’ show up for meetings or get involved with the forums
Cindy Ecksol: I agree: it’s about apathy, not about dislike of factions.
Cindy Ecksol: So I don’t see the faction system as broken per se….
Cindy Ecksol: merely underutilized
Cindy Ecksol: having said that, I also agree with Rose: all too often factions have been a force for creating contention and delaying decisions
Cindy Ecksol: I don’t like that….but I think it’ smore related to apathy than to a failure of the sytem.
Cindy Ecksol: Third, I do not think that our current system is iappropriate for the “real world”….but as Gwyn pointed out, given the fact that we are living “second lives” here, not our “real lives” I think it may be an appropriate system for THIS community
Cindy Ecksol: specifically I think she’s right about the fact that it deals most effectively with the question of how we keep RA seats active
Cindy Ecksol: Finally, Rose challenged us to be “bold”
Cindy Ecksol: b ut there ISZ such a thing as “too bold”…and we call that “reckless”
Cindy Ecksol: it OUGHT to take a long time to change the constitution….and this is really only the second time we have discussed this issue in any coordinated community fashion
Cindy Ecksol: I would also point out that there’s another way to be “bold” in this situation.
Jamie Palisades: Bravely do nothing?
Cindy Ecksol: as Pat proposed, perhaps it is Boldest for us to allow the people to speak.
Cindy Ecksol: no, Jamie.
Cindy Ecksol: that’s not what it’s about.
Cindy Ecksol: there are many who believe that “the people” want this amendment
Keila Forager: Are you sure you want us speaking…LOL
Cindy Ecksol: but I don’t see 121 residents in this room….nor involved in discussions about it.
Carolyn Saarinen: Nor will you
Cindy Ecksol: no, I don’t think I will Caro….
Keila Forager: Because most don’t know about the meetings..
Cindy Ecksol: but they SHOULD have a voice….
Cindy Ecksol: that voice is the election.
Rose Springvale: then delay this election, which you have done already, which btw changes the constitution, and take a referendum.
Cindy Ecksol: those who are interested in this amendment now have the opport5unity to appeal to the population.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Apathy if it is there, and can be seen to be in existence, is often as a silent protest and as a result of lacking relevance within a political system or community. Also Apathy can be worsened by being acknowledged as it becomes almost like a contagious trend, “why should I bother if the rest are not?” if we are to recognise a state of apathy then we would be best advised to make changes to see if we can affect a reinvigoration, rather than simply making an excuse of its source and using it as a provocation to continue as we have previously. Interest is engendered by freshness not staleness, if we so treasure the stale environment, are we going to spring clean this year or learn to love the cobwebs? Laziness is not apathy, fear of change is not apathy, but being completely disinterested in the merits of action, that is apathy.
Carolyn Saarinen: ‘Representative’ Assembly. clue’s in the name
Cindy Ecksol: get out there, form a faction, create a platform, and solicit votes
Cindy Ecksol: that’s what “democracy” is all about — it’s “activist” not “pacifist.”
Cindy Ecksol: get out ther and campaign for what you believe in.
Cindy Ecksol: the RA is not the proper place to argue this out….elections are.
Cindy Ecksol: finished.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Pip Torok
Cindy Ecksol: Pip?
Pip Torok: a word for thre faction system … speaking personally i find that an RA’s impulse to forwrd rash proposals can be checked by second opinions from colleagues in the faction ….
Pip Torok: done
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue:
Cindy Ecksol: Gwyn? briefly, please
Gwyneth Llewelyn: or quickly lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I just wish to add that it’s not fair to assume that factions are more “disruptive” than individuals. At least if you have 3 factions on the RA; you have 3 different points of view, and that means you just need to reconcile three different visions. Once we get 11 individuals, we have 11 points of view to reconcile, and the struggle will be WAY harder, not easier Thus, decisions will take WAY longer to reach, not less time. But… personally, I’m willing to give the proposed system a try, since I might be completely wrong in my perceptions. The second point, however, is far more important for me to clarify. Rose, you said, “if someone leaves the RA, we just put the next in line”. How is that a guarantee that the representatives elected are actually the will of the people who voted on them. By this I mean that people that did NOT get enough votes (e.g. not ‘liked’ enough by the citizens to actually become reps) might be catapulted into the RA ? against the *vast majority* of the votes,
Sonja Strom: lol!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: since the vast majority, well, will have elected the original RA members, not the “replacements”. Such a system, which allows people to become representative even though nobody voted (enough) on them, cannot be called a representative democracy.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (Just remember that the entity that represents citizens at the RA right now is the abstract notion of a “faction”, which can summarised as “a group of people sharing the same ideas”)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Now, there are methods to deal with this. One, as suggested, is that every citizen will vote on “replacements” as well ? at the ballot, they’d vote, say, for 2 candidates for each of the 11 seats.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But as you see, we still have a few things to sort out first,
Cindy Ecksol nods in agreement
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and I don’t think we should just blindly pass this resolution
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and get the next elections right now with the new system
Gwyneth Llewelyn: without asking the people first!
Sterling Troughton: We could try an auction
Keila Forager: LOL
Cindy Ecksol smiles
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So I’ll certainly move to add that question (change of system to Jamie’s proposed model) as a referendum on the upcoming elections. Done, thanks!
Rose Springvale: i’ll respons when it’s my turn
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Gwyneth Llewelyn
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Carolyn Saarinen: with STV, I don’t see how a second choice could be wholly at odds with voter’s thinking?
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie?
Jamie Palisades: Thanks for taking up this proposal. Which obviously I support. I see that the LRA has time limits this morning – for most people, so I’ll try to be briefer that usual. If you know me, you know that’s a personal challange for me
Jamie Palisades: Three things, and a suggestion.
Jamie Palisades: First, i think we neeed in fairness to ackowledge the rationality of the old system! The original designers wanted an experiment in democracy. But they wanted to use the party-centric model. That was NOT irrational, or stupid. It’s just proved to be a model that does not work well for US. More on that in a moment.
Jamie Palisades: Second, I respectfully disagree with a few RA members here who said that dislike of factions is not a drag on governance participation.
Jamie Palisades: I guess some current RA members might not feel that way – um, because they come from factions
Jamie Palisades: but
Jamie Palisades: (a) Keila just said so, as a newcomer.
Jamie Palisades: (b) So have others who are NOT here at the RA — for obvious reasons. I hear from lots of nonpolitical CDS people who look at our system and opt out — note — not from apathy, but from distaste at the current factious system, which, yes, is fed by factionalization and football club mentality.
Jamie Palisades: look,
Jamie Palisades: I could spin out a list, here, of good constructive people, who left more or less in disgust, but it would be impolite, and in fact, many of you KNOW them already.
Jamie Palisades: evidence #1 for factions not working well for us:
Jamie Palisades: Consider that we had few candidates — and barely had factions! — this year.
Pip Torok is unhappy about hints of partiality
Jamie Palisades: colleguages, face it, your citizens mostly are boycotting the whole system.
Jamie Palisades: pip, if you can explain when I am donem, i will try to respons, and apologize if there’s spomethign I sad that is wrong, but I thikn it;s natural that peopel who were SEATED by any faction system would start out assuming it;s a good system.
Pip Torok: boycotting? or just apathetic? who can actually say?
Callipygian Christensen murmurs that along with those who leave are those who come and observe and don’t bother joining
Jamie Palisades: I leave, Pip, it to you all whether there are people who would participate in a system that was less baroque. That IS the question. I note we have four current RA members who did not come up through the faction system — and might NOT have.
Cindy Ecksol notes that there are those who just don’t like the rough and tumble of politics period…
Carolyn Saarinen NOT seated by a faction system. See the difference?
Jamie Palisades: when it;s unnecessarily rough, yers which factions induce
Jamie Palisades: ahem
Jamie Palisades: let me get that last point out
Gwyneth Llewelyn notes that there are so many who dislike democracy in general, but love our lovely events
Jamie Palisades: Finally, on replacing members. We have HAD by-elections; they worked fine; I remember because I had to moderate the mid-term candidate debate trhat year
Carolyn Saarinen: ‘Our lovely events’ are organised by AA’s Sultana
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Gwyneth Llewelyn would vote for her
Cindy Ecksol would also vote for Rose
Micael Khandr: Is Rose running . . . ?
Jamie Palisades: Ladies & Gents & er, Gywn on your point – you think ANY meetings drive away participation, and see nothing in the faction system that does. With respect, I think faction leaders are not in the best vantage point to see distaste for it. But please, look at the numbers. this term
Carolyn Saarinen: Jihad!
Jamie Palisades: we almost had
Jamie Palisades: no factions
Jamie Palisades: and no candidates
Jamie Palisades: this shouold tell an open minded person something.
Jamie Palisades: Thankis, and done.
Cindy Ecksol scratches her head and wonders if what it shoudl “tell us” is that the SC needs to get its act together certifying the population list by the deadline
Jamie Palisades: heh – naah, not a jihad, just AA’s option to leave again in a few months.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Miss LRA, can I just ask Jamie a question?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (it’s pertinent)
Carolyn Saarinen: AA used to have very productive town meetings
Jamie Palisades: Hopefully without scimitars
Cindy Ecksol: ok, gwyn, I’ll allow it…
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and that’s why I’m not against the change; rather, I actually endorse it; just a clarification: are you suggesting that every RA member replacement becomes a by-election? (note: I think it’s a good idea!)
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie if you will permit?
Carolyn Saarinen: then we joined this…system
Cindy Ecksol: I’ll leave you on the floor….
Jamie Palisades: sure, Cindy
Cindy Ecksol: um…not exactly, but you understand
Cindy Ecksol: go ahead
Free Radar HUD v1.1 by Crystal Gadgets
Gwyneth Llewelyn repeats: just a clarification: are you suggesting that every RA member replacement becomes a by-election, since it worked fine in the past? (note: I think it’s a good idea!)
Micael Khandr: Cough, cough . . .
Keila Forager: I think that’s a great idea
Jamie Palisades: Gwyn, I think that would be the outcome of the current draft, anD yes,m I thikn it would work.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: All righty! Thanks… because that might be the only objection I had, to be honest…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Now, keeping my mind open, I don’t have any *rational* reason left lol
Jamie Palisades: (If the RA did something later to adjust it like, don;t bother filling terms within a month f the elections, well, fine, but that’s the sort of thing with which we fiddle)TED TO DO SOMETHING WITH SHORT V
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (lots of emotional ones, though! haha )
Jamie Palisades: (sorry, bad keyboard day) SO what’s the irrational reason?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I sort of pointed it out… unlike Rose, I think we’ll have a totally fragmented RA which will be unmanageable,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: 11 points of view to reconcile instead of just 3
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But
Soro Dagostino: Sorry I missed the convo — bad reboot.
Rose Springvale raise hands
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s just speculation
Gwyneth Llewelyn: not a valid, rational reason
Jamie Palisades: Unlike today’s RA, or, say, 2007’s? I thought we decided we were ALL socialists 3 meetings ago I could sing the Internationale
Cindy Ecksol: all right…let’s see
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So I won’t let it interfere ))
Cindy Ecksol: Rose, question for Jamie? I’ll let him keep the floor if so….
Rose Springvale: no comment independent
Cindy Ecksol: ok…then please wait for the queue
Jamie Palisades: Done then, thx
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Patroklus Murakami
Cindy Ecksol: pat?
Rose Springvale: seems like the que doesnt’ apply to everyone
Patroklus Murakami: i’ll pass, i was going to rant about how jamie’s explanation of political apathy is entirely wrong but…. i’ll save it for another day!
Soro Dagostino: It won’t let me talk.
Soro Dagostino: The Que.
Cindy Ecksol: so done pat?
Patroklus Murakami: done
Jamie Palisades: you, me, the pub, after the meeting
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Cindy Ecksol: if so stui I think you’re next
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I have already spoken thusly but I think it warrants the indulgence of repetition so indulge me, tis the season for over-indulgence: Apathy if it is there, and can be seen to be in existence, is often as a silent protest and as a result of lacking relevance within a political system or community. Also Apathy can be worsened by being acknowledged as it becomes almost like a contagious trend, “why should I bother if the rest are not?” if we are to recognise a state of apathy then we would be best advised to make changes to see if we can affect a reinvigoration, rather than simply making an excuse of its source and using it as a provocation to continue as we have previously. Interest is engendered by freshness not staleness, if we so treasure the stale environment, are we going to spring clean this year or learn to love the cobwebs? Laziness is not apathy, fear of change is not apathy, but being completely disinterested in the merits of action, that is apathy. BUT AS A NEW OBSERVATION:
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: StuiChicanne Darkstone
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think that there is a presently unremarked aread of this discussion
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I definitely agree that the true measure of “apathy” is not allowing things to change at all in search of a solution to apathy ? that is, in a way, one of the primary, rational reasons for agreeing with experimenting with a different model)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: along the lines of if there is an issue completely unrepresented by a factions manifesto but that is close to the heart of the participant citizen… how is he or she to be heard except by allowance of their owning faction ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: done
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I could clarify my meaning
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but I don’t think it needs to be quite so blunt
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks
StuiChicanne Darkstone: actually I’m gonna hang my hat on it
Cindy Ecksol: three mor ein the queu, and then I think we need to move on.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Keila Forager
Cindy Ecksol: keila?
Keila Forager: A comment about “apathy”. How can it be apathy if the people don’t have the information or have it in a timely manner. That’s just unimformed, not apathy. I’ve read the forums , and portal and have come to meetings. I have only a couple friends in my list from CDS and aside from them, no one has approached me about CDS except for them. They know who they are. How do new citizen’s know about things if someone doesn’t tell them. I knew about the democracy and forums and factions from the time I spent here before becoming a citizen. And I have spent much more time than I should have looking for the information and some is not available or correct , but that is another discussion.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and say think of a gay conservative on thatcher’s bench
Keila Forager: And lastly ( for now ..hehe)…..if RA members have to be part of a faction to be elected, and the majority of citizens are not part of a faction. Who does the RA represent? The factions or or the citizens? To me it sounds like the RA is representing the factions or themselves. How many of you go out and speak to the residents about the issues and their opinions. Unless I speak to one of you, I am the one usually expressing my opinion. That makes me sad..especially since I like living here.
Pip Torok: Fair point, Stui, iyo is it covered by “Citizens’ Concerns” in an agenda?
Keila Forager: that’s it for now..
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if they want to come at the end of every meeting yes Pip I believe it could be
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hear, hear, Keila
Micael Khandr: clap, clap
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but not exactly satisfactory a solution is it ?
Cindy Ecksol applauds keila
Jamie Palisades smiles.
Gwyneth Llewelyn blames herself for not doing more to keep citizens like Keila informed
Jamie Palisades: Remember when you clap what that tells you about factions
Keila Forager: I can be a pain in the ass when I want to be..LOL
Keila Forager: or a pain in the RA..LOL
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha ? join our faction then
Cindy Ecksol smiles
Gwyneth Llewelyn: we’re certified pains in the asses to everybody
Keila Forager: Read up to my opinion on factions..
Cindy Ecksol: jamie, tells me that factions have been apathetic, not doing the job they should be
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Cindy Ecksol: oh my!
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Cindy Ecksol: thanks keila….
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Micael Khandr
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thanks indeed
Pip Torok: Isn’t ANY RA’s primary responsibility to represent _every_ resident of CDS?
Cindy Ecksol: Micael?
Micael Khandr: Thanks, Cindy.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (technically, yes, Pip!)
Keila Forager: Yes, Pip, but I don’t see that happening.
Carolyn Saarinen knew that was a smart party invite
Keila Forager:
Micael Khandr: With respect for all of you, I wanted to restate my point.
Jamie Palisades: iuf they talk to anyone outside their faction, yes
Micael Khandr: Unless every decision is brought to a vote of the people, then the RA is here to make decisions on their behalf, after being elected to do so.
People do what they do (as in RL), and elect us to protect the common good in a community (hopefully, like RL as well).
Faction policy ?forces? those of us who do not like factions to work in them?and we have a right to not work in them (without having to create a ?factionless faction?). From my vantage point and perspective, it is oppressive to force me into a faction in order to participate.
Done.
Cindy Ecksol: thanks micael
Micael Khandr: Done
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Rose Springvale
Cindy Ecksol: Rose?
Keila Forager: Do you vote within your faction or how you want?
Cindy Ecksol: (and then we need to move on)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (depends on the faction, Keila)
Rose Springvale: thanks,(and wonders why soro didn’t get qued)
Cindy Ecksol: (he didn’t want to be)
Rose Springvale: Stui’s point is the only reason i ever joined a faction. if you were not in one, your issues never made it to the floor.
Pip Torok: Me.. I vote how I want after a faction’s colleagues 2nd opinion
Rose Springvale: no one is asking to outlaw factions. if they work for you, great.. they will continue and as a group, continue to elect reps. but for the 80+ people who are not factioned… there is a problem. thye joined a democracy. don’t you see there to be some irony there? those who don’t like politics DON”T join CDS!
Rose Springvale: please pip
Rose Springvale: replacements..okay, by elections work, but right now we send the question to factions, (who at best represent a third of our voters,) where 10% or less of our population makes the decision. keep a list of candidates, take the next in line.. maybe so long as they got 10%
Rose Springvale: it truly upsets me to hear you call our citizens apathetic. I know so many things people want to do, care about passionately
Patroklus Murakami wonders what percentage of the population are members of political parties in RL…
Rose Springvale: and they neve seem to get a forum, because frankly, we are working on rules all the time
Micael Khandr: clap, clap
Cindy Ecksol: finished rose?
Carolyn Saarinen: Damn straight
Rose Springvale: i’ll stop. but will note soro said the queue wouldn’t recognize him
Cindy Ecksol: I spoke to soro…he does not wish to queue
Rose Springvale: ok.
Soro Dagostino: Gave up
Rose Springvale: more back room conversations. would like to see this as open forum
Cindy Ecksol: Soro, have you cahnged your mind?
Cindy Ecksol: if so, now’s the time….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I hate queuing but I still have to do it
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Eurodisney would be a farce otherwise
Cindy Ecksol: FYI, since soro was having trouble I offered to queue him after Rose)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: mickey mouse would be a bouncer
Cindy Ecksol: go ahead soro, you have the floor
Soro Dagostino: Still can’t get in.
Cindy Ecksol: rose was going to be last, but you are now in….
Soro Dagostino: Ok.
Soro Dagostino: I believe that we should make a rule that if a citizen does not vote, they are banned from CDS
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Soro ))
Gwyneth Llewelyn *shakes head*
Rose Springvale: then we need to have an objectors line on th ballot
Patroklus Murakami: /facepalm
Soro Dagostino: That everyone should vote.
Keila Forager: Then you won’t have many left in CDS..LOL
StuiChicanne Darkstone: so CDS becomes a place where you have to log in weekly despite RL committments ?
Soro Dagostino: And factions should be parties.
Sterling Troughton: The USSR got 99%
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers* at the turn of events…
Soro Dagostino: And anyone with 10 nominations ought to be able to rune.
Gwyneth Llewelyn is almost, almost going Godwin here…
Cindy Ecksol: done soro?
Soro Dagostino: yes
Micael Khandr: Call the vote, please.
Cindy Ecksol: if so, I need a motion to end debate….and a second
Soro Dagostino: so move
Micael Khandr: second
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds
Cindy Ecksol: I see several queued with discussion?
Cindy Ecksol: do we conclude debate or continue, that’s the question
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ah… right
Gwyneth Llewelyn: sorry, I didn’t see the queue
Micael Khandr: Conclude debate–
Cindy Ecksol: ok, all in favor of concluding debate please say “aye”
Jamie Palisades: you have a motion to decide that quetsion and can vote on it …
Cindy Ecksol: all opposed “nay”
Micael Khandr: aye
Soro Dagostino: aye
Sonja Strom: nay
Gwyneth Llewelyn: nay (simce there are 3 people on the queue)
Pip Torok: nay
Cindy Ecksol: nay
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if I abstain will I still be an RA member ?
Cindy Ecksol: yes, stui, you may abstain
Jamie Palisades: only if you join a faction
StuiChicanne Darkstone: or will I be propelled into the metaverse at the earliest opportunity ?
Carolyn Saarinen: aye
Rose Springvale: beheaded
Jamie Palisades: oo we need a machine like that, CIn
Keila Forager: Yes, it’s good
StuiChicanne Darkstone: EJECTOR SEAT !
Cindy Ecksol: ok, arria? joa?
Carolyn Saarinen: ELECTOR SEAT
Cindy Ecksol: right now 3-3-1
Micael Khandr: Wow . . .
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I saw 4 nays
Gwyneth Llewelyn: [10:40] Sonja Strom: nay
[10:40] Llewelyn: nay (simce there are 3 people on the queue)
[10:40] Torok: nay
[10:40] Ecksol: nay
Cindy Ecksol: did I miss one?
Cindy Ecksol: ah, ok….
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Micael Khandr: Yes–there are 4 nays
Cindy Ecksol: I’m going to allow discussion to continue then.
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Jamie Palisades
Cindy Ecksol: Jamie?
Micael Khandr: Agreed
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I could be awkward and turn my A to a aye *LOL*
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but I wouldn’t be that mischievous
StuiChicanne Darkstone: would I ?
Cindy Ecksol: (wouldn’t matter, stui — motion would still fail)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: you would haha
Jamie Palisades: right. i want to apologize for being a part of the problem here by bringing this idea late in the term.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: *smirks*
Jamie Palisades: i suspect its timing is part of the issue
Jamie Palisades: still, i felt i need to offer it while I was around and able to do so.
Soro Dagostino: Hmmmmmm ???
Jamie Palisades: however and whenever CDS decides to take it up,
Jamie Palisades: Let me echo Michel and Rose’s very important last point. In CDS non-faction-joiners — the majority of our residents! — are POWERLESS. They can’t even select RA members (factions can freely substitute anyone, even morons or mean people, for the named candidates). It is a CLUB system. Many of its current leaders are nice people. But the MODEL is exclusionary. It should go.
Jamie Palisades: Thanks cheers
Cindy Ecksol: thanks
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Soro Dagostino
Jamie Palisades: Soro, I;m active this term, just donlt kjnow about next one
Cindy Ecksol: Soro? did you have another comment?
Soro Dagostino: I agree with Jamie
Keila Forager: Me too
Micael Khandr: me three
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Cindy Ecksol: now now, friends…
Patroklus Murakami: it would be simpler just to reduce the number of ppl needed to form a faction to one
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Sonja Strom
Cindy Ecksol: Sonja?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I’ll be a moron next term and break with being serious as I always am
Patroklus Murakami: then they wouldn’t be a club
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (good point, Pat )
Sonja Strom: What is being talked about here would be a fundamental change to the structure of the CDS electoral system.
Jamie Palisades: and any individual would be able to freely substittue a mad dgo for himself?
Soro Dagostino: Great!
Sonja Strom: Although there are aspects of this change I do not like so much,
Sonja Strom: it might be a good idea,
Jamie Palisades: (sorry)
Sonja Strom: and I am taking this change into careful consideration.
Sonja Strom: I have paid close attention to the views of everyone here about it,
Sonja Strom: which I want everybody to know for certain.
Carolyn Saarinen: yes Sonja
Sonja Strom: In theory could support this change in an overall sense,
Sonja Strom: but I am not ready to support putting it into place for the elections this month.
Sonja Strom: I would, however,
Sonja Strom: support putting a question about this change on the ballot this month as a referendum question.
Sonja Strom: Thank you.
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Cindy Ecksol: thanks
Pip Torok agrees
Question Queue V 1.1: Next in queue: Cindy Ecksol
Cindy Ecksol: OK, that’s me
Cindy Ecksol: I’d just like to say that I too am not completely opposed to changing the system.
Cindy Ecksol: I just don’t think that today is the day to do it.
Cindy Ecksol: let’s use the election process to discuss it….and introduce it early next term
Pip Torok supports Cindy in this
Cindy Ecksol: to facilitate that, can I get a motion to suspend discussion?
Rose Springvale: sigh
Pip Torok: so move
Cindy Ecksol: second?
Jamie Palisades: is that a do-a-referendum vote, cindy? or an indefinite table?
Rose Springvale: of course. self preservation over the good of the community?
Cindy Ecksol: only a “sense of the RA” vote jamie…
Rose Springvale: delay the election then, don’t let this continue
Cindy Ecksol: is there a second to suspend?
Keila Forager: What don’t you send out IM’s or notecards to the citizens and see what they think??
Jamie Palisades: with the effect that the topic is shut down if you vote aye, correct?
Cindy Ecksol: (we still have to decide whether to meet again befor eelection)
Micael Khandr: Where I come from in RL there is an individual who undermines the common good by getting referendums on the ballot?doing away with certain taxes that support education, etc.
Referendums are not what we are about?a ?representative? assembly is.
We need to do our work as representativers.
Done
StuiChicanne Darkstone: am I right in thinking we’d have to suffer factions for another full term?
Cindy Ecksol: yes, stui…if we suspend today and do not vote next time.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: or would we have to rely upon the dissolution of the RA being voted thru ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and then everything being re-elected
Cindy Ecksol: or if we vote today but odify the proposal to apply next election
StuiChicanne Darkstone: seems a long winded approach
Cindy Ecksol: as I commented earlier, there IS such a thing as too much haste
Micael Khandr: You have no second to suspend.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: can we not schedule extra meetings ?
Cindy Ecksol: no, no second…
Jamie Palisades smiles. Ladies and Gentlemen, you do hot have the votes to pass the motion today. Especially with Cindy switching . You might try to see if you can agree on whether to put it on the ballot as referenda
StuiChicanne Darkstone: rather than delay
StuiChicanne Darkstone: be proactve
Cindy Ecksol: a motion to terminate discussion?
Rose Springvale: but then, what would the faction want? have they been polled?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I pass a motion to schedule more meetings
StuiChicanne Darkstone: to discuss this
Cindy Ecksol: (we’re really short on time)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’d second that, Stui!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: more meetings
Cindy Ecksol: one thing at a time…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe yes
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I want more meetings
Cindy Ecksol: if you want to have another meeting, we’ll deal with that next
Cindy Ecksol: right now I need Pp’s motion withdrawn….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it relates directly
Cindy Ecksol: and a motion to terminate THIS discussion on amendment
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we can hold more meetings and resolve it this way
Pip Torok: i withdraw the motion
Cindy Ecksol: stui, if you believe that then move to suspend discussion NOW and then when that’s approved you can move to schedule another meeting
StuiChicanne Darkstone: everyone up for more meetings ?
Carolyn Saarinen looks around in bewilderment
Pip Torok: i am Stui
Cindy Ecksol: !!
Cindy Ecksol bangs gavel
Arria Perreault: I am too
Cindy Ecksol: STUI!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: you know you are dying to see me again
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Cindy
Cindy Ecksol: IF you want to have another meeting, please move to suspend discussion now…and someone needs to second
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but this is part of the discussion
Cindy Ecksol: THEN move to schedule another meeting…and someone needs to second
Arria Perreault: there was a second
StuiChicanne Darkstone: in my eyes
Micael Khandr: who?
Cindy Ecksol: ok….
Arria Perreault: Gwyn
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I do not see the necessity to suspend
Cindy Ecksol: Pip, can I have your motion to suspend again please?
Arria Perreault: I am ready to second too
StuiChicanne Darkstone: when this suggestion is related to the open discussion
Carolyn Saarinen: I did something bad in another life, I’m trapped here forever..
Pip Torok: i propose to suspen the discussion
StuiChicanne Darkstone: it is a way of resolving the issue
Cindy Ecksol: Stui, if we don’t suspend, we need to terminate discussion and vote up or down
Cindy Ecksol: if you want to continue discussion, need to suspend
StuiChicanne Darkstone: but
Cindy Ecksol: no buts!
Cindy Ecksol: let’s do it!
StuiChicanne Darkstone: what about more meetings ?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I always have a but
Micael Khandr: big one
Cindy Ecksol: yes, mor emeetings if we suspend and majority agrees!
Rose Springvale: move to amend th motion to suspend to have it suspend until… then pick a date
Gwyneth Llewelyn: sometimes with two TT
Cindy Ecksol: (and I think they do)
Cindy Ecksol: so let’s do it….
Sterling Troughton: second
Rose Springvale: lol
Jamie Palisades: (no guarantee STui, our LRA has asked to freeze the topic before agreeing to more meetings)
Cindy Ecksol: motion to suspend discussion please?
Rose Springvale: sterling, we dont’ get to vote or move. but hey, its a free for all …
Cindy Ecksol: OR motion to conclude discussion….
StuiChicanne Darkstone: people on the RA are interested in more meetings
Cindy Ecksol: either one is fine with me about now…
Jamie Palisades: you’ve had, ah, three of such motions ::)
Cindy Ecksol: no, Pip withdrew.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: so we should schedule more meetings
Rose Springvale: he offered the motion again
StuiChicanne Darkstone: as we are all here
Cindy Ecksol: other motions are not proper until we suspend or vote
Cindy Ecksol: *sigh*
Mikelo Serevi: I don’t see what the rush is anyway
Cindy Ecksol: ok, Second for Pip’s motion to suspend please?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I’m fine in seconding it.
Cindy Ecksol: thank you!
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Jamie Palisades: 2 then he re-moved at 10:55
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor of suspending?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye, sure…
Pip Torok: aye
Cindy Ecksol: say Aye, opposed say nay
Micael Khandr: nay
Cindy Ecksol: aye
Soro Dagostino: nay
StuiChicanne Darkstone: NAY
Sonja Strom: aye
Joaquin Gustav: nay
Arria Perreault: abstains
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I want more meetings
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That’s the next motion…
Gwyneth Llewelyn: 4-4-1?
Cindy Ecksol: I get 4-4-1 right now…..motion to suspend fails
StuiChicanne Darkstone: the process here sometimes amazes me
Patroklus Murakami sympathises with the LRA
Cindy Ecksol: ok, kids…motion to CLOSE DISCUSSION AND VOTE please!
Carolyn Saarinen: aye, since we seem bogged down in protocol. Why don’t these meetings DO anything anymore
Keila Forager: amazing isn’t the word..LOL
Cindy Ecksol: sigh…
Keila Forager: cartoonish is more like it..hehe
Cindy Ecksol: ah, ok, Caro just voted to suspend….motion carries.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ah
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I prefer just to be sensible
Cindy Ecksol: STUI! motion to schedule another meeting please!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok
Carolyn Saarinen: This is ridiculous
Sonja Strom: I move to vote on the constitutional amendment.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Cindy Ecksol: (wait sonja — motion to suspend just carried)
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I pass a motion to have more meetings about the previous subject
Cindy Ecksol: ok, second for stui?
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Stui
Sonja Strom: oh, okay, sorry – I thought you said it did not carry.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: even though I’m somewhat mystified by the need to do it this way
Cindy Ecksol: all in favor say aye, all opped to more meetings say “nay”
Carolyn Saarinen: more meetings about meetings?
Arria Perreault: aye
Micael Khandr: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Pip Torok: aye
Cindy Ecksol: (another meeting to finish discussion th eamendment)
Joaquin Gustav: aye
Cindy Ecksol: whew!
Cindy Ecksol: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: that was tough
StuiChicanne Darkstone: AYE AYE AYE
Soro Dagostino: aye
Cindy Ecksol: yeah!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: wow, unanimous and all
Cindy Ecksol: ok, when would you like to meet?
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and Nay on this motion and closing and all that mallarky
Carolyn Saarinen: what the Hell WAS that?
Micael Khandr: Later today?
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Micael
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Arria Perreault: we can doddle
Gwyneth Llewelyn is free anyway….
Arria Perreault: I am not free
Gwyneth Llewelyn: sorry, Arria
Cindy Ecksol: 10th or 17th
Cindy Ecksol: shall we doodle?:
Rose Springvale: before the election.
Arria Perreault: yesssssss
Cindy Ecksol: of course…
Joaquin Gustav: I must go sorry, see you later , thank you
Carolyn Saarinen: Not only am I not free, I’m going to start charging for attending these things!
Rose Springvale: thanks Joaquin
Jamie Palisades: Well, either use Cindy’s doodle web tool, or someone move to set it for the 10th or 17th
Micael Khandr: 10th–so moved
Cindy Ecksol thought she was finally done…
Pip Torok: second
Cindy Ecksol: let’s hear “aye” for those who are ok with the 10th….
Cindy Ecksol: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am happy for meetings before the next election
Micael Khandr: aye
Pip Torok: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn is fine with the 10th, so, sure ? aye !
Soro Dagostino: aye
StuiChicanne Darkstone: baa !
Arria Perreault: aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: rofl
Sonja Strom: lol
Cindy Ecksol: thank yo uall
Carolyn Saarinen: Two hours of my life went away and nothing happened! Call a doctor
Cindy Ecksol: concerns of citizens? anoouncements?
Jamie Palisades: thats 7 aye, 1 rofl and 1 baa
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
Rose Springvale: raises hand
Keila Forager: Yes, just one
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Rose Springvale: keila first
StuiChicanne Darkstone: I have watched westminster
Rose Springvale: i’ll wait
Arria Perreault: raises hand
Cindy Ecksol: ok, keila
Keila Forager: Thanks Rose..
Jamie Palisades: are you adjourned? Rose may have announcements
StuiChicanne Darkstone: baaing seems to be the order of the day there
Carolyn Saarinen: Baa-ing or Being
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and you can fiddle your expenses there too
Keila Forager: Mostly about the issue of faction..and any other issues the RA has to deal with..
Keila Forager: Why don’t you send out IM’s or notecards to the citizens and see what they think?? You are supposed to be THEIR representive! And if you don’t know who the citizens are, think outside the box. Look at the citizens in groups, on the tier boxes, on about land tab, at least until you get a list.
Carolyn Saarinen: It’s am Existential crisis
Cindy Ecksol: ok, thanks keila….
Cindy Ecksol: rose?
Rose Springvale: three things
Rose Springvale: first, every member of the CDS government has Blue notice rights
StuiChicanne Darkstone: Pass a motion to wish the RA a Happy STU Year… and saying what fun it has been this term
Rose Springvale: in CDS… and you SHOULD also be in AA to send them notices
Rose Springvale: i’m very discouraged that AA gets overlooked for notification and seemingly everythign else… still not showing up on the portal. but that’s another issue
Arria Perreault: Keila, I ask for a list of citizen for a long time
Rose Springvale: what is a major concern of mine is the lack of due process, particularly in the SC
Keila Forager: Think outside the box guys..
Soro Dagostino: Keila — be careful — you will get elected to this zoo.
Rose Springvale: i would like to see the RA put together a commission to develop procedures for notification and public meetings for ALL branches.. as this issue has been a problem for three years now
Rose Springvale: second
Rose Springvale: We have had several new citizens join in the last month
Keila Forager: I’m not in a faction
Rose Springvale: hopefully you all will make an effort to meet them.
Rose Springvale: third
Carolyn Saarinen ponders The Wasp Option
Rose Springvale: the Coptic church has, as we knew it would
Rose Springvale: left the project upon purchase of their own sim
Mikelo Serevi: how are factions getting overlooked?
Rose Springvale: we are all invited to come see them in their new home, see me for a landmark.
Keila Forager will be quiet for a bit
Mikelo Serevi: Don’t notices go out to citizens?
Jamie Palisades: (not if they are not sent, Mikelo)
Rose Springvale: done
Keila Forager: and not if you don’t have them go to email or aren’t in world to see them
Pip Torok: yes Mike, but not specifically soliciting their concerns or POV’s
Patroklus Murakami: could we encourage former AA citizens to join the CDS group? then they would get the notices?
Rose Springvale: remember there are limits on factions as per email contact.
Rose Springvale: there are 342 members of the AA group
Rose Springvale: only about 150 in cds
Rose Springvale: when LL opens up groups, we can, until then
Rose Springvale: just send duplicate notices
Rose Springvale: or give them to someone who will.
Arria Perreault: can we have only one group for CDS. I thought we had merged.
Keila Forager: LOL, open up groups..laughs until falling on the floor..hehe
Rose Springvale: it isn’t practical
Jamie Palisades listens, trying to find Rose’s three points
Patroklus Murakami: why not encourage ppl to join the CDS group in order to receive messages? is there a problem with doing that?
Rose Springvale: especially until after july
Carolyn Saarinen: The AA group is far bigger than CDS
Cindy Ecksol also listening for points and waiting to close the meeting so she can drive across alligator alley
Keila Forager: why CDS group??
Keila Forager: AA has more members, merge to that one..
Rose Springvale: i believe they were all invited, but many already are at capacity
Arria Perreault: the CDS group is for CDS citizen
StuiChicanne Darkstone: we cannot dissolve AA
StuiChicanne Darkstone: if we do so
Keila Forager: and not enough groups
Keila Forager: I’m maxed out
Rose Springvale: what is wrong with duplicate notices? takes 10 seconds
Arria Perreault: if AA want to have a group for the events, it’s something else
Carolyn Saarinen: Get an alt?
Patroklus Murakami: so what, the CDS group is for CDS notices. if u want to receive them, join the group and drop another one
Sonja Strom: AA is a part of the CDS, not the other way around.
StuiChicanne Darkstone: what happens in the event of possible demerging ?
Arria Perreault: did we merge or not?
Cindy Ecksol: there are other option….but how about we debate them at another time?
Jamie Palisades: AA has a large number of theme-interest people. CDS has MORE than citizens, also includes theme-interest people
Jamie Palisades: rose, that was your point 2?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, there is not a “citizen’s group”
Cindy Ecksol: or after the meeting is adjourned?
Rose Springvale: then we should ask all cds people and all aa people to drop the group and create an AACDS group.
Keila Forager: I have an alt, but doesn;t do any good if it’s not inworld
Micael Khandr: But AA is in a “test” period as part of CDS–in July, maybe we won’t be . . .
Rose Springvale: if we “merge”
Soro Dagostino: Have to go, cooking brunch — see you all . . .
Arria Perreault: CDS group is for CDS and AA is a part of CDS …
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie: [11:07] Rose Springvale: second
[11:07] Springvale: We have had several new citizens join in the last month
[11:07] Springvale: hopefully you all will make an effort to meet them.
Keila Forager: Bye Sors
Keila Forager: Soro
StuiChicanne Darkstone: and also you run a risk of leaving people recieving group messages about cultural stuff of which they have no interest (i.e Spam) and spam is a leading cause of people leaving groups
Cindy Ecksol: must run also….someone else can officially adjourn
Cindy Ecksol: bye all!
Micael Khandr: move to adjourn
Patroklus Murakami: bye cindy
Sonja Strom: bye Cindy!
Micael Khandr: second
Arria Perreault: I have an announcement too
Micael Khandr: all in favor dsay baaa
Micael Khandr: Sorry Arria
Gwyneth Llewelyn would like to hear Arria’s announcement first…
Sonja Strom: Just let her say it…
Jamie Palisades: Thanks all Arria?
Micael Khandr: Please, Arria–justy joking . . .
Arria Perreault: it’s not related to the RA. The Monastery is pleased to announce the opening of its new exhibition: Angels
Arria Perreault: come to visit
Carolyn Saarinen: falling asleep, move/vote to adjourn….
Sonja Strom: second
Micael Khandr: Aye
Sonja Strom: aye
Arria Perreault: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye …
Sonja Strom: Thanks everybody for being here!